Yamaha CP-70

[Still Learning]

I was reading today about the piano-based band Keane in the Yamaha publication All Access. the three members are on the cover standing on a Yamaha CP-70B. I have never played on a CP70 so I did a little research on it. I found info on the following models:

 

CP70: std model with 73 keys

CP-70B: included balanced outputs, an improved preamp, etc.

CP70M: included midi output, and EQ, etc.

CP80: included an extra octave of keys.

 

Who here has played on one of these models? what did you like/dislike about it?

 

Does anyone still have one of these?

[Jeff da Weasel]

 

Originally posted by Still Learning Who here has played on one of these models?

 

 

The CP70 is by far one of the best-known electric pianos. It was really the industry standard stage piano throughout the mid-70s and early '80s. You've heard the CP70 on dozens of records, guaranteed.

 

I've played one, and they're very cool if they're not beat up.

 

- Jeff

[weldon]

There is a cp70b sitting about 30 feet to my right and it is my pride and joy.

 

It was bought in 1983 and the action is still absolutely superb. I have played Steinways but this is the classic Yamaha action, keys are as flat and even as the first day.

 

Because it has no soundboard I can bang on it all nite long and my wife won't make a fuss. During the eight years when I actually took it out to gigs, mine sounded better than the others out there because I got the equipment and know how to TUNE IT on a regular basis. In my opinion that is why they got a reputation for having that beat up honky tonk sound.

 

Because the bass strings were so short they never could tune properly, but that was only the very last few, it wasn't as big a problem as some would say.

 

Drawbacks? weight, weight, and weight.

You are talking about carrying two fender rhodes worth of poundage around and hooking them together night after night.

 

Every once in a while I think about bringing it out maybe once a year during the summer and using it with the band for an outdoor concert.

Then I'll sit down and wait for the urge to pass.

 

I love sampled grands because you can't beat the sound for the weight you are carrying but there is nothing that can compare to the richness of hammers hitting real strings. People who are not even players know it too.

When I used to play out with the cp70 folks from all age groups would wander out of the audience to ask me "where the piano was" or "what the hell was it that I was playing".

 

I'm not sure if I would ever part with it, but if I did it would have to be for more than a few grand.

[Still Learning]

Hey thanks jeff and weldon, great replies. I enjoyed the article on Keane's CP-70B and started to get curious about that instrument family. Three more quick questions that I haven't been able to find answers to:

 

1: Was the CP series the only "stringed" electric piano in its day or did other manufacturers make similar instruments?

 

2: Are there any modern romplers/soft-synths that do a good job of emmulating the sound of the CP-70?

 

3: Anything I could put into my Fantom X8 (either an SRX card or perhaps a custom patch that someone made) that would give me that old CP-80 sound?

 

Thanks, have a good weekend all......

[analogaddict]

Originally posted by Still Learning 1: Was the CP series the only "stringed" electric piano in its day or did other manufacturers make similar instruments?

 

IIRC, Kawai made both electric grands and uprights and Helpinstill made an electric upright.

 

Originally posted by Still Learning 2: Are there any modern romplers/soft-synths that do a good job of emmulating the sound of the CP-70?

 

The Nord Stage and Electro are the best hardware clones I've heard. Not even Yamaha gets it right; the Motif series gives you that old, bad detuned sound... There's a company called Prominy, that makes a great CP sample set. I haven't tried it, but I've heard it and it sounds amazing; I couldn't tell whether it was the real thing or not.

 

Originally posted by Still Learning 3: Anything I could put into my Fantom X8 (either an SRX card or perhaps a custom patch that someone made) that would give me that old CP-80 sound?

 

Perhaps the Prominy samples... Roland seems to favor the SA sounds.

 

Originally posted by Still Learning Thanks, have a good weekend all......

 

You too, I think I'll go bang away at my CP80 now!

[Geert Hurenkamp]

 

Originally posted by analogaddict Perhaps the Prominy samples... Roland seems to favor the SA sounds.

 

 

On SRX-07 (Ultimate Keys), patch004 is called Stage Grand and this is a fine CP-sound. Another option: blend a CP-preset on a ROMpler with a little bit of acoustic piano. It gives the often nasal sound of such a CP-preset a little more body.

 

But agreed, I also like my Nord Electro CP a tad better than Rolands CP.

[KarnEvil19]

If you tweak the StageGrand patch a bit, you can get a marvelous CP70 sound out of it. Like they say above, just a pinch of grand piano will add some body and dynamics to the sound.

 

It still isn't nearly as dynamic as it should be, and it seems like getting proper dynamics is a bear. But until I can find a good sample - which I'm just about to google for - or afford a K2600 with the Vintage Keys rom, the Ultimate Keys rom does a more than okay job.

[ozinexile]

I have the Prominy CP80 sample set and it sounds great. I have played the real thing but I can't afford either the money or the space at the moment. I feel this sample set is the next best thing.

 

But the is another alternative, www.hollowsun.com also do a cp70 sample set at a reasonable $55. I haven't played this but the demos do sound good, in fact one of the demos is a Keane song.

[gilwe]

but hey, we talked about the CP pianos, not samples

 

Well, CP60,70 and 80 are definately the best made acoustic/electric pianos. I always wanted to get one,

than I a friend of mine who owns a music shop got a CP70 that was really "banged up", it did't have the sustain pedal and had a few partialley broken keys. He also asked for too much so I decided to pass it and find another. Finally I came across a CP60M, which is the upright version of the CP70/80, but not exactly feels the same, and that's a shame as I really like the action and feel of the 70/80 better.

 

Soundwise they sound almost the same, I think the 70/80 sound a bit more electric, although some will say they are 100% identical... The CP60M though is a great instrument on its own, it has MIDI out, which the standard CP70/80 lack of, and being upright makes it idial for studio use, although you really can't just pack up your 70/80 and go for a show... (they weight more than 200kg !!!). The CP60 is lighter in weight (100kg).

 

Anyhow, the CP70/80 feels more "big" playing them - which means the action is usually higher (which is good) and the keys are a bit bigger (or at least feels so). I think Yamaha went towards the "grand" structure on these, while they made the 60M like other uprights (I played an upright Yamaha which feels exactly the same).

 

Kawai tried to do the same with the (unsuccessful) EP608 (an upright), and another grand type of model (I think it was a EP-308).

 

Anyhow, I played a 608 and I must say it really doesn't nail it at all. They went on putting only one string per key which makes it sounding really thin, not much like an acoustic piano, rather than somewhere between a Rhodes and a CP... Still sounds very nice actually on its own, but doesn't sound like an acoustic piano. I gave that one as well in favor of thew CP60M of which I'm really satisfied with ! But honsetly, I'd prefer a CP70/80 in place of it

 

The CP series is so much heard all over so many rock albums,

its funny because while Keane brought them back into wide publicity playing only a single CP70 on shows and the drums, so many artists used it in the past.

 

Just a partial list:

 

U2 piano on "New Years Day"and "October"

 

Billy Joel all over the Nylon Curtain album

 

Simple Minds on "Alive and Kicking" and all over the "Once Upon a Time" album (sounds GREAT when mixed well with electric guitars !)

 

Crime and the City Solution on Room of Lights

 

and so many others !

 

as I said, the electrics bell like sound of the CP mixes and sounds very nice with electric guitars, what makes it the ultimate rock piano ! I use to play mine through my guitar effects once in a while.

 

 

You can read more on my post here:

 

http://www.harmony-central.com/Synth/Data/Yamaha/CP_60M-1.html

[analogaddict]

Originally posted by gilwe as I said, the electrics bell like sound of the CP mixes and sounds very nice with electric guitars, what makes it the ultimate rock piano !

 

+1, THE ultimate rock piano. It's actually superb..!

[gilwe]

bump

 

I just felt this topic needs more attention

 

.... and a little teaser

 

 

[Pawnz]

Originally posted by analogaddict IIRC, Kawai made both electric grands and uprights and Helpinstill made an electric upright.

Helpinstill also made a model that looked very similar in design to the CP70/80. Saw Bruce Hornsby play one live back in the day.......

[gilwe]

Intertesting

 

http://vkmag.alphabeck.co.uk/old/issue1/html/page4.html

 

 

[gilwe]

oh, and here's the nice EP308:

 

 

[Markyboard]

Wow...too tinny and too muddy were all I ever hear when talking about the Yamaha electic grands. At least up until recently. So I always just quietly enjoed these for myself. Up till now.

 

[b3keys]

E-MU's Vintage Pro Keys Module has several great Yammy CP-70 sounds. Highly reccommended.

[gilwe]

and they have great CP70 samples on their EMAXiii CDs

[fuzzy4dice]

They are great, you should buy one!

 

I did.

 

I drove about 150 miles to buy one from some kids bedroom for $400.00.

 

They are heavy as shit, but they sound like nothing else and I love it very much. I would bring it out with me, but my brains always kick in.

 

Here's some pics...

 

 

 

 

[mrcpro]

Originally posted by Still Learning Who here has played on one of these models? what did you like/dislike about it? Does anyone still have one of these?

 

I think just about all of us over, say 45 has played one, since they were the standard stage piano from the late 1970s to the late 1980s. I have yet to hear a sample based piano accurately capture the CP sound, but I'm not sure that's a problem.

 

I still have my 80 set up in my living room and it's my home piano.

[mate_stubb]

There was another contender back then - the Baldwin ElectroPro. I carried one of these on the road for quite a few years.

 

It looked like a low slung spinet, covered in brown formica. It had a full 88 keys and did not break into two parts like the Yamahas.

 

For my taste, the Yamaha had a way better action than the Baldwin, a real grand piano action instead of the simplified spinet style. But when I played the Yamaha, I always felt that the action felt shallow compared to a real grand piano.

 

Sound wise, the Baldwin was brighter and cut well, with less tubbiness in the bass strings than the Yamaha.

 

I agree with others, that the best authentic CP sound set I've heard is the Electro.

 

However, the best sound to replace the CP, which serves the same cutting rock piano need, is Piano 3 from the Roland MKS-20 / MKS-1000. It's a super dynamic sound which became famous in its own right after the heyday of the CP. The dynamic experience of playing one of these still has not been equalled to this day by samplers or romplers.

[The Real MC]

I was about to mention the Baldwin.

 

Yamaha also made a CP-80M, with MIDI. Joe Rivers of Audio Playground synth museum has one.

[mrcpro]

I used the Baldwin Electropro for a number of years before the CPs came out. Back in those days, I wanted the closest I could get to an acoustic piano onstage, and in the early-mid 1970s that was all there was. I wasn't interested in a Rhodes, which a lot of guys were using as a substitute.

 

There is a big difference in sound quality, action,and tuning stablilty betwen the Baldwin and Yamaha. There was a sweet spot on the Baldwin around middle C that wasn't too bad though.

[mate_stubb]

I built a giant road case for my Electropro. It took 4 guys to move it and was as bad or worse than moving a Hammond.

 

I also carried a Peterson strobe tuner and a set of tuning wedges and hammer to keep the beast in line.

[gilwe]

Speaking of action, it's a bit strange how Yamaha made the CP60 shallower than the 70/80... I wonder if what guided them when doing the 70/80 was a "real" grand action, while the guideline for the 60 was their uprights...

[fuzzy4dice]

so where can I get a Yamaha tuning wrench?