Why???

[oldman2]

Hello1
:poke: U was 2 loud. like rhat said the man paying you was right.
I was not there and it might not have been loud to U or the patrons ..... but the man paid so was boss.
I too have left bars because the" BAND " was too loud . Ever go into a place that might hold 125 people but has a stage full of gear to play an arena.
Small clubs/bars do not need 10,000 watt Pa systems.
I can set up 4 systems from 75 watts per side to 5000 per side with my gear.
I learned many years ago to play at levels for the room or gig. I am a drummer that is often set up behind the backline just because of the stage area. when playing I look for clues from band and audience. I have friends in the venue that I check with on breaks etc. I am too damned old for ego to get in the way. I want to enjoy when I play but I want the people to enjoy the experrience too.
Some people just want to bitch and MAYBE the man was just an asshole but
He be the man with the money. Try not to burn your bridges...... What if 2 or 3 yrs from now Your BAND is the bigtime {censored}....You have this Hot venue you want to play ....... Oh! {censored} it's Asshole.
Just my 2 cent worth
Oldman2

[Steadfastly]

You might wanna get out of the people business then.

 

 

I agree. If the owner says turn it down, then, turn it down. And if your drummer is too loud, tell him to do the same; turn it down.

[Electric Catfish]

Did you guys miss the part where the OP did turn it down?

Three times?

[Steadfastly]

If more folks were paying to get into your show, he wouldn't have to pay you with a check. You seem to think that your opinion is some sort of standard. You know what "too loud" is??? Could it be that you have your opinion, which may be different than others'? Opinions can only be held. Facts are "known". HTH.

Just because he has cash on hand doesn't mean he'll pay you in cash. I prefer being paid by cheque. I think it's more professional. It doesn't make you look so "Fly by Night". Just my opinion which may be different than others and likely is, but then again, I'm very opinionated.

[BigMac5]

Just because he has cash on hand doesn't mean he'll pay you in cash. I prefer being paid by cheque. I think it's more professional. It doesn't make you look so "Fly by Night". Just my opinion which may be different than others and likely is, but then again, I'm very opinionated.

have you ever been burned with a bad check?

[Electric Catfish]

Just because he has cash on hand doesn't mean he'll pay you in cash. I prefer being paid by cheque. I think it's more professional. It doesn't make you look so "Fly by Night". Just my opinion which may be different than others and likely is, but then again, I'm very opinionated.

I can't think of a single real advantage to being paid with a check vs. cash.

I can, however, think of a few advantages to being paid in cash. What looks "fly by night" about accepting cash as payment, anyway?

Never mind that the check/cash thing was just a joke/jab at rhat to start with.

[Ivoredone]

: when playing I look for clues from band and audience. I have friends in the venue that I check with on breaks etc. I am too damned old for ego to get in the way. I want to enjoy when I play but I want the people to enjoy the experrience too. Some people just want to bitch and MAYBE the man was just an asshole but He be the man with the money. Try not to burn your bridges...... What if 2 or 3 yrs from now Your BAND is the bigtime {censored}....You have this Hot venue you want to play ....... Oh! {censored} it's Asshole. Just my 2 cent worth Oldman2

 

 

We always have friends at the venue too, they said the sound was fine from the start. Yes I want to enjoy when I play and I want people to enjoy the experience too, thats what music is all about. My point is that the people did enjoy the experience, and they put the money in the tills.

 

As a band we have a decent following, and have no track record of being too loud. I don't think we have a God given right to be praised by anyone let alone the person who is paying us, but i do expect some common decency, or at least some constructive criticism from someone who has, regardless of his opinion of us/our volume/our abilities as musicians, just made a lot of money because of us.

 

In terms of burning bridges for the future; I spoke to the band who played at the bar the week before us, they have been together for six or seven years, their sound was ok apparently (further proof that we were too loud maybe?), but they played to 15 people (yes they counted) including the bar staff so maybe it's the bar manager burning the bridges not us.

 

In terms of hitting the big time we're all advancing in years and playing a set of covers so we are probably more likely to be retired in three years than hitting the big time!

[Steadfastly]

have you ever been burned with a bad check?

 

 

Yes and it was replaced so no money was lost. There is the odd time when I want cash because I know the person is untrustworthy. You always have the choice. In my personal opinion, I think a cheque is more businesslike.

[Electric Catfish]

In what tangible, concrete way is there a real advantage to a check?

[rhat]

In what tangible, concrete way is there a real advantage to a check?

 

 

No real advantage .... typically when you play for a set fee for a corp/ organization/ or municipal entity ,,, they cut a check for the band. Its just the way it works when you work for those kinds of customers. Hey cash is cool.... you split it up ,, and forget you did the gig. generally people who write checks to the band need to keep records. People who pay cash , generally are skimming the hell out of the business and like to deal in cash. Cover charges are in cash.....so if a bar can collect the cover charge pack the bar , ,pay the band ,,, they have a good situation to skim the bar that night and not declare the income....... it all spends...

[wades_keys]

In what tangible, concrete way is there a real advantage to a check?

Bookeeping for folks running their band like a business maybe?

Personally, I prefer cash - {censored} the man

[coyote-1]

Perhaps. But....

Why not just learn to be musicians enough to do it right without all the monkey shines? If they are telling you to turn it down its for a reason. The band doesnt know how to control the volume. Why keep ignoring this reality? I am not trying to be a smart ass or bush your chops ,, but it sounds like you have a major flaw ,,, and it all starts at each members amp volume knob. maybe a little less sound engineer talk and a little more turn the fukin amps down. This is basic stuff .

I've seen club owners who complain about every band. Below a certain volume it is NOT possible to rock, to bring the funk.... such club owners really need to consider not booking ROCK bands. They can book a jazz quartet or something. It's something club owners really ought consider.

[wades_keys]

Perhaps. But.... I've seen club owners who complain about every band. Below a certain volume it is NOT possible to rock, to bring the funk.... such club owners really need to consider not booking ROCK bands. They can book a jazz quartet or something. It's something club owners really ought consider.

 

A band that is "too loud", will be "too loud" in more than one place, that's for sure.

 

Some of the confidence shown in these posts is a good thing IMO - every band needs to know where it stands in terms of relative volume - and if they know they are within limits, then why bend over backwards for some idiot who should not be booking rock bands in the first place?

[Electric Catfish]

No real advantage .... typically when you play for a set fee for a corp/ organization/ or municipal entity ,,, they cut a check for the band. Its just the way it works when you work for those kinds of customers. Hey cash is cool.... you split it up ,, and forget you did the gig. generally people who write checks to the band need to keep records. People who pay cash , generally are skimming the hell out of the business and like to deal in cash. Cover charges are in cash.....so if a bar can collect the cover charge pack the bar , ,pay the band ,,, they have a good situation to skim the bar that night and not declare the income....... it all spends...

Yeah, I know...We've been payed with checks plenty. It's always a pain in the ass splitting the money up, that way. I can still keep records of the cash I make, pay taxes on it, etc., if I want. There's nothing I can do with a check that I couldn't do with cash. The opposite isn't true, however.

I'm talking about advantages to the performer, not the promoter.

It's not as though you can't keep records of cash.

There's nothing inherently more "businesslike" about a check, realistically speaking.

Musicians apparently have a wierd sense of what "businesslike" is. I've never encountered a business that wouldn't accept cash. I've encountered a few that wouldn't accept checks, though. Most businesses aren't very businesslike, I guess.

[rhat]

Yeah, I know...We've been payed with checks plenty. It's always a pain in the ass splitting the money up, that way. I can still keep records of the cash I make, pay taxes on it, etc., if I want. There's nothing I can do with a check that I couldn't do with cash. The opposite isn't true, however. I'm talking about advantages to the performer, not the promoter. It's not as though you can't keep records of cash. There's nothing inherently more "businesslike" about a check, realistically speaking. Musicians apparently have a wierd sense of what "businesslike" is. I've never encountered a business that wouldn't accept cash. I've encountered a few that wouldn't accept checks, though. Most businesses aren't very businesslike, I guess.

yea checks can be tough.. especially when they start getting big. We just used to have them make the check out to a member and he cashed the check ,, and paid out the splits after he got to the bank. you would get paid on tue after a weekend gig. No big deal. Its not like they were gonna screw up with the money. I worked with some pretty solid band members. We never had money issues. rat

[Electric Catfish]

yea checks can be tough.. especially when they start getting big. We just used to have them make the check out to a member and he cashed the check ,, and paid out the splits after he got to the bank. you would get paid on tue after a weekend gig. No big deal. Its not like they were gonna screw up with the money. I worked with some pretty solid band members. We never had money issues. rat

Yeah, same here. We can all trust each other. I'm currently living a couple hours away from 3/5 of our band, though, and another guitarist is an hour or so out. I either have to wait until I'm in town again, or get the money (another check from bandmate, or a money order...more hassle) mailed to me.

For smaller amounts, one of the guys might have enough cash to cover me until the check gets cashed, but, like you were talking about, a lot of the "check" gigs are the better paying ones, so we're all less likely to have the equivalent cash on us.

Checks create a paper trail of their own...which isn't always a good thing.

If you do want a paper trail, though, it isn't hard to make one for cash.

[Steadfastly]

 

In what tangible, concrete way is there a real advantage to a check?

 

 

OK, I get this all the time. "Hey you get a lot of cash. That's great man; you don't have to claim that for taxes. You can just put it in your pocket. People that do that are stealing and while I don't like taxes any better than the next guy, I pay them because taxes do pay for useful things and it's the law. And many people do take cash for many services and never claim it and never get caught. Perhaps you don't often see this, but I see it all the time. I tell people that my conscience does not allow me to do that and even when I get cash I claim everything. I get respect for it. Now, I'm not saying you or everyone does this, but some do and some people look down on it and the people that do it. That there is no reason for people to suspect that my ethics or business practices are not above board is valuable to me. It shows that I have integrity. That is an advantage in my opinion.

[ThreeGutRock]

95% of the time bands get paid, they get paid in cash. At least that's been my experience, and likely the experience of any other band playing in bars or clubs.

[Electric Catfish]

OK, I get this all the time. "Hey you get a lot of cash. That's great man; you don't have to claim that for taxes. You can just put it in your pocket. People that do that are stealing and while I don't like taxes any better than the next guy, I pay them because taxes do pay for useful things and it's the law. And many people do take cash for many services and never claim it and never get caught. Perhaps you don't often see this, but I see it all the time. I tell people that my conscience does not allow me to do that and even when I get cash I claim everything. I get respect for it. Now, I'm not saying you or everyone does this, but some do and some people look down on it and the people that do it. That there is no reason for people to suspect that my ethics or business practices are not above board is valuable to me. It shows that I have integrity. That is an advantage in my opinion.

 

 

 

That's stretching it...There's absolutely no reason that cash can't be claimed for taxes, and the club owners (who accept cash themselves...like every other business in the free world:idea:) know that, too. Not that the guy paying you at the end of the night really gives a {censored} about your tax ethics....

 

For that matter, a check isn't exactly a guarantee that you paid taxes either, unless it's a payroll check that already has them withheld.

[Electric Catfish]

95% of the time bands get paid, they get paid in cash. At least that's been my experience, and likely the experience of any other band playing in bars or clubs.

Seriously....

At least the volume argument made some sort of coherent sense. This thread has taken a VERY bizarre turn.

[wades_keys]

The guy I (and several other bands) rent studio space from, accepts cash all the time for rent, and meticulously records and accounts for all of it.

Not all cash transactions are evil

[wades_keys]

Seriously.... At least the volume argument made some sort of coherent sense. This thread has taken a VERY bizarre turn.

Isn't it strange - the negative connotations associated with cash transactions in the modern age?

On a paranoid note - the gov't is preparing to collect bio-metric information on many members of the public.

I wonder if those that oppose such measures, will be seen as having something nefarious to hide?

Hell - i'll come right out and say it - I love the freedom of cash.

It means I can pay for my drinks, put gas in my car, and not go home piss broke. What's not to love about cash

[rhat]

Isn't it strange - the negative connotations associated with cash transactions in the modern age?

It has been my experience that with a band ,, when they handed us a check ,,, the dollars were always bigger than when the guy handed you cash at the end of the gig. It was a different level of gig. back in the day a cash gig was a 100 bucks ,,, a check gig was 400. Today i would guess a 500 dollar gig might be cash ,,, a 2000 dollar gig would be a check. So ,, from my experience checks were better than cash

[ThreeGutRock]

Like most things that are illegal, the ones that slip through the cracks are the ones that are done most frequently. Bands who aren't getting paid alot get cash because the sum is so small nobody really cares/pays any attention. For a corperate gig, a gig involving an agent, or simply a gig that entails a large sum of money, the taxman begins to have a more keen interest in the transaction.

[Electric Catfish]

It has been my experience that with a band ,, when they handed us a check ,,, the dollars were always bigger than when the guy handed you cash at the end of the gig. It was a different level of gig. back in the day a cash gig was a 100 bucks ,,, a check gig was 400. Today i would guess a 500 dollar gig might be cash ,,, a 2000 dollar gig would be a check. So ,, from my experience checks were better than cash

It's kind of a given that more money is preferable, ultimately...

It's not an absolute that "check gigs" are better money, though. And, even given that they usually are (due to other unrelated circumstances), I'd still rather somebody hand me two grand in cash, as opposed to a two grand check, all other things being equal.

As the argument seems to be check vs. cash (which I still think is kind of strange), all other factors should be assumed to be constant, otherwise the argument becomes about something else. (like volume and bars vs. corporate gigs, for instance.)