Members sub5ound Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 There is this funk/rock band I gig with about 5 times a year. Two guys are from Brooklyn, one is from Cali and the dj/turntable-ist is from Philly. I had known the guitard for a while when he was lining in NY and we hit it off musically a few times at some open mic's. Actually, at the time, for two duded who never met, we kicked {censored}in' ass. That was about 8 yrs ago. About 3 yrs ago I ran into him and he told me the bassist from his band was leaving and would I like to be their new one. At the time, my little girl had just been born and I was into a project that had light commitment levels, being that I was in a "full time" cover band. The first gig or so went pretty good, got paid and was confident that this was something I could really dig a few times a year......but things changed. The last few gigs have been horrible. Now, I know I can hold my own with the material but it seems like just about evryone else (except the sax guy) cant! The drummer is all over the place with tempo and his dynamics, the guitarist (who I always thought was pretty good...outgrew him maybe?) just plain noodles...going so far as to play it behind his back. Every jam they want to go into seems to be in E and more often that not the guitard starts the classic cliched 7th vamp...ugh... The thing is this: I never thought of myself as a band leader, but these guys have showed me how to be one out of necessity! By the third set, I have to develop a groove, lead them through it, out of it and try to stay awake AND keep from throwing my bass at the drummer because of his tempo shifting. When the gigs are done, it's "Thanks, man! Holy {censored} you are funky! Thanks for those blahblah..." I am really a humble guy by nature but these guys make me feel like Willie Weeks every time I play with them. I'm gonna inform them at the next gig that I am done.... Should I tell them why or just tell them I don't have the time (5 times a year!)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Funkee1 Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 There is this funk/rock band I gig with about 5 times a year. Two guys are from Brooklyn, one is from Cali and the dj/turntable-ist is from Philly. I had known the guitard for a while when he was lining in NY and we hit it off musically a few times at some open mic's. Actually, at the time, for two duded who never met, we kicked {censored}in' ass. That was about 8 yrs ago. About 3 yrs ago I ran into him and he told me the bassist from his band was leaving and would I like to be their new one. At the time, my little girl had just been born and I was into a project that had light commitment levels, being that I was in a "full time" cover band. The first gig or so went pretty good, got paid and was confident that this was something I could really dig a few times a year......but things changed. The last few gigs have been horrible. Now, I know I can hold my own with the material but it seems like just about evryone else (except the sax guy) cant! The drummer is all over the place with tempo and his dynamics, the guitarist (who I always thought was pretty good...outgrew him maybe?) just plain noodles...going so far as to play it behind his back. Every jam they want to go into seems to be in E and more often that not the guitard starts the classic cliched 7th vamp...ugh... The thing is this: I never thought of myself as a band leader, but these guys have showed me how to be one out of necessity! By the third set, I have to develop a groove, lead them through it, out of it and try to stay awake AND keep from throwing my bass at the drummer because of his tempo shifting. When the gigs are done, it's "Thanks, man! Holy {censored} you are funky! Thanks for those blahblah..." I am really a humble guy by nature but these guys make me feel like Willie Weeks every time I play with them. I'm gonna inform them at the next gig that I am done.... Should I tell them why or just tell them I don't have the time (5 times a year!)? Most horrible feeling ever. I can't stand carrying the band. I'd much rather play with people who are equal contributors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members In Absentia Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 I see it as an opportunity. If I have more experience than the guys in the band, I find ways to get my point across about doing things different. Trying to get everyone to care about the band is the most important thing. If they aren't going to practice and get better, then it is time to quit. Every band I've ever been in has broken up when we quit getting better. Maybe this one has hit that wall, maybe not. Still it is worth trying to make it work, and getting these guys to learn something new might be what you want to do. I also find that having a goal to work towards is the great motivator. Usually a recording, a small run of gigs, or a full-blown regional tour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members restart Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Burning bridges...bad. It's a small world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jonjohn Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Burning bridges...bad. It's a small world. Very true. Let them down nicely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bleepo Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 My last band... When I joined, I was replacing someone with the apparent skill of a toddler. It turned out, the rest of them were mental migets as well. They didn't have a proper PA, they sang through either a bass or guitar cab. This wasn't awful, just amatuerish in my eyes. When the singer was turfed, Mrs. Bleepo came in. I bought a proper mixer/PA bins/mic for her. We wanted to write. I had dabbled in recording in the past, so we (mrs. bleepo and I) picked up an interface and some more mics. We played exactly 1 show with mrs. bleepo. I vowed never to go back after that. Why? The PA was being abused when I wasn't in the room. The mixer needs a proper servicing to this day. Writing? No thanks. Let's do covers today. And tomorrow. And how about for that show? I joined an all original band, btw. There was a full set of material. Recording what we're working on? Sounds great. I'd arrive an hour early, set up all the mics (7 drums, direct guitar and bass, vocals from an aux) and get levels. The drummer either wouldn't show up, or would be drunk. From the times we did record, it was obvious how bad his kit was. no front skin, broken snare. Skins as old as he was. The guitar player was more interested in posing during rehersal than execution. He couldn't even remember parts. Wouldn't practice. Remember those covers they wanted to play? they'd pick 3 songs. I'd learn 3 songs. He'd learn none. Finally, against the bleepo's will we played a show. All covers, but what the hell. I've played hundreds of shows, what's one more? I set up the PA and got levels esentially alone. I say alone, mrs. bleepo is a great assistant. Show time comes, we start to play. Guitar player didn't like his amp at the volume it was, so he turned it up, and rotated it. Whatever. I don't care anymore. I'll just make it through. Next thing I know, the drummer's friends show up (late) and miss a song that he wanted them to hear. So he insists on playing it. Again. I reason with him that lets at least put it in the second set. He bitches and complains, but agrees. During the break he decides it's time for his friends to play his drums. I pull them off. We play our second set, and again, the guitar player has turned up. Great. I mentioned it to him during the break, he totally agreed with me that he was too loud. 10 mistakes from the guitar player later, the set is done! The drummer disappears, and guitar player sits with his friends. It's too early to strike the PA as the room still has people in it, but we're at the end of the time we're allowed to play until. Strict orders. I go for a cigarette. The drummer has reappeared, drunkas{censored}. He asks the manager if we can play one more song. She says no. We had until 11. It's now 11:30. His answer: Extended drum solo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bnyswonger Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Life is too short to spend playing with a crappy drummer. Ditto other musos. Just as playing with very good players will raise your game, playing with poor ones is worse than not gigging at all IMO. You're better off laying low until the right thing comes along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lingua latina Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 The bad drummer part is almost unforgivable. I was going to suggest that you continue to take this opportunity to hone your leadership skills, which it still is- but a bad drummer, I think I might have to let them down gently, as said above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Funkee1 Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Life is too short to spend playing with a crappy drummer. Ditto other musos. Just as playing with very good players will raise your game, playing with poor ones is worse than not gigging at all IMO. You're better off laying low until the right thing comes along. ^^This.^^But the "Burning bridges" comment is correct also. Be nice, and try to remain friends whenever possible! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bluedogaudio Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Every band I've had to carry I ended up quitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jackcheez Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 I wouldn't play with a band that I had to carry. I have been in a few casual situations however... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Renfield Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Every band I've had to carry I ended up quitting. I guess I have a bigger mouth that you. I usually voice my concerns when there is a brutually obvious weak link like a bad drummer in the group. More often than not it becomes a "me versus him" situation and the band takes sides. When he has more friends than me, I get fired before I can quit. I like that outcome better. This way they carry on with said crappy member, and he continues to drag them down with him, where I just move on to a better band. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bluedogaudio Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 I guess I have a bigger mouth that you. I wouldn't say that. I'm very blunt when it comes to these types of situations. The problem is these type of musicians rarely change, so I just end up leaving. It's usually not a big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sugarskull Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 5 times a year is not enough to keep the band glued together. It sounds like they're just simply lost. If it's not working, ditch it. I wouldn't necessarily mention anyone's talent or anything, it would be pointless to have to bring that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members collinwho Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Once upon a time, I played a couple shows with a female singer songwriter. Her recorded stuff was really good, but she just didn't have it together as a person. She couldn't remember her own song structures, or chord changes. She wouldn't make set lists, which isn't necessarily a problem, but she also wasn't capable of calling out songs on the fly. At one point I told her I would never play with her again until she got her act together. She claimed she practiced a ton for this final show, but it was the same old story. I walked out on them it was that bad. Of course, I was banging her, so she had that going for her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Renfield Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 I wouldn't say that. I'm very blunt when it comes to these types of situations. The problem is these type of musicians rarely change, so I just end up leaving. It's usually not a big deal. True, I once handed a (now ex) drummer a metronome for practice and he said he couldn't play along with it, they {censored}ed him up too much to follow. I just ruffle feathers too much and get tossed before I can quit. I'm ok with that when this is the caliber of drummer they are standing up for by firing me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Renfield Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Of course, I was banging her, so she had that going for her. I love a story with a happy ending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members collinwho Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 I love a story with a happy ending. Even that could have been better... she needed a life coach just as much as she needed a music class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Renfield Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Even that could have been better... she needed a life coach just as much as she needed a music class. Well, you got a few happy endings out of it at least I am sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sugarskull Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 She couldn't remember her own song structures, or chord changes. She wouldn't make set lists, which isn't necessarily a problem, but she also wasn't capable of calling out songs on the fly. I have a master list with all the songs on it with arrangements and lyric notes and keys I bring to every single gig in case we need extra tunes or someone calls out for something that isn't on the set list. Every singer who is dyslexic like me or has any type of learning disability needs one. The idea that every performance is a high school final exam is crazy. You do NOT have to do everything completely from memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members collinwho Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 I have a master list with all the songs on it with arrangements and lyric notes and keys I bring to every single gig in case we need extra tunes or someone calls out for something that isn't on the set list. Every singer who is dyslexic like me or has any type of learning disability needs one. The idea that every performance is a high school final exam is crazy. You do NOT have to do everything completely from memory. I agree. But there are those who are aware that they don't remember set lists (like myself) and write it down so that they will be ready, and those who just show up and hope things work out even though they have no clue what they are doing. She was very much the latter. Personally, I don't know that I've ever done a set where I got all the lyrics correct. I can improvise fairly well in that area so it isn't a big deal, but I've definitely gotten things wrong before. She was the type that would forget lyrics and just umm-mmm-hmmm until she could remember something. Make at least some effort to appear that you know what is going on, you know what I mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kpax Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 I prefer to play in bands that carry me. Great players are more fun to gig with, in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Renfield Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 The idea that every performance is a high school final exam is crazy. You do NOT have to do everything completely from memory. SO true. When I used to use a rackmount multi effects, the patch names were labeled after the song and part they were to be used for. But I still wrote the patch number beside every song title on my set list. I could recite them from memory in a drunken stupor, but I still had them written on it anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Renfield Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 Make at least some effort to appear that you know what is going on, you know what I mean? Too true. I have bad short term memory problems, yet still was astounded that I'd have to nod to our drummer at virtually every single chorus of every song to tell him when to switch parts because he was completely incapable of counting to 4 for himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sugarskull Posted November 19, 2009 Members Share Posted November 19, 2009 I agree. But there are those who are aware that they don't remember set lists (like myself) and write it down so that they will be ready, and those who just show up and hope things work out even though they have no clue what they are doing. She was very much the latter.Personally, I don't know that I've ever done a set where I got all the lyrics correct. I can improvise fairly well in that area so it isn't a big deal, but I've definitely gotten things wrong before. She was the type that would forget lyrics and just umm-mmm-hmmm until she could remember something. Make at least some effort to appear that you know what is going on, you know what I mean? Totally. That was kind of my point, but I don't think I typed it out properly. If a person can't improvise like you can, write the crap down! Haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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