HPL Guitar Bodies

[Guitar_stringer]

I'm not one to throw rocks at other makers, but I believe this is a poor choice of material for a guitar. Better to just use plastic or carbon fiber to begin with, and call it a day. There are other woods out here, that are more suitable than this, imo.

[bobb]

Personally, if I want formica on an instrument, I'll buy another pedal steel. The 'mica' is merely a thin veneer applied to the body for cosmetic purposes only.

[djuna]

Yeah, this is the one thing Martin does that I totally can't get behind--if I'm going to spend $500 on a guitar, I want wood. Solid wood.

 

I'm not even really sure why they make these--is it a matter of wanting a totally inert material so you don't have any mantainence issues? If that's the case, I'd think they'd be better off going the carbon-fiber route--I'm sure Martin could come up with something really cool that would be worth a look.

[HD28HLA]

"...Do they make 'em with solid tops?.."

 

Yes. That information is readily available.

 

"..$500 is a lot to pay for a camping guitar..."

 

Then don't pay it.

 

"..I'm not one to throw rocks and other makers, but I believe this is a poor choice of material for a guitar.."

 

Stop throwing rocks, then. When you are a leading manufacturer, in business for over 175 years, and building and selling 70,000 guitars a year, you'll probably be too busy to throw rocks at anybody.

 

"...I'm not even really sure why they make these..."

 

Duh! I'm sure it's just a hobby. (hint)Why did Ford, GM, and Chrysler make the many, many thousands of cars that are sitting unsold on dealer lots? Martin's business model seems to be hold up somewhat better than these companies.

 

Every time HPL comes up on this forum, Martin takes a beating. I guess it's just a lot easier to criticize than to do a little research; I know I was critical of them when I first saw an HPL guitar. Having played and loved Martin Guitars for over 25 years, at the time, I thought it was a travesty and that Chris Martin must be a maniac. Then I read up. I learned that traditionally used tonewoods, Rosewood, Big Leaf (Honduran) Mahogany, and various species of Spruce, are rapidly becoming scarce and it won't be long until they become prohibitively expensive and harder to find. If you're making a few hundred or even a few thousand guitars a year, that may not be such a big deal. If you're making 70,000 a year, that's a huge deal. I also learned that Martin had an interest in the lower end of the market in addition to the rest of the market (in which they're still doing quite well, by the way). Even with the economies of scale, Martin found it impossible to put out a lower-end, solid wood guitar, built to their quality standards that would still be price competitive. Enter HPL.

Another theme that often comes up here is that somehow, by selling HPL guitars, Martin is tainting it's reputation as the standard by which others are measured, that somehow, their ability to produce some of the finest instruments ever built is compromised because not all of their guitars are made out of traditional materials. I'm fortunate to have a 15 Series, 2 Standard Series, and 1 Vintage Series Martins, all built since Martin added HPLs to the line. Without exception, their build quality, fit, and finish compare favorably to Martins of any era. Each one has it'd own voice but they all have the Martin signature tone and when playing out, they all receive complements from the players in the audience.

So go ahead and berate HPL and criticize Martin for using it.

I opted for getting the facts.

 

Bud

[Guitar_stringer]

 

"...Do they make 'em with solid tops?.." Yes. That information is readily available. "..$500 is a lot to pay for a camping guitar..." Then don't pay it. "..I'm not one to throw rocks and other makers, but I believe this is a poor choice of material for a guitar.." Stop throwing rocks, then. When you are a leading manufacturer, in business for over 175 years, and building and selling 70,000 guitars a year, you'll probably be too busy to throw rocks at anybody. "...I'm not even really sure why they make these..." Duh! I'm sure it's just a hobby. (hint)Why did Ford, GM, and Chrysler make the many, many thousands of cars that are sitting unsold on dealer lots? Martin's business model seems to be hold up somewhat better than these companies. Every time HPL comes up on this forum, Martin takes a beating. I guess it's just a lot easier to criticize than to do a little research; I know I was critical of them when I first saw an HPL guitar. Having played and loved Martin Guitars for over 25 years, at the time, I thought it was a travesty and that Chris Martin must be a maniac. Then I read up. I learned that traditionally used tonewoods, Rosewood, Big Leaf (Honduran) Mahogany, and various species of Spruce, are rapidly becoming scarce and it won't be long until they become prohibitively expensive and harder to find. If you're making a few hundred or even a few thousand guitars a year, that may not be such a big deal. If you're making 70,000 a year, that's a huge deal. I also learned that Martin had an interest in the lower end of the market in addition to the rest of the market (in which they're still doing quite well, by the way). Even with the economies of scale, Martin found it impossible to put out a lower-end, solid wood guitar, built to their quality standards that would still be price competitive. Enter HPL. Another theme that often comes up here is that somehow, by selling HPL guitars, Martin is tainting it's reputation as the standard by which others are measured, that somehow, their ability to produce some of the finest instruments ever built is compromised because not all of their guitars are made out of traditional materials. I'm fortunate to have a 15 Series, 2 Standard Series, and 1 Vintage Series Martins, all built since Martin added HPLs to the line. Without exception, their build quality, fit, and finish compare favorably to Martins of any era. Each one has it'd own voice but they all have the Martin signature tone and when playing out, they all receive complements from the players in the audience. So go ahead and berate HPL and criticize Martin for using it. I opted for getting the facts. Bud

 

 

I don't know who pissed in your corn flakes this morning, but lighten up. This is a discussion forum, and the merits of HPL are being discussed.

[Cheezeweggie]

Sounds like "Bud" got the facts alright... Now stop being so critical so he can sleep well tonight.

[djuna]

I really don't know why people get all worked up about someone not liking a Martin product--you'd think someone called your mother something uncharitable.

 

Someone plays a Martin with an HPL body and they think it sounds like crap, so what? If you think it sounds great, that's fantastic. It's merely an opinion, and this is, as someone upthread mentioned, a discussion forum, where opinions come fast and loose.

[Melodeous]

 

I really don't know why people get all worked up about someone not liking a Martin product--you'd think someone called your mother something uncharitable. Someone plays a Martin with an HPL body and they think it sounds like crap, so what? If you think it sounds great, that's fantastic. It's merely an opinion, and this is, as someone upthread mentioned, a discussion forum, where opinions come fast and loose.

 

 

Brand loyalty. It isn't a bad trait but it can be blinding. I read about Martin's ecological efforts and it's commendable. I can't pull the rug out from under that for my own selfish reasons. But, I also have to say that HPL could have been something else entirely. Making carbon fiber guitars can't compete with HPL because that stuff is really nasty to work with, labor intensive and brings on a whole new fabrication set-up and training scheme. It's also a greater health hazard. Formica in a less rigid compound can easily be applied to their product line without additional training or new equipment. It's plug-and-play - pun intended - so no down time was incurred. From a manufacturing standpoint it was the cheapest material readily adaptable to their processes. Next up would be instrument grade plywood (aka laminate) like all the other makers use who make laminate-embodied instruments. That's the rub I have. Martin has chosen to use Formica and cloak it with another name. I suppose they had to. Who'd buy a guitar marketed as the new Formica-series?

 

One thing I would like to get off my chest is this so-called Martin signature sound thing. Wazzat?

[Grant Harding]

I'm thinking of making a jumbo out of drywall. Do you think the fire resistant stuff will give more of that "magic dust" sound?

[Guitar_stringer]

I'm thinking of making a jumbo out of drywall. Do you think the fire resistant stuff will give more of that "magic dust" sound?

 

LOL at this.

[kimona]

I was thinking of making an acoustic guitar out of plexi-glass. I wonder what the sound qualities would be like?

[Guitar_stringer]

Kinda transparent? :poke:

[kimona]

 

Kinda transparent? :poke:

 

 

Touch