More touring fallout

[Poker99]

http://thecynicalmusician.com/2010/07/more-touring-fallout/

 

 

Wasn’t so long ago that I wrote about the problems Imogen Heap was experiencing on the road and – wouldn’t you know it – now it seems everyone’s having the same problem. Tours are being curtailled right and left. Name a hot touring item and chances are they’ve dropped some dates. The Jonas Brothers and ‘American Idol’ are but the latest examples. Others include the Lilith tour, Christina Aguilera, the Eagles, Limp Bizkit and Rihanna. This year looks to have the Summer of Dreadful Touring. Touring is, of course, subject to the same cycles as the rest of the economy. Some years are just worse and the effects of the current recession shouldn’t be underestimated. However, the present situation raises further questions as to the long-term viability of live performance revenue as a primary source of income for musicians. If you’ve had some experience with the recording industry or studied how it works, you’ll know that there’s an art to scheduling new releases. You have to account not only for what your label is putting out, but also for your competition’s plans, not to mention the state of the market at the moment. Can you compete against all the other stuff coming out around Christmas? Will your release fall in the cracks because all your fans were on holiday? A successful release requires careful planning. Touring isn’t too different; if anything the situation’s worse. A competing high-profile release might steal your promotional thunder, but a major competing gig might very well steal your actual fans. This can happen directly, when you find yourself playing the same night as someone else, or indirectly, when your fans find their concert budgets exhausted by other shows scheduled for the same period. Tour overheads being what they are, it is often better to cut your losses and cancel some dates than play at all costs, in venues filled to a fraction of their capacity. All this is nothing new. The problem is that these days the need to tour has become more pressing than ever. You can no longer afford to take your time, ride it out on your advance until the time is right to tour. At this point, playing live is one of the few things that still pay – naturally everyone wants to milk it for all they can. Unfortunately, it is all too easy to kill your audience. I’ve mentioned it in passing with regards to an artist’s local following – you can only play so often in a given place before even your most rabid fans get bored. You can get away with more frequent appearances if you change your set often, but that rests on the assumption that you have the material and time to prepare it. With the old promotional cycles, you’d have a new album between tours. These days, you’re likely to have new recordings once you’ve scraped up enough money to make them. If it happens that you’re scraping this money while touring, you may find yourself caught in a downward spiral. Once again it’s all about expectations and a realistic assessment of the situation. Depending on what you do, you might find that these problems don’t really apply – a friend of mine who plays shanty-pop in Warsaw pubs and the like has no problem drawing crowds any day of the week. Then again, his thing is playing music to get drunk to. He gets paid fixed sums either way. The original artist with a more selective appeal, on the other hand, is banking on support from her core audience. Can the money she gets from playing live cover her touring costs, her living costs and the cost of new recordings? It might, but you’d need luck and a lot of cost-shaving (which will probably be to the detriment of the music). It looks like the idea of live revenue replacing recorded music revenue is turning out to be yet another iteration of the Hunt for the Big Dope. Are we surprised?

 

[BlueStrat]

Hey, don't you know, recorded music needs to be free because bands make all their money touring?

 

And yet, we in the Inland Northwest get 3 day stints by Dave Matthews at the Gorge Amphitheater every stinking year like clockwork. Go figure.:facepalm:

[[Animals2]]

Hey, don't you know, recorded music needs to be free because bands make all their money touring? And yet, we in the Inland Northwest get 3 day stints by Dave Matthews at the Gorge Amphitheater every stinking year like clockwork. Go figure. :facepalm:

 

So true... Fortunately I've never made it out there for that, but I hear its a great environment for napping.

 

 

Tom Petty on the other hand...

[Dancebass]

I was discussing this at home the other day. People bitch about fees and such being added to ticket prices, but that's just the tip of the iceberg really.

 

It's society itself that's changed in the last 25 years making what was once a fun experience more and more difficult to enjoy.

 

Ticket prices are too high for teenagers.

Parents are much more restrictive on kids these days for safety reasons.

$10 more bucks to park when you get there.

Concession prices are out of this world once they have you trapped.

No smoking rules. (this does effect a large number of would be concert goers)

Stunning abuse of DUI for generating revenue for strapped cities.

Generally rude and uncivilized people that make up the U.S. population.

 

 

People would just prefer to stay home rather than suffer through all this for today's moderately successful acts.

[richardmac]

Supply and demand. Music is the opposite of scarce - people have thousands of songs in their pockets now. You can hear any song by any artist anywhere you happen to be (slight exaggeration but you get the point.) As a result, music is no big deal any more. And you want me to pay $85 to see some mediocre artist?

 

Interesting point about teenagers not having the money. I wonder how much money teenagers have, actually. I recall getting $10 per week allowance as a teenager in 1982. So two weeks allowance would basically pay for gas money plus a concert ticket plus a six pack. I don't know what a teenager gets for allowance these days. But to get the same experience it would have to also include parking. We never paid for parking at concerts.

 

I like BlueStrat's point about how people think touring is supposed to make up for the lack of sales. So how is an artist supposed to make a living? Damned if I know, that's why I do something else for a living and do music for fun.

 

BTW, the "Inflation Calculator" says that $10 in 1982 is worth about $22 in 2009. So the $12 concert ticket in 1982 should cost about $25 now, not $50 to $80. But a record that cost me $8.99 in 1982 now costs me $9.99 on iTunes. Before people debate these numbers, I freely admit that I am not an economist and I do not know what the hell I am talking about. Then again, maybe neither do most economists.

[Dancebass]

 

So the $12 concert ticket in 1982 should cost about $25 now, not $50 to $80.

 

 

Not only that, but think about what you got for that $12 ticket?

 

I'm not saying that one way is better than the other, but the minimalist approach these days isn't going to give kids the same bang for their buck they got in 1982!

 

Think about how HUGE those arena productions really were. Iron Maiden and such. CRAZY!! Kids love that stuff!

[Kramerguy]

DMB is like fingernails on a chalk-board to me. Just thought I'd get that off my chest.

 

So, unemployment still at 10%, rich getting richer and poor getting poorer. I'm personally drowning in red ink.

 

I don't think anyone in my shoes is wondering why tours are also suffering. If you are a rocket scientist, you won't get it. This is a understanding only a "digital Janitor" like myself, or other low-paying {censored}ty job holder truly seems to understand.

[flatfinger]

My nephew has a decent amount of income ... Goes straight into game systems. like Wi. online all the time doing PC games in real time ( headset and all ).

 

Only shows his face outside of his room at mealtime . No time to go out and see someone play an instrument; Plenty of time to play "guitar hero"

[Bare Bones]

As someone who goes to shows all the time, I think Live Nation and poor judgement has a lot to do with it.

 

This is primarily happening in arenas, where has-been or reunited bands are trying to sell $100+ tickets. Many of the smaller venues are regularly selling out for up and coming and constantly touring bands.

 

When I hear things like "oh my god, the American Idol tour is canceling dates", I think it's more of being a poor product vs. kids not wanting to go out and see a show. Same with Lillith (bands that were popular in '98), the Eagles (granted they're popular, but many tix were going for several hundred dollars), and artists like Aguilera who have been replaced by the Lady Gagas of the world.

 

Hey, don't you know, recorded music needs to be free because bands make all their money touring? And yet, we in the Inland Northwest get 3 day stints by Dave Matthews at the Gorge Amphitheater every stinking year like clockwork. Go figure. :facepalm:

 

I went to Sasquatch over Memorial Day and loved it (other than poor venue management). Pretty damn amazing location for live music.

[BlueStrat]

Good points.

 

And yes, the Gorge is a great place to see a show! You may have bumped into one of my sons there during Sasquatch.

[Bare Bones]

 

Good points. And yes, the Gorge is a great place to see a show! You may have bumped into one of my sons there during Sasquatch.

 

 

Wouldn't doubt it, at 34 I felt really old - yet I can't let that stop myself from seeing great live music (there's a song in there somewhere).

[michael_B]

So how is an artist supposed to make a living? Damned if I know, that's why I do something else for a living and do music for fun.

 

Frankly, I don't think people care if artists make a living or not.

 

 

hey, do you have 10,000 songs in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?

[3shiftgtr]

Why go to see live music when you can buy a cool app from the band for your phone?

 

To the younger audience, there is no difference.

[Ronan Murphy]

I really think insane ticket prices and fees are one of the biggest problems (as well as anything that goes into mandating those prices).

 

I just did an experiment to see what it would cost to take my girlfriend to see Lady Gaga. I just told ticket master I wanted best seats they had. Total came out to US $402.30. Upper concourse came out to $204.90.

 

This is absolutely insane. It would be tough to pay those price for a reunited Led Zep with John Bonham in the band. If concerts were 25-30 bucks all in, I would go see them a lot. I do not really even like Lady Gaga, but for 25 bucks I might go out and see the show out of curiosity.

[soundwave106]

This is absolutely insane. It would be tough to pay those price for a reunited Led Zep with John Bonham in the band. If concerts were 25-30 bucks all in, I would go see them a lot. I do not really even like Lady Gaga, but for 25 bucks I might go out and see the show out of curiosity.

 

15-30 bucks is about the price range of more "second tier" / alternative / up-and-coming / etc. acts these days (excluding ridiculous service fees). I'm looking at ticket prices for upcoming shows at the smaller venues in this town, and the outlier here is Flaming Lips at $40; most are around the range I mentioned.

 

Yes, as someone mentioned before, these venues do sell out shows, sometimes surprisingly quickly.

 

Not every band has $100+ tickets. Frankly, many of the bands with the $100+ tickets are either has-beens or commercialized gloss, crappy stuff compared to the bands playing for $25 at the smaller venues. I suppose that's how the smug hipster attitude starts, comfortable in the knowledge that they are getting good music value for their money.

[flatfinger]

THere was a news snippet on MSNBC saying that Disney land is going to raise admissions prices later this year ... Prices always go up . Lots of recent events ( last years real estate bubble pop and such ) make you wonder if we will continue to have a vigorus middle class or if it's back to the middle ages were it's a top and bottom only ..

 

What do you think , my serf peeps !!!!

[bdemon]

Parents are much more restrictive on kids these days for safety reasons. $10 more bucks to park when you get there.

 

Ten bucks? Try $30 to park when I saw Metallica in Oakland CA last year. I've vowed never to go there again...and since that's where the Raiders play I see no problem.

[sabriel9v]

 

People would just prefer to stay home rather than suffer through all this for today's moderately successful acts.

 

 

I agree, I feel it's this and we're also experiencing the music business and all its setbacks during a recession. I'm certain that cd and physical music sales will remain done, but people will start getting out and about once the jobs and money is in the bank. I don't think "low" tour numbers will be a long term facet of the industry.

[Blackwatch]

I think the real problem is that for many of the kids coming up it's easier to bury yourself in a computer or I Phone than to go out and meet with people or see live music ......not to mention the cost....