Do you guys have a plan for what you want to accomplish??

[sickman]

The band I currently play with is kind of floundering. We play 1-2 times a month and rarely practice. I don't really mind becuase it is a good musicians, good group of guys, no stress, etc. Basically no work. However, I'd like to play more... I'd also like to start singing more so I can have some control over the setlist. At this point, I think I should start going to open jams/open mics in the area. I was looking around last night and discovered there is one close to my house that is lead by a band whose singer/guitarist I met when I first moved up here. I was playing in a band with a friend of his. Unfortunately, his friend quit because he saw before I did the band was going nowhere fast. But, he was an excellent vocalist and someone I would like to work with in the future.

 

Maybe a "plan" at this point is not such a good idea versus just getting out there and singing more. When I first started playing out with bands I would also go to 2-3 jams per week in addition to playing with the band 1-3 times per week. I think it really helped to shape my guitar playing much more than sitting at home and at the jams I was able to meet and play with some excellent musicians. I'm hoping it would do the same in regards to singing.

 

My ideal situation would be three piece with everyone singing. Set up, play, tear down in 5 hours. But, I am really open to anything as long a it is not a waste of my time. I'm just thinking aloud.... and trying to avoid work.

[wades_keys]

 

Maybe a "plan" at this point is not such a good idea versus just getting out there and singing more.

 

Fools gold.

 

How in the hell do you think you're going to meet your objectives without a plan?

 

Ain't gonna happen for ya bro.

 

Get a plan:

start by setting goals.

 

Then break down those goals into objectives or "action items".

Then set priorities on the action items: establish a timeframe for delivery.

Then assign those "action items" to your resources (band members).

 

Management 101 my friend.

 

If you'd like, I can post a document that I put together after our band meeting last week that does exactly what I've described above.

[sickman]

Wades, I would not mind seeing the document.

 

But, with the current band I am playing with my input doesn't carry much weight. I am 20-30 years younger than the rest of the band.

 

I guess the plan at this point should be to try and meet some more like minded musicians, most likely by attending jams, or finding an additional band who needs a guitarist.

[wades_keys]

 

Wades, I would not mind seeing the document. But, with the current band I am playing with my input doesn't carry much weight. I am 20-30 years younger than the rest of the band. I guess the plan at this point should be to try and meet some more like minded musicians, most likely by attending jams, or finding an additional band who needs a guitarist.

 

Dude, I feel your pain.

 

What makes it work for me is that I have corporate management experience, as does the bandleader.

 

We work this way not because it's "businesslike" or "high-falutin", we work this way because we have realized through years of work experience that this kind of structure is actually liberating.

 

Good luck trying to convince blue-collar guys to work this way: they're just not used to working in this fashion and it will seem like "all work" and "no fun".

 

I'll edit this post in a few minutes with a link to the document.

 

EDIT: Here it is

 

https://docs.google.com/Doc?docid=0ASVgjL03zrNiZGhqdjJrYnpfMTJrcTljaHpjaA&hl=en

[sickman]

I will take a look at the document... thanks.

 

What I don't understand is when we do have practice we sometimes bring up how we can't get more gigs. Why do you think this is?? The usual reason is because they can get so many bands to play for $200-250. But, what's seperating us from those other bands? Other than musicianship, which really isn't that important, there isn't anything.

[wades_keys]

 

I will take a look at the document... thanks. What I don't understand is when we do have practice we sometimes bring up how we can't get more gigs. Why do you think this is?? The usual reason is because they can get so many bands to play for $200-250. But, what's seperating us from those other bands? Other than musicianship, which really isn't that important, there isn't anything.

 

Gigs won't come to you.

 

You have to be persistent and have a focus and direction.

 

Stop blaming the other guy and focus on running a tight ship.

[sickman]

Gigs won't come to you. You have to be persistent and have a focus and direction. Stop blaming the other guy and focus on running a tight ship.

 

 

I haven't picked one song on the setlist. I am more a passenger on the ship than the driver. I see myself as more of a "hired gun".

 

Maybe I need to bring this up at the next practice or look into starting my own project. That is what I was getting at one my first post... ie getting out to meet more likeminded musicians. It's not going to happen sitting at home.

[ski219]

We plan songs to learn for the next practice and which version of that song. We plan what and how to promote gig-wise. Our singer does all our booking and we provide him with dates we are not available so everybody can plan their lives. We talk about clubs we want to drop and ones we want to get into.

[Chicken Monkey]

One tip that's served me well is, when you have no idea where you want to go, or no idea how to get there: decide on three things that you can do/start today that will get you a step closer to where you see yourself. So--decide on ten new songs, find a new open mic/venue, and see the top band in town and take notes. Or whatever. When you get those three things done, the next three concrete steps should appear. A long term goal is eventually essential, but at the start, just moving can be good enough.

[Roy Brooks]

I am plotting world domination. Ultimately my goal is to achieve world domination.

[tucktronix]

This is a real pet-peeve of mine. For me, there absolutely has to be a set plan, a goal and an agenda before I wil join any band. I went through this with a soul/funk/jazz band about 8 years ago. We constantly rehearsed, about 2 or 3-times a week. After about a year or so of no gigs, I finally tendered in my resignation. I would've done this earlier, but I was so enormed with the level of musicianship and the material(the drummer was, and still is one of the best drummers I've ever played with) that I got "sucked in":facepalm:

[wheresgrant3]

 

What I don't understand is when we do have practice we sometimes bring up how we can't get more gigs. Why do you think this is?? The usual reason is because they can get so many bands to play for $200-250. But, what's seperating us from those other bands? Other than musicianship, which really isn't that important, there isn't anything.

 

 

 

I dunno... setlist, following, marketing, image, musicianship. There are so many reasons why bands struggle to get gigs, and if any of the above are cuurent challenges then you have some things to work on.

 

Not sure what area of the country you play in, the types of venues you are looking for... but from you're previous posts I can identify just a few challenges you guys have. #1- Age... you say that a majority of players are in the late 40's to 50's. Do they look 40's to 50's? If so it will impact a bit on your ability to score new rooms, most of whom are hoping to please regulars but also attract younger crowds. #2- Setlist I remember was something you talked about. Lots of classic rock... which again leans toward patrons over 40, mostly male. When you call up a bar or venue what are you offering? Just a good band to provide entertainment? What is your competition offering... a gauranteed draw of 20-30 people? Posters, marketing... etc. Yes, there's even competition on the B & C level, mostly because there are fewer rooms to offer bookings. When I look at the bands in my market strictly playing bars, many have gone from gigging 3-4 times a month to 1-2x's a month. That's not out of a desire to do so... there's just too many bands and a lot less venues than a few years ago.

 

Although it pains me to think that even a bar paying a band for $250 is thinking about risk, I can also say that they are certainly not a quality venue to start. They probably could care less if you came in with a 5 piece Kazoo band, as long as they made money and had a good night.

 

Given the age and demographic you guys play to there may be some alternative venues that you wouldn't think of. Moose Clubs, Elk's Lodges... etc. I'm not saying this in jest. A good friend of mine has been playing a regular $700 gig at the Knights of Columbus. The crowd is blue collar, war vets and mostly male, but they pack the place and the night is a huge event. Mostly classic rock with some 90's alternative mixed in. They could fight for $350 for a local bar, or get $700 playing the Knights of Columbus. What's the better gig?

[SpaceNorman]

I've known guys to write "business plans" and formal goals documents for the bands ... and I can say with certainty that I'm not quite that anal about it. I do however have a mental "short list" of prioritized next steps in each major facet of the band. This pretty much caps the list these days:

 

Playlist: Learn only "current" material

PA: Repair wheels on FOH Rack. Go through all cables - test, repair/replace as necessary

Marketing: Finish new demo audio and video. Create Gigmasters page

Keyboard Rig: Win Lotto - Upgrade Amp rig to new QSC K12's, Pick up a new AX Synth Keytar

Personal Playing; Make time for at least an hour of playing - 6 days a week - outside of any band rehearsals.

 

I work from detailed project plans, timelines and schedules all day, every day at work. While the discipline is effective - there's just not that much going on in my music world to make formal plans necessary.

[wades_keys]

 

This is a real pet-peeve of mine. For me, there absolutely has to be a set plan, a goal and an agenda before I wil join any band. I went through this with a soul/funk/jazz band about 8 years ago. We constantly rehearsed, about 2 or 3-times a week. After about a year or so of no gigs, I finally tendered in my resignation. I would've done this earlier, but I was so enormed with the level of musicianship and the material(the drummer was, and still is one of the best drummers I've ever played with) that I got "sucked in":facepalm:

 

That mirrors an experience of mine almost to a tee.

 

In my case, the guitarist is truly a world-class player - probably the best hard-rock lead guitarist in this region.

[wades_keys]

 

Given the age and demographic you guys play to there may be some alternative venues that you wouldn't think of. Moose Clubs, Elk's Lodges... etc. I'm not saying this in jest. A good friend of mine has been playing a regular $700 gig at the Knights of Columbus. The crowd is blue collar, war vets and mostly male, but they pack the place and the night is a huge event. Mostly classic rock with some 90's alternative mixed in. They could fight for $350 for a local bar, or get $700 playing the Knights of Columbus. What's the better gig?

 

 

Grant, you took the words right out of my mouth.

 

These are exactly the types of gigs my band is doing: VFW halls, riverside deck bars, bike night events.....

[qcb79]

I've known guys to write "business plans" and formal goals documents for the bands ... and I can say with certainty that I'm not quite that anal about it..

 

Hey I resemble that remark, I do have a "business plan" written out, not that it's actually working but at least theres some type of goal to shoot for.

 

just to outline the plan...

areas we want to play (radius from home)

type of music

type of gigs (bar,private party, wedding etc)

band member conduct (on time for rehearsal, professional when dealing with club owners etc)

web presence (facebook,myspace, website, ect)

other sources of income (band merchandise)

advertising

[V-Type]

I haven't picked one song on the setlist. I am more a passenger on the ship than the driver. I see myself as more of a "hired gun". Maybe I need to bring this up at the next practice or look into starting my own project. That is what I was getting at one my first post... ie getting out to meet more likeminded musicians. It's not going to happen sitting at home.

Bring this stuff up at the next practice.

These guys might be waiting for you too tell them you are ready for more responsibility.

Pretty much put it out too them like you have in this thread and Im sure the problem will be resolved one way or another.

Funny but My singer has had too loose a little responsibility unfortunately as he has a tendency too promise things he really cant deliver be it: songs,equipment,gigs,practice time,homework,etc....

[Steadfastly]

Anything in life that is worthwhile is better accomplished with a goal in mind. Often, in order to get to your long time goal, you'll need to make several smaller, short term goals in order to reach the long term one. Just don't make the goals too difficult so you don't become discouraged but make them so you have to stretch out. And one goal at a time is best. As one is accomplished, it will provide impetus for you to meet the next goal. Also writing them down and telling others adds more impetus to see it through.

[stratman77]

Anything in life that is worthwhile is better accomplished with a goal in mind. Often, in order to get to your long time goal, you'll need to make several smaller, short term goals in order to reach the long term one. Just don't make the goals too difficult so you don't become discouraged but make them so you have to stretch out. And one goal at a time is best. As one is accomplished, it will provide impetus for you to meet the next goal. Also writing them down and telling others adds more impetus to see it through.

 

I was going to write something but this sums up exactly what I wanted to say..

[SBF3000]

Dear Wade,

 

How long have you been playing with your current band? Is there any negatives as a result of the "document" or do teh pros far outweigh any negatives....if there are any?

[SpaceNorman]

Hey I resemble that remark, I do have a "business plan" written out, not that it's actually working but at least theres some type of goal to shoot for.....

 

QCB - sorry, didn't mean to suggest that writing it out is a bad thing! I agree 100% that you need to know what you're shooting for. In my case, I simply keep it in my head.

[Steadfastly]

I was going to write something but this sums up exactly what I wanted to say..

 

I probably started typing a nanosecond ahead of you, that's all.

[sickman]

Thanks for the insight. At the gig on Saturday I talked to the band leader in between sets. He agreed it would be a good thing to have me sing more songs. However, I don't see this happening as we never practice... I think I basically need to pick songs they already know (60s-70s rock). I'll try to give him a list of things that fit along the setlist so maybe I can get 1-2 songs per set. It does not seem like we will get any type of decent demo done, but once we get into a place we usually get a few more gigs there. For instance, we got two more from the place on Saturday.

 

On the side, I will start attending some open jams like the one I mentioned in my original post. This should be a good oppportunity to network with some other musicians should something come up.

 

The band is pretty much a classic rock/southern rock/blues band... I think a lot of the stuff I enjoy falls out of this realm. But, as somone said earlier in the thread you have to know your market.

[sickman]

One a side note, I'm open to any suggestions for any songs that you think would go over well that would fit in with our setlist (classic/southern/blues rock). Right now I do Rock N' Roll (Zeppelin) and Shake Your Money Maker (Elmore James) and Sloppy Drunk (BB King). The last two are done more in the style of the Black Crowes and Jimmy Page Live at the Greek.

 

I was thinking stuff like Gimme Back My Bullets (Skynyrd), Thank You (Zeppelin), The Weight (the Band), Like a Rolling Stone (Dylan), Midnight Hour (Wilson Pickett), Let It Bleed (Stones), I Saw Her Standing There (Beatles), Politician (Cream), Sunshine of Your Love (Cream).

 

We were working on Taxman (Beatles), so I was thinking it may be cool to do Taxman and Politician one right after the other?

[shce]

wow- your older bandmates can't complain about your selections. It's not like you're trying to slide Billy Talent or Alice in Chains in on them.

It looks like you're just trying to push a little tighter work ethic.