Please explain Zildjian A vs. K.

[tdempsey]

Hi,

I'm a bass player who has taken up drums.

I just bought my first real hihats, Zildjian A Mastersounds 14" for $265 this weekend and wonder where the "A" product line fits in to Zildjian's classes of products.

 

I choose them cause I thought they sounded best in the store; I went in figuring I would buy New Beats but the Mastersounds just sounded better to me.

 

Any advice is appreciated.

 

Thanks!

 

Tim

[ArtVandelay]

Both the A and K (and Z) lines are top top-end Zildjians. The Z lines consists of heavier cymbals for loud volume situations. The K line tends to go the opposite direction from the Z. They are hand-hammered, thinner cymbals and are generally warmer sounding with less cutting attack. The A line tends to be brighter than the K and, while the K line tends to be more suited to lighter applications, the A line is more general purpose.

 

Now, take what I wrote above and ignore it. Generalizations about cymbals are a trap. Many jazzers play As and many rockers play Ks. Just because you (the general "you", not you specifically) play jazz or funk, you shuoldn't rule out anything from the A line. And Heavier players should still consider Ks. I played a pair of 13" K Custom Dark Hihats is a pretty loud power-pop trio.

[tdempsey]

Art -

Thanks for the info, and I appreciate the disclaimer!

[drmrdude]

 

Originally posted by ArtVandelay Both the A and K (and Z) lines are top top-end Zildjians. The Z lines consists of heavier cymbals for loud volume situations. The K line tends to go the opposite direction from the Z. They are hand-hammered, thinner cymbals and are generally warmer sounding with less cutting attack. The A line tends to be brighter than the K and, while the K line tends to be more suited to lighter applications, the A line is more general purpose. Now, take what I wrote above and ignore it. Generalizations about cymbals are a trap. Many jazzers play As and many rockers play Ks. Just because you (the general "you", not you specifically) play jazz or funk, you shuoldn't rule out anything from the A line. And Heavier players should still consider Ks. I played a pair of 13" K Custom Dark Hihats is a pretty loud power-pop trio.

 

 

 

Didnt Lars play a K ride on the St. Anger DVD?

[BWD]

Originally posted by drmrdude Didnt Lars play a K ride on the St. Anger DVD?

 

I'm not sure about that, but I do believe he did use all K's on the recording of the last album.

[Fr!tz]

 

Originally posted by drmrdude Didnt Lars play a K ride on the St. Anger DVD?

 

 

Yah,

I just saw it on vh1....

 

 

BTW his snare sounds like crap in that movie:(

 

I play a 20" k custom dark ride and also play A custom 16"fast crash and 6" flash splash....(and a couple others not top shelf) and yes as Mr. Vandelay pointed out both lines can be played for any type of music. A's are brighter and seem to have less sutain than the K's.

[dRUMMERgIRL27]

 

Originally posted by fritzgog13 Yah, I just saw it on vh1.... BTW his snare sounds like crap in that movie:( I play a 20" k custom dark ride and also play A custom 16"fast crash and 6" flash splash....(and a couple others not top shelf) and yes as Mr. Vandelay pointed out both lines can be played for any type of music. A's are brighter and seem to have less sutain than the K's.

 

 

Aren't the K series the top line? Followed by

A customs

A

then Z's?

[Fr!tz]

Originally posted by dRUMMERgIRL27 Aren't the K series the top line? Followed by A customs A then Z's?

I don't think any one is better than the other they are all top shelf cymbals. I think it's a matter of different types for different aplications. ( dark, bright, fast, long sustain ect.)

[ArtVandelay]

Originally posted by fritzgog13 I don't think any one is better than the other they are all top shelf cymbals. I think it's a matter of different types for different aplications. ( dark, bright, fast, long sustain ect.)

 

Exactly.

[BWD]

Originally posted by BWD I'm not sure about that, but I do believe he did use all K's on the recording of the last album.

I just saw the dvd, and I saw 2 K crashes and a K splash. His hihats were Sabian though.

[Old Steve]

Once again, I think "price" confuses the issue a little bit. K's tend to be more expensive than A's not because the quality is any different, but because of the extensive hand hammering done to them. Anytime you increase the labor cost of something, the price will be higher. Kind of the whole "lacquer vs. wrap" thing...lacquered finishes aren't "better" they just cost more because it's a much more complicated finishing process.

[BATCAT]

 

Originally posted by Old Steve Once again, I think "price" confuses the issue a little bit. K's tend to be more expensive than A's not because the quality is any different, but because of the extensive hand hammering done to them. Anytime you increase the labor cost of something, the price will be higher. Kind of the whole "lacquer vs. wrap" thing...lacquered finishes aren't "better" they just cost more because it's a much more complicated finishing process.

 

 

I'm not so sure regular K's are still hand-hammered.

 

(but I might be wrong)

[dRUMMERgIRL27]

 

Originally posted by Old Steve Once again, I think "price" confuses the issue a little bit. K's tend to be more expensive than A's not because the quality is any different, but because of the extensive hand hammering done to them. Anytime you increase the labor cost of something, the price will be higher. Kind of the whole "lacquer vs. wrap" thing...lacquered finishes aren't "better" they just cost more because it's a much more complicated finishing process.

 

 

That would make sense. I don't like the K crashes as much as the A Custom crashes, but I've heard people say that the K's are the top of the line. People who normally seem to have some knowledge on gear.

[Old Steve]

 

Originally posted by dRUMMERgIRL27 That would make since. I don't like the K crashes as much as the A Customs, but I've heard people say that the K's are the top of the line. People who normally seem to have some knowledge on gear.

 

 

The original K's from back in the day WERE among the most coveted cymbals. The modern K's use the same basic formulas and techniques. So basically they are "top of the line" for what they are....there's just a lot of "top of the line" cymbals nowadays, and many "top lines" in each manufacturer's lineup.

 

A jazz player is more likely to identify with K's as "top of the line" whereas a speedmetal player is more likely to think of Z's as "top of the line".

[Jlliu59]

just started using A-customs... They sound awesome. K is still my favorite ride though

[locust tree]

i've never heard a crash cymbal that sounded better than the K Custom Dark crash.

[drmrdude]

 

Originally posted by BWD I just saw the dvd, and I saw 2 K crashes and a K splash. His hihats were Sabian though.

 

 

 

Are you sure? Because I thought he used Z Custom Mastersounds or something. BTW I was talking about the DVD that comes with the St. Anger CD. Not Some Kind of Monster, but I just saw it the other day and it looks like the same set-up.

[rca]

Zildjian is a family name. The original K's (as in either Konstantinople or Mr. Kerope Zildjian-I have heard it told both ways) were an informal name for Zildjian cymbals imported from Turkey and distributed exclusively by Gretsch. They were hand hammered and very inconsistant. Gretsch and K's were associated with jazz drummers like Elvin Jones. His K cymbals were always great because he would pick out the best ones. American made Zildjians were informally called A's (as in "Avedis Zildjian" trademark stamped on each cymbal) distributed by Slingerland and associated with jazz drummers like Buddy Rich and Gene Krupa. Later the American Zildian family bought the right from the Turkish family to exclusive use of the Zildjian name in the US and started making their own formally named K line of darker cymbals which are not normally hand hammered. At the same time, Zildjian formally started calling their original line Zildjian A's. Sabians are a spin off of Zildjian's Canadian operations when the company was split in two by the Zildjian family. Sabian is a word formed by taking two letters from each of the owner's three kid's first names. Sabian has continued to make similar cymbals since the spin off.

[Jlliu59]

 

Originally posted by rca Zildjian is a family name. The original K's (as in either Konstantinople or Mr. Kerope Zildjian-I have heard it told both ways) were an informal name for Zildjian cymbals imported from Turkey and distributed exclusively by Gretsch. They were hand hammered and very inconsistant. Gretsch and K's were associated with jazz drummers like Elvin Jones. His K cymbals were always great because he would pick out the best ones. American made Zildjians were informally called A's (as in "Avedis Zildjian" trademark stamped on each cymbal) distributed by Slingerland and associated with jazz drummers like Buddy Rich and Gene Krupa. Later the American Zildian family bought the right from the Turkish family to exclusive use of the Zildjian name in the US and started making their own formally named K line of darker cymbals which are not normally hand hammered. At the same time, Zildjian formally started calling their original line Zildjian A's. Sabians are a spin off of Zildjian's Canadian operations when the company was split in two by the Zildjian family. Sabian is a word formed by taking two letters from each of the owner's three kid's first names. Sabian has continued to make similar cymbals since the spin off.

 

 

great history lesson... I didn't know

[tdempsey]

 

Originally posted by Jlliu59 great history lesson... I didn't know

 

 

 

+1 Bravo rca!