Members ak47dragunov Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 I've been listening to lots of 80's hair metal (Dokken, Ratt, Scorpions etc.)and I've noticed that many of these shred-guitarists are sorely overlooked and possessed great talent, such as George Lynch of Dokken, Steve Lynch of Autograph, Uli Jon Roth, Michael Schenker of the Scorpions etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ferdinandstrat Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 You are actually right. Most of the techniques we know nowadays are actually from the 80's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cold Gin Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 What makes you think Uli Jon Roth, Michael Schenker, George Lynch are underrated??? :poke: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Burningleaves Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 There was a lot more Rock N' Roll attitude going on as well. Having fun, playing music,good time feel, etc. Not much of that these days.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Help!I'maRock! Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 nobody is ever underrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DaveAronow Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 These players always get a bad rap lately, but I have a feeling alot of it is out of jellousy. Thius was the end of an era where most of the big names were players that spent YEARS woodshedding for many hours a day honing their techniques and musical ability, including their ears, to hopefully be the best guitarist that ever lived. It was just the thing back then. Every guitar player wanted to be "THe best" and there was alot of competition. It is funny, when I firsdt started posting here, to find out how unpopular alot of these players were around here, and then when I saw the listed examples of players that nowadays peoiple think are great, alot of them are of the same calibre of guys that wouldnt have even been able to get gigs in bar bands back then. It seems the trend of actually trying to master your craft died at the end of the 80's, and then it became more about attitude, energy, and the "feel" of the song with alot of disreguard for actual play ability. I litterally have seen HUNDREDS of GREAT guitar players before, that would blow away Most peoples heros here, but they were mostly around doing their thing in the 80's and their kind of music has been left behind by a new sound. Nothing wrong with it, but thge level of individual musicianship has dropped by 75% in my opinion compared to what it was back then. I am not talking about the songs they wrote, or the things they chose to sing about, yeah, anything gets old sopunding after awhile, but when you are talking about the ability to play absolutely anything you want to on the spur of the moment, including some serious technical things, I think the 80's players had the highest concentration per capita of guys that could do things that simply just cant be done without loads of talent, and years and years of hard studying, practice, woodshedding, and giging themselvesf into an extremely well oiled guitar playing machine. And anyone that thinks Eddie Van Halen didnt have a HUGE impact on this trend, and wasnt one of the most influential(did not say best) guitarists to ever live, either completey has their head burried in the sand, or was simply not around in the music scene back in those days. There were always the micro musical communities that rebelled against the trends back then, and they might try to deny what I say is true, but those people and their little isolated groups were the extreme exceptions and not the rule.t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cold Gin Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Uli Jon Roth was never like those other hair metal guitarists. He is unique, he is a phenomenon and a giant. I have never heard anyone say something bad about him. Respect to Uli!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members benzem Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Are underrated yes, i agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Wankmaster Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 guitar virtuosity and how good a song is inversely proportional to me the more mindless shredding in song to me just means the vocals arent as memorable/catchy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members csm Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Underrated -- except by nostalgic shredheads. DaveA, I love you and I would unhesitatingly jump into traffic to save you if you fainted crossing the road -- but 'jealousy?' *Roger Rabbit voice* PHHHHHHLLEEEEESE! I'm jealous of lots of stuff (including Steve Cropper's groove, Jimmy Nolen's funk, Peter Green's soul, Albert Collins's explosiveness, BB's float-like-a-butterfly-sting-like-a-bee thang, Pete Townshend's dynamics, Keef's .... tiMING!, Albert King's switchblade attack, Wilko Johnson's slice-and-dice, Tom Morello's freaky imagination, Johnny Marr's texture, Johnny Ramone's ramalama, Gilmour's lyricism, Jeff Beck's unique sensibility, SRV's muscularity, Hendrix's EVERYTHING), but the only 80s players whoever did anything for me* came from opposite ends of the decade: EVH for his exuberant pyrotechnics and Slash for his guts and commitment to almost every song he played. The rest of 'em ... fuhgeddaboudit! I'm just amazed that you -- a smart, sensible and soulful guy -- would drag out that old 'jealousy' argument as a rebuttal to those who might be critical of empty, gaseous widdling masquerading as real, meaningful soloing. I don't wanna get this thread dropkicked into The Political Party -- where the REAL nutjobs hang gibbering from the trees throwing their feces at opponents both real and imaginary -- but this is the kind of argument that should be left to Republican bloggers. I repeat, Dave: I love you REALLY. We will undoubtedly resume full relations when the election is over and this nostalgic flirtation with the hairsprayed, spandexed shredders of the Reagan/Thatcher era has run its natural course. *EDIT: I'm unfair here to The Edge (The Soundscaper General), Vernon Reid (shred meets funk meets new jack harmolodic jazz in a post-Jimi parallel universe) and Robert Cray ... but I guess they're not the kind of 80s players you head in mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Burningleaves Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 nobody is ever underrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ESchmidt Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 I agree with you. I especially think the Phil Collen/Steve Clark duo were the perfect fit and very underrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DaveAronow Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Underrated -- except by nostalgic shredheads. DaveA, I love you and I would unhesitatingly jump into traffic to save you if you fainted crossing the road -- but 'jealousy?' *Roger Rabbit voice* PHHHHHHLLEEEEESE! I'm jealous of lots of stuff (including Steve Cropper's groove, Jimmy Nolen's funk, Peter Green's soul, Albert Collins's explosiveness, BB's float-like-a-butterfly-sting-like-a-bee thang, Pete Townshend's dynamics, Keef's .... tiMING!, Albert King's switchblade attack, Wilko Johnson's slice-and-dice, Tom Morello's freaky imagination, Johnny Marr's texture, Johnny Ramone's ramalama, Gilmour's lyricism, Jeff Beck's unique sensibility, SRV's muscularity, Hendrix's EVERYTHING), but the only 80s players whoever did anything for me* came from opposite ends of the decade: EVH for his exuberant pyrotechnics and Slash for his guts and commitment to almost every song he played. The rest of 'em ... fuhgeddaboudit! I'm just amazed that you -- a smart, sensible and soulful guy -- would drag out that old 'jealousy' argument as a rebuttal to those who might be critical of empty, gaseous widdling masquerading as real, meaningful soloing. I don't wanna get this thread dropkicked into The Political Party -- where the REAL nutjobs hang gibbering from the trees throwing their feces at opponents both real and imaginary -- but this is the kind of argument that should be left to Republican bloggers. I repeat, Dave: I love you REALLY. We will undoubtedly resume full relations when the election is over and this nostalgic flirtation with the hairsprayed, spandexed shredders of the Reagan/Thatcher era has run its natural course. *EDIT: I'm unfair here to The Edge (The Soundscaper General), Vernon Reid (shred meets funk meets new jack harmolodic jazz in a post-Jimi parallel universe) and Robert Cray ... but I guess they're not the kind of 80s players you head in mind. I didnt single you out, or any specific individuals as examples. Sure there are a ton of people that are legitimate in their reasons for not appreciating some of the great guitar players of the 80's and can cite reasons why, like you have. But I have seen it with my own eyes, from back then, and even to this day, people that bash the crap out of some of those really great players, that dismiss their abilities because they dont have the frame of context or frame of reference to do it themselves, considering that they would want to. I used to hang out in the bars, in bands, in music stores, in garages, in rehearsal spaces, also alot of my friends were3 guitar teachers, and just anywhere there was guitar playing and music and I would watch watch player after player, get discouraged trying to play like the technically accomplished players of the 80's, bands that they loved for years, that they seem to turn on only AFTER they try unsuccessfully to play on a level that even scapes the very bottom of some of the better players ability. Most of these players ended up playing blues. Not because it was their first choice, or something that they truely loved at first, but because, after trying and failing to play what they really loved, they realized there were easier styles of music to make sound reasonably well with minimal effort and input. I am not talking in general, I am talking about people I have actually, met and seen. Yes, I probably have met and known a few thousand guitar players in my whole life. I could probably name a few hundred that I have talked to just in the last coupl;e yyears, and that is AWAY from harmony central. I know alot of musicians. This statement is not ment to bash Blues playersor blues music either. Some of the best players in the world are blues players. It is just meant to say that alot of beginning or even frustrtated players that I have seen, end up taking to blues, because it is easier for them to make pleasing music for them alot quicker than they could with the more technically involved playing of alot of 80's guitar music. I am not expressing a theory here. I am more like a reporter relating what I ahve seen and experienced over and over again, so many times in my life, that it is not jsut a theory. And it definitely doesnt include individuals that truely stick to what they love and would naturally pl;ay anyway, such as you and i am sure alot of people you know, but the guys I am taklking about are out there. By the thousands. I have seen them with my owjn eyes. And by the way, I LOVED the movie, "Who Framed Roger Rabbit". Also, I am not a rabid 80's fanboy. It is one of the LAST generas I go out of my way to play, or to listen to these days, or for even about the last 15 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ferdinandstrat Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Underrated -- except by nostalgic shredheads.DaveA, I love you and I would unhesitatingly jump into traffic to save you if you fainted crossing the road -- but 'jealousy?' *Roger Rabbit voice*PHHHHHHLLEEEEESE!I'm jealous of lots of stuff (including Steve Cropper's groove, Jimmy Nolen's funk, Peter Green's soul, Albert Collins's explosiveness, BB's float-like-a-butterfly-sting-like-a-bee thang, Pete Townshend's dynamics, Keef's .... tiMING!, Albert King's switchblade attack, Wilko Johnson's slice-and-dice, Tom Morello's freaky imagination, Johnny Marr's texture, Johnny Ramone's ramalama, Gilmour's lyricism, Jeff Beck's unique sensibility, SRV's muscularity, Hendrix's EVERYTHING), but the only 80s players whoever did anything for me* came from opposite ends of the decade: EVH for his exuberant pyrotechnics and Slash for his guts and commitment to almost every song he played.The rest of 'em ... fuhgeddaboudit! I'm just amazed that you -- a smart, sensible and soulful guy -- would drag out that old 'jealousy' argument as a rebuttal to those who might be critical of empty, gaseous widdling masquerading as real, meaningful soloing.I don't wanna get this thread dropkicked into The Political Party -- where the REAL nutjobs hang gibbering from the trees throwing their feces at opponents both real and imaginary -- but this is the kind of argument that should be left to Republican bloggers.I repeat, Dave: I love you REALLY. We will undoubtedly resume full relations when the election is over and this nostalgic flirtation with the hairsprayed, spandexed shredders of the Reagan/Thatcher era has run its natural course.*EDIT: I'm unfair here to The Edge (The Soundscaper General), Vernon Reid (shred meets funk meets new jack harmolodic jazz in a post-Jimi parallel universe) and Robert Cray ... but I guess they're not the kind of 80s players you head in mind. Nostalgic shredheads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JC777 Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 3 of my favorite guitarists came out of that era. George Lynch. He's way more than just a shredder. He got some soulful, tasty licks. Warren De Martini. He was unfairly lumped with a lot of lesser talent rehash jockeys. And Jake E Lee. Whatever you think of Jake. He unmistakable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members robbyg Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Never heard of Vernon Reid..thanks for heads-up. Totally different musical flavor . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lukeswall Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Whenever I see a big haired shredder burning it up, I can't help but think how much time he put into it and how useless it became for mainstream music after 1991. I'm not a shred fan by any stretch, but I do admire them for what they could and can do.and Vernon Reid is a follower. Dr. Know taught him how to do it. Bad Brains is such a horribly underrated band. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JoJo68 Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 I grew up in the 80's and I dug slot of those guys.I really like jake e lee I liked Lynch too.I just got sick of the Van Halen clones.Can't stand Nuno or Vito Bratta.Didn't care for the hair cheese rock guys.Love the Schenkers,Blackmoore etc.Warren DeMartini was horrible in 84 when i saw him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members robbyg Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 now utubing dr know... no funk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scott944 Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Love Jake E. Lee (and many of the others listed, esp. George Lynch). Check out a Badlands record - unmistakeable tone, great tunes, great playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Yngtchie Blacksteen Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Michael Schenker was the perfect rock guitarist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lukeswall Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 now utubing dr know... no funk He tends to be of a heavier orientation, since the Bad Brains started out as a punk band, but the funk inffluence is there. not on all songs, of course. b41sR6dJ8AE 2snWGhjQZXg and they were a Reggae band 1/4 of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members noisebloom Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 And Jake E Lee. Whatever you think of Jake. He unmistakable.That's absolutely true. One time I was listening to some band on online radio, and I thought the guitar player reminded me of Jake E. Lee -- but I wasn't at the computer to see who it was at that moment.Sure enough, it was Badlands -- and I can't remember ever hearing them before that. I was impressed, not only that I had recognized his playing, but also because he still sounded like himself. Jake may not be considered one of the greats, but he was definitely no cookie cutter player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ferdinandstrat Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Michael Schenker was the perfect rock guitarist. He died? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DaveAronow Posted October 31, 2008 Members Share Posted October 31, 2008 Whenever I see a big haired shredder burning it up, I can't help but think how much time he put into it and how useless it became for mainstream music after 1991. I'm not a shred fan by any stretch, but I do admire them for what they could and can do. and Vernon Reid is a follower. Dr. Know taught him how to do it. Bad Brains is such a horribly underrated band. I dont think it became useless. The actual skills and abilities these guys learned lend themselves tremendously to really, playing any and all styles of music. The problem is, that most of them were unwilling, or uninterested in adapting, or exploring new types of sounds, and types, or generas of music, and God love them, for remaining true to what they believe, but they also have to be willing to accept that the rest of the world didnt want to stay there with them, so it is their own fault if they are miserable because they consider themselves washed up has beens, when they choose to stay there themselves. all they would have to do is open their minds and maybe explore some other styles, and then all those skills and abilities, and more importantly, their expert abilities to learn, and they could be just as effective in any other style they want to. I think one of my points in my posts here, is that going in the opposite direction, taking an accomplished guitarist in alot of other genera, and making him on a par with some of the best 80's guitar players, would not generally be as easy to do, this considering, yoiu started with someone that actually WANTED to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.