Members milesdf Posted April 16, 2007 Members Share Posted April 16, 2007 Hello, we recently purchased a lighting desk that was inoperational (at 10% of what it would have sold for). As I suspected just the power supply had issues, infact it had been smashed to hell. I purchased a UL certified open frame power supply and put it in a nice little case, attaching it up with the power supply cord from the old power supply (4 pin xlr). It worked fine for a couple hours, and then the cord melted (shorted some of the conductors)! This may or may not have destroyed the power supply, havent been able to test it yet. In hindsight, I should have realized the cord (24/3 shielded) would not be that great, no idea why the old one had that. Well I need to replace the cord, I think 18/3 should be overkill, so I need about 5 feet of it. Problem is I can only find it by the 100 foot roll. Anyone know of a source for it by the foot? I can pay in gold if anyone happens to have some laying around (well not in gold, but a decent amount). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted April 16, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted April 16, 2007 Try Markertek.com 800-522-2025 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted April 16, 2007 Members Share Posted April 16, 2007 I just tossed a roll a month ago! Is there any particular reason why it needs to be shielded? Maybe some 14-4 or 16-4 would be a good choice? What console is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted April 17, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted April 17, 2007 I just tossed a roll a month ago! Aye, it's only junk until you toss it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted April 17, 2007 Members Share Posted April 17, 2007 Aye, it's only junk until you toss it. Yup. been sitting on the shelf for 10 years and never had a use for it. There was maybe 30 feet so it wasn't the money but the space! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members milesdf Posted April 18, 2007 Author Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 The console is an elektralite cp-100. it requires 12V and 5V. I can't imagine the cord I recieved with it was the original (seeing how it blew up), but it was shielded with a wire for each, a neutral wire, and the drain and shield which was also the neutral. The gooseneck lamp connector had been removed when I recieved it, I imagine that whoever replaced the original power supply and cord figured that their replacement would be sufficient if there was no light involved. It probablly was sufficient, we were running two decently long dmx runs when the cable exploded, perhaps we would be fine if was had stayed away from that. I did install a new connector for a light but hadn't even touched it at that point. Seeing as I have no idea exactly how finicky this console is (there seems to be very little filtering on the incoming power) or exactly how much power it wants (no reference anywhere, the manufacturer is no help) I aimed high when i picked out a power supply and stupidly didnt think about the cable. Wont make that mistake again. I cant imagine it will draw more than 1A for the 5V and 1.5A for the 12V using really long runs and a light though. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted April 18, 2007 Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 I've never heard of Elektralite. Where was it made? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members milesdf Posted April 18, 2007 Author Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 UK i think, distributed in the US by a smaller company. I think the board was discontinued about 3-4 years ago, it's pretty decent, when it was working. Paid $250 for it? not bad for a console that does alot of movers. Edit: US actually. http://www.myelektralite.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted April 18, 2007 Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 Hmmm, never seen them. That could be a problem, discontinued, UK based and relatively unknown here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members milesdf Posted April 18, 2007 Author Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 Hmmm, never seen them. That could be a problem, discontinued, UK based and relatively unknown here. well i mean i guessed high with the power supply, if i guess high with the cable then i dont think I will have many more issues. I talked to a rep from the company at one point while I was researching it 6 months ago when i bought it, they have all the proccessing boards still if any of those ever go bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted April 18, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted April 18, 2007 Providing more current capacity shouldn't have caused the cable to fail. If it draws the 2.5 amps you're estimating, the original cable should have been fine. Maybe it had internal damage. There's probably no danger in using unshielded cable just to test the unit a bit more and determine whether you really need shielded cable. Perhaps the original supply was a little RF noisey and the shielding was there to minimize it a bit. You aren't planning any shows for the FCC are you???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ear Abuser Posted April 18, 2007 Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 You might want to put an ammeter on theose lines to see what they are drawing- Seems odd to me that you would burn them up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members milesdf Posted April 18, 2007 Author Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 Yikes. 24AWG should do about 10amps max. What does this thing do? If you're drawing 10 amps, or more, I'd think about a heavier gauge than 18. what are you talking about? http://xtronics.com/reference/wire_gauge-ampacity.htm shows max ampacity to be 2.1 amps. It's possible I hit that i guess. Craig:Of course I understand raising power supply capacity doesn't require the wire to be increased as well, unless I am going to overamp the wire, which is what happened. I have no idea and no easy way to determine what the original wire or power supply was. I did measure the draw when I was first testing it out, it was less than half an amp for both, the long dmx runs and a litelight in the future are going to draw more and I don't have an easy way to test this. anyone have any thoughts on installing a voltage regulator inside the console to take 12V down to 5V so I would only have to supply 12V to the console? This would almost be easier then finding cable for this. Even 18/3 unshielded is difficult to find. I do not believe a larger cable will fit inside of the 4 pin xlr connector used. Markertek gave up on both 18/3 shielded and unshielded, or any other similar cable for that matter. They didn't seem to want to deal with me. seems they cant source everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted April 18, 2007 Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 18-3 is standard power cable... home depot carries it! I woudln't go any bigger because the 4 pin XLR contacts would then be undersized. You might also consider Belden 8412 mic cable, shielded pair w/ 20 gauge stranded conductors. I've got a ton of pvc insulated 18-4 and 16-4 unshielded on the shelf, I use it for all kinds of control work. I also have some shielded 20-7 left over from some project. How much do you need? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members milesdf Posted April 18, 2007 Author Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 18-3 is standard power cable... home depot carries it! I woudln't go any bigger because the 4 pin XLR contacts would then be undersized. You might also consider Belden 8412 mic cable, shielded pair w/ 20 gauge stranded conductors.I've got a ton of pvc insulated 18-4 and 16-4 unshielded on the shelf, I use it for all kinds of control work. I also have some shielded 20-7 left over from some project. How much do you need? pvc insulated is not desirable. I do not ever remember seeing 18-3 anywhere, but I will look again the next time I go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Prog Posted April 18, 2007 Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 what are you talking about? 2A max through 24AWG? I don't know where they get there info, but the tests I've done (observed by others) indicate otherwise. Do as you wish. I won't contribute to your thread and have deleted my post. Delete where you quoted me. I won't be involved in this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted April 18, 2007 Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 pvc insulated is not desirable. I do not ever remember seeing 18-3 anywhere, but I will look again the next time I go. Most of what you will find on cable these days is some form of compounded PVC. Anything that's SJT will have a PVC compounded jacket. Most mic cable is also compounded PVC (different formulation that's softer). The DC power cables for most console power supplies is also PVC. Rubber is not very common anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members milesdf Posted April 18, 2007 Author Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 2A max through 24AWG? I don't know where they get there info, but the tests I've done (observed by others) indicate otherwise.Do as you wish. I won't contribute to your thread and have deleted my post. Delete where you quoted me. I won't be involved in this forum. Maybe you were thinking about 14 gauge wire? Jeez. I only questioned you. And gave a source for my own information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members milesdf Posted April 18, 2007 Author Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 Most of what you will find on cable these days is some form of compounded PVC. Anything that's SJT will have a PVC compounded jacket. Most mic cable is also compounded PVC (different formulation that's softer). The DC power cables for most console power supplies is also PVC.Rubber is not very common anymore. Hm when you say PVC i think the stiff gray plasticy insulation, is your stuff soft? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted April 18, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted April 18, 2007 2A max through 24AWG? I don't know where they get there info, but the tests I've done (observed by others) indicate otherwise. Do as you wish. I won't contribute to your thread and have deleted my post. Delete where you quoted me. I won't be involved in this forum. :confused: Your ampacity claim is off by a large margin. Can you cite any reasonable reference showing 10a as acceptable for 24AWG @60C? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Prog Posted April 18, 2007 Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 FAA observed testing. But, it's not important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted April 18, 2007 Members Share Posted April 18, 2007 Hm when you say PVC i think the stiff gray plasticy insulation, is your stuff soft? The 4 conductor is medium softness, it's a flexible installation jacket. Not as soft as typical stage grade mic cable but softer than a lot of installation grade cable. It's got about 0.025" overall jacket thickness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted April 18, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted April 18, 2007 FAA observed testing. But, it's not important. It was important enough for you to make the claim and then take your ball and go home when challenged. If you've got a product that somehow handles 5x normal current loads I think others would be very interested in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Prog Posted April 19, 2007 Members Share Posted April 19, 2007 It was important enough for you to make the claim ... No, it was my mistake to even respond. I'm comfortable with what I've done and seen. I just don't like pissing contests. I'll happily stay out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted April 19, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted April 19, 2007 No, it was my mistake to even respond. I'm comfortable with what I've done and seen. I just don't like pissing contests. I'll happily stay out of it. It's a technical forum, there are no pissing contests over technical issues...you either have good info you can back up, or not. The ability to carry that kind of current load without damage would be great, but I can't imagine there not being issues with heat and voltage drop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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