Members petejt Posted September 14, 2008 Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 Ok, I think it's time that the debate about the TC Electronic G-System versus a modular system etc. has carried on enough in the "instant access vs. presets" thread. I received a lot of good help & advice there, but my actual situation & system was not fully understood. I'm designing what might be considered a quite complex guitar rig system, mostly because I'm fussy about a few pedals that I have in it. I've found that the best thing so far that will meet my needs, is a G-System by TC Electronic. But I am considering alternative ways to achieve the same outcome, with particular objectives in mind. Here is the basis of my system. It's a variant of a Wet/Dry rig, where one amplifier is 'dry', and the other is 'wet'- ie. handles most of the effects. The difference is that I want to use particular pedals in front of the 'dry' amp too, and possibly an effect unit in its effects loop (but that is not an issue). The start of the chain, after the guitar is a TC Electronic Stereo Chorus/Flanger. I want to use this to split my guitar signal for stereo, a wide stereo spread, & a slight detuning effect for chorused distortion sounds. The next pedal is a Boss DD-20 delay. This will 'carry through' the stereo signal as "A" and "B", and also used for panning effects, modulated delay when I want it, looping etc. The "B" signal will go straight to my Mesa/Boogie MarkIV amp head. This is the 'dry' amp. The "A" signal will continue to three pedals. This will be a Danelectro Fish & Chips EQ, an Electro Harmonix Deluxe Electric Mistress, and an ElectroHarmonix Polyphonic Octave Generator. Then the "A" signal will go to the input of my Engl Fireball. This is the "wet" amp. The Fireball will also have a a bunch of effects in its effects loop, for big roomy delays, reverbs, pitch shifting, harmonising, wah-wah maybe, flanging, phaser, etc. etc. etc. etc. Okay, so that's the basics. Lost yet? There will also be two other amps involved, which are crucial to the setup. A Roland Jazz Chorus 120 combo amp, and my Leslie rotating speaker system. The Jazz Chorus will be brought in for super clean tones, running alongside the Fireball & MarkIV. Also it will definitely be used while the Electric Mistress is in operation. The Leslie system will often be used when I have highly distorted tones, running above my Fireball's speaker pair (it's a weird chorusing thing). I want to be able to control EVERYTHING so I can have particular combinations and configurations, that can be switched in an INSTANT. No latency is acceptable, or minimal latency at worst. This includes the channels on each amp, all of the switching functions on the MarkIV, patching in individual pedals (eg. bring in the POG without the Fish & Chips and Mistress), switching on the TC Electronic SCF, sending signals to particular amps, and changing effect presets. I also want my effects pedals on the floor, rather than sitting in a rack. It is fine though that I can't remotely 'switch out' the DD-20, as this will be used as a "goof-around" pedal, and not for dedicated delay presets. How can I possibly do this? Without the G-System? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JMPMarshall Posted September 14, 2008 Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 Route it how you already plan to Stick some pedals in front of all the amps that will do things you'd want all of the amps to do (In place of the G-System input block) I'd use Axess Electronics GRX-4s on your pedalboard, you can mount them underneath, still have loop switching capabilities and they can be remote from the rack like you want You could also use a pair of GRX-4's in stereo for whatever you need to route that way I would put the Mark IV in a rack kit and put it next to a GCX to channel switch it If all you have is a Mark IV and a few little rack toys the rack itself should only be about 50-75lbs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rotebass Posted September 14, 2008 Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 Switchblade, nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 14, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 If all you have is a Mark IV I already stated that I have more than just a MarkIV amp. There's the Engl Fireball for the WET signal ("A" signal), plus the Roland Jazz Chorus combo that's split off and run for clean tones (in conjunction with everything else). The Leslie has a separate amplification system but now will be so small that it's fine to just sit on top of other stuff. I guess a mixer might be needed? But thanks for your advice, very much. I'll look into the GRX-4s. They seem quite handy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rotebass Posted September 14, 2008 Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 You could buy a CFX-9 or Amp Gizmo and just dual-loc it onto the head shell for the Mark IV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zachman Posted September 14, 2008 Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 Ok, I think it's time that the debate about the TC Electronic G-System versus a modular system etc. has carried on enough in the "instant access vs. presets" thread. I received a lot of good help & advice there, but my actual situation & system was not fully understood. I'm designing what might be considered a quite complex guitar rig system, mostly because I'm fussy about a few pedals that I have in it. I've found that the best thing so far that will meet my needs, is a G-System by TC Electronic. But I am considering alternative ways to achieve the same outcome, with particular objectives in mind. Here is the basis of my system. It's a variant of a Wet/Dry rig, where one amplifier is 'dry', and the other is 'wet'- ie. handles most of the effects. The difference is that I want to use particular pedals in front of the 'dry' amp too, and possibly an effect unit in its effects loop (but that is not an issue). The start of the chain, after the guitar is a TC Electronic Stereo Chorus/Flanger. I want to use this to split my guitar signal for stereo, a wide stereo spread, & a slight detuning effect for chorused distortion sounds. The next pedal is a Boss DD-20 delay. This will 'carry through' the stereo signal as "A" and "B", and also used for panning effects, modulated delay when I want it, looping etc. The "B" signal will go straight to my Mesa/Boogie MarkIV amp head. This is the 'dry' amp. The "A" signal will continue to three pedals. This will be a Danelectro Fish & Chips EQ, an Electro Harmonix Deluxe Electric Mistress, and an ElectroHarmonix Polyphonic Octave Generator. Then the "A" signal will go to the input of my Engl Fireball. This is the "wet" amp. The Fireball will also have a a bunch of effects in its effects loop, for big roomy delays, reverbs, pitch shifting, harmonising, wah-wah maybe, flanging, phaser, etc. etc. etc. etc. Okay, so that's the basics. Lost yet? There will also be two other amps involved, which are crucial to the setup. A Roland Jazz Chorus 120 combo amp, and my Leslie rotating speaker system. The Jazz Chorus will be brought in for super clean tones, running alongside the Fireball & MarkIV. Also it will definitely be used while the Electric Mistress is in operation. The Leslie system will often be used when I have highly distorted tones, running above my Fireball's speaker pair (it's a weird chorusing thing). I want to be able to control EVERYTHING so I can have particular combinations and configurations, that can be switched in an INSTANT. No latency is acceptable, or minimal latency at worst. This includes the channels on each amp, all of the switching functions on the MarkIV, patching in individual pedals (eg. bring in the POG without the Fish & Chips and Mistress), switching on the TC Electronic SCF, sending signals to particular amps, and changing effect presets. I also want my effects pedals on the floor, rather than sitting in a rack. It is fine though that I can't remotely 'switch out' the DD-20, as this will be used as a "goof-around" pedal, and not for dedicated delay presets. How can I possibly do this? Without the G-System? Aloha Brother... I have been working non-stop for a couple of weeks and am not quite firing on all 12 cylinders, so excuse my slow pace. IF I were going to do a rig like yours, I'd get one of these, and your routing desires would be NO problem: (Not cheap though-- unfortunately) One of these: and one of these: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 14, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 You could buy a CFX-9 or Amp Gizmo and just dual-loc it onto the head shell for the Mark IV. What exactly is a "Dual-Loc"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 14, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 Aloha Brother... I have been working non-stop for a couple of weeks and am not quite firing on all 12 cylinders, so excuse my slow pace. IF I were going to do a rig like yours, I'd get one of these, and your routing desires would be NO problem: (Not cheap though-- unfortunately) One of these: and one of these: Would the DMC Ground Control Pro be a good substitute for the Amp Gizmo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 14, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 Would a mixer help with splitting off to the other two amps, and for the pedal loops? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rotebass Posted September 14, 2008 Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 What exactly is a "Dual-Loc"? It's like velcro, but it maintains it's ability to hold things longer (laymen's terms). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 14, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 It's like velcro, but it maintains it's ability to hold things longer (laymen's terms). Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 14, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 14, 2008 I'm seriously considering on getting a GCX Switcher. Within the hour. Should I or shouldn't I? Is it worth it or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 15, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 15, 2008 How will a mixer fit in to a modular system, and improve my system? Would it substitute the Switchblade 8B? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zachman Posted September 15, 2008 Members Share Posted September 15, 2008 I'm seriously considering on getting a GCX Switcher. Within the hour.Should I or shouldn't I? Is it worth it or not? The new patchmate is better, IMO. EDIT: I saw the other thread, and just now realized you already ordered the GCX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zachman Posted September 15, 2008 Members Share Posted September 15, 2008 How will a mixer fit in to a modular system, and improve my system? Would it substitute the Switchblade 8B? No... The switchblade is a switching system with a built in programmable mixer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 16, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 16, 2008 No... The switchblade is a switching system with a built in programmable mixer Oh ok, thanks. I actually won the green mixer in an eBay auction, as a bonus with the GCX Switcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cmw Posted September 16, 2008 Members Share Posted September 16, 2008 heh, I was watching that auction as well. Grats! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 16, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 16, 2008 heh, I was watching that auction as well. Grats! Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zachman Posted September 16, 2008 Members Share Posted September 16, 2008 Would the DMC Ground Control Pro be a good substitute for the Amp Gizmo? No, but it will work VERY easily w/ the GCX (I know, duh- big help Zach) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zachman Posted September 16, 2008 Members Share Posted September 16, 2008 Would a mixer help with splitting off to the other two amps, and for the pedal loops? It can provide some alternate routing solutions for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 17, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 17, 2008 It can provide some alternate routing solutions for you. I'm certainly considering that now, and starting to re-think how my system should be routed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zachman Posted September 17, 2008 Members Share Posted September 17, 2008 I'm certainly considering that now, and starting to re-think how my system should be routed. Over the years, I've found myself (more times than not) wishing I would've had the ability to do 'this or that', or wishing (because of my configuration) that my rig didn't do this or that, and thinking that IF I had an amp selector or a switching system-- I could (IF I decided to) do whatever I wanted/needed without a hassle. Is it really necessary, as those who tend to grumble about my rig spout off?? NO... BUT I LOVE having the options that the rig provides. There are only a few cons to the big rig: * It's large* It's heavy* It's expensive The Pros, IMO-- FAR outweigh the Cons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted October 2, 2008 Author Members Share Posted October 2, 2008 I always see the Amp Gizmo, but I dunno about it, the GCX seems simpler in comparison yet does the same thing, and well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Spacehog26 Posted October 2, 2008 Members Share Posted October 2, 2008 GCX is bigger (1u vs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zachman Posted October 2, 2008 Members Share Posted October 2, 2008 I always see the Amp Gizmo, but I dunno about it, the GCX seems simpler in comparison yet does the same thing, and well. The RJM Amp Gizmo is merely a device that'll allow you to change channels on your contact channel switching amp via MIDI. The GCX Switcher is a loop switcher which is used to route audio signal or do relay contact switching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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