Members e021708 Posted June 18, 2009 Members Share Posted June 18, 2009 I quess that means the correct pitch for what you are singing. But, I was wondering, how often you might purposely not just sing on pitch with the root note, but rather on the 3rd or 5th or something else when singing solo... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nuclear arsenal Posted June 18, 2009 Members Share Posted June 18, 2009 i only sing songs with one note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DHmusic Posted June 18, 2009 Members Share Posted June 18, 2009 I don't usually worry about matching a particular note in the chord, I just make sure it blends.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Surrealistic Posted June 18, 2009 Members Share Posted June 18, 2009 I don't usually worry about matching a particular note in the chord, I just make sure it blends....Exactly. I almost never think about music in technical terms when playing or writing. I might when producing a recording. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jersey Jack Posted June 18, 2009 Members Share Posted June 18, 2009 I quess that means the correct pitch for what you are singing. But, I was wondering, how often you might purposely not just sing on pitch with the root note, but rather on the 3rd or 5th or something else when singing solo... I think I'm missing something here: The assigned pitch of a given note is not identical to the root note. The pitch is determined by the melody, the root note is determined by the harmony--the key and chord structure. It is very common for melodies to linger at the third, the fifth, etc. of the root scale. Perhaps you're using the phrase "root note" to indicate the melody note? :idk:Then the question would be whether we ever deviate deliberately from the melodic line established by the songwriter. Is this correct? If so, yes, I believe singers do this all the time, sometimes in very subtle ways (as when a blues singer hits a note flat, then slides into the correct pitch) and sometimes in very unsubtle ways (witness the latest Pop Diva over-stylizing the Star Spangled Banner at the latest sports extravaganza). Playing with melody is definitely an important expressive tool, but it can be easily over used, which becomes at times both disrespectful to the songwriter and a unmistakable sign of a singer too full of himself (or herself). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members e021708 Posted June 18, 2009 Author Members Share Posted June 18, 2009 I think I'm missing something here: The assigned pitch of a given note is not identical to the root note. The pitch is determined by the melody, the root note is determined by the harmony--the key and chord structure. It is very common for melodies to linger at the third, the fifth, etc. of the root scale. Perhaps you're using the phrase "root note" to indicate the melody note? :idk:Then the question would be whether we ever deviate deliberately from the melodic line established by the songwriter. Is this correct? If so, yes, I believe singers do this all the time, sometimes in very subtle ways (as when a blues singer hits a note flat, then slides into the correct pitch) and sometimes in very unsubtle ways (witness the latest Pop Diva over-stylizing the Star Spangled Banner at the latest sports extravaganza). Playing with melody is definitely an important expressive tool, but it can be easily over used, which becomes at times both disrespectful to the songwriter and a unmistakable sign of a singer too full of himself (or herself). Great explanation. I understand clearly there is a melody line for a song. And, sometime you might just play a chord structure (sometimes a simple one). But, often the chords and riffs one plays do match the melody line. I also do as explained above try to blend the voice and trust my ear but, lately my voice coach has been complimenting me on my very good pitch control. And that made me feel good. However, I have never really tried to analyze my singing pitch when I sing and play the acoustic like I may do when practicing scales, etc. I have always just trusted my ear to make it blend based the melody line in my head and it seems to work. But, lately I have actually started to stop in the middle of songs and try to better understand technically what note I was singing vs the chord / note on the guitar and seeing if it sounded better trying to go up a octave or a 3rd or something else and then I start to second guess my self because often I do not even know or think about it. Anyway, I think I may have just opened a bag of worms, As an engineer I often get into something and analyze it too much. I may just leave this alone and try to just go back to trusting my ear.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fishmanrod Posted June 18, 2009 Members Share Posted June 18, 2009 I agree with Jersey Jack.I also think your idea of analysing what you are doing is great (I'm an engineer too, we are SUCH nerds...) but at the same time trusting the feel is OK.Perhaps only try to fix it when you think it is broken? In other words, complete the analysis if you think it is not working. If it IS working, why rip it apart?I suppose Unless you are trying to understand what is working to apply it somewhere else, I would just let it feel right! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SevenString Posted June 18, 2009 Members Share Posted June 18, 2009 I will often perform songs from 80s metal artists, adapted to the acoustic. Usually, I leave the vocal melody (mostly) alone, but I will often change how the chords are played, simply because in a lot of old metal, the vocal part closely matches the chords, as you are describing, and without all of the metal histrionics of a full band, it can come across as kind of boring. So by changing the voicing of the chords a bit, or by messing with the rhythmic structure, or by playing "power chords" as arpeggios with added 3rds and 9ths, I end up getting a performance that doesn't really sound like an old metal song anymore, and has a more obvious contrast between the vocal and guitar parts. So I guess what I'm saying is, if you have a vocal part that you are comfortable with, and that you thing sounds good as-is, you might try looking at it from the other directing and altering the guitar part, to break out of that obvious "following the chords" sound to the vocals. Just some ideas to think about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Wilton Said... Posted June 18, 2009 Members Share Posted June 18, 2009 I quess that means the correct pitch for what you are singing. But, I was wondering, how often you might purposely not just sing on pitch with the root note, but rather on the 3rd or 5th or something else when singing solo... As someone earlier stated, most pop music have melodies which gravitate to the root, 3rd and 5th and that's because in a regular major or minor chord, they are the only notes present. However, jazz music can be a whole different matter as the harmony can often include 7th, 9th, 11th, 13th, augmented and diminished notes. Depending on how they're played either solo on guitar or piano, or within the context of a band, can determine how strong the pull of these additional harmonies can be. In jazz, it's not uncommon for the bass player to play the root while the guitar or piano leave out the root. Depending on what instrument the singer is focusing on, can determine what note they gravitate to. For me, I purposely composed some of my vocal melodies to gravitate towards 7th and 9th to try and do something different, a little more jazzy. It can be difficult to sing at first especially if none of the other instruments are playing the note which I'm singing. Wilton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Terry Allan Hall Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 I think I'm missing something here: The assigned pitch of a given note is not identical to the root note. The pitch is determined by the melody, the root note is determined by the harmony--the key and chord structure. It is very common for melodies to linger at the third, the fifth, etc. of the root scale. Perhaps you're using the phrase "root note" to indicate the melody note? :idk:Then the question would be whether we ever deviate deliberately from the melodic line established by the songwriter. Is this correct? If so, yes, I believe singers do this all the time, sometimes in very subtle ways (as when a blues singer hits a note flat, then slides into the correct pitch) and sometimes in very unsubtle ways (witness the latest Pop Diva over-stylizing the Star Spangled Banner at the latest sports extravaganza). Playing with melody is definitely an important expressive tool, but it can be easily over used, which becomes at times both disrespectful to the songwriter and a unmistakable sign of a singer too full of himself (or herself). Absolute agreement...vocal gymnastics are cool, but, like hot spices in cooking, a little goes a long way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dthraco Posted June 22, 2009 Members Share Posted June 22, 2009 I quess that means the correct pitch for what you are singing. But, I was wondering, how often you might purposely not just sing on pitch with the root note, but rather on the 3rd or 5th or something else when singing solo... Alot of it has to do with style too. When I started singing I studied some of my favorites. Some of them really like the 3rd, others the root. As long as you are in key you are good. Also think of it like intervals. How does each interval played with the root impart a feeling? Happy sad, anxious? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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