Members scolfax Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I'm thinking of getting a Germania pedal. I use a One Spot. However, the instructions say: "The Germania and Germania 44 require a 9 volt dc, POSITIVE center, filtered and regulated supply rated at 100ma or greater. Because of this the Germania and Germania 44 will not work with an AC adapter when ran with other negative center pedals. A battery must be used. " If I use the 9v battery clip adapter with the One Spot daisychain, will that work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members H.R. Shove and Stuff Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members who235 Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I don't think it will work. Luckily, batteries in a treble booster will last for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members andreas Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 If I use the 9v battery clip adapter with the One Spot daisychain, will that work?No. The Germania is positive ground, and will therefore short the power supply out if it's hooked up together with regular negative ground pedals. That's regardless of how you hook it up (using the battery clip cable or through the adapter jack. You have to have a separate power source for the Germania - either a battery or a separate adapter with the right connections (reverse from normal). I'd use a battery, and if it's to sit at a point in the chain where unplugging the input cable is cumbersome, I'd simply use a dummy plug in the adapter jack to shut the power off when I'm not playing. /Andreas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scolfax Posted October 16, 2009 Author Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 Thanks for the replies! On a related note, can someone reccommend a good treble booster that doesn't have this limitation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members who235 Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I think the Throbak StrangeMaster is negative ground. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hooya Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 Isn't there a polarity switcher for the One Spot? Will that do the trick for him? What's the difference between "Positive Ground" (seems like an oxymoron) and simply a Positive center polarity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ItchyFingers Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 Thanks for the replies! On a related note, can someone reccommend a good treble booster that doesn't have this limitation? Keeley Java Boost - also has a switch for mid and full boost in addition to the treble boost. Can be slightly noisy with a 1-spot though. Stone bender MKII by Throback is also negative center (I think!). These things are like little amps - great pedal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members H.R. Shove and Stuff Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 Isn't there a polarity switcher for the One Spot? Will that do the trick for him? What's the difference between "Positive Ground" (seems like an oxymoron) and simply a Positive center polarity? There isn't a positive and a ground, there is a positive and a negative. It's just negative is usually ground, except certain transistors and whatnot are built the other way around so +ground is used I believe there is a polarity switcher, but you still won't be able to daisy chain with it. It would be the same thing as switching the battery adapter wires, it's still not goint work. Godlyke is coming out with something that is supposed to be able to power +ground pedals in a daisy chain with -ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SonicVI Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 the D*A*M Red Rooster is the only negative ground Rnagemaster clone I know of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hooya Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 There isn't a positive and a ground, there is a positive and a negative. It's just negative is usually ground, except certain transistors and whatnot are built the other way around so +ground is used I believe there is a polarity switcher, but you still won't be able to daisy chain with it. It would be the same thing as switching the battery adapter wires, it's still not goint work. Godlyke is coming out with something that is supposed to be able to power +ground pedals in a daisy chain with -ground. Oh, so essentially the circuit is wired up backwards (compared to normal), not just that the wiring of the power jack is a certain way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members andreas Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 ^ The battery/power supply has a positive and a negative, and in a 9vDC supply (or a battery) the positive sits 9 volts above the negative. Normally, when the power enters a circuit, the negative is referenced to ground with the positive at +9v, but in some circuits (mainly old-style circuits using PNP transistors) the positive is referenced to ground, with the negative at -9v. The ground is still ground - it's only "positive" in relation to the battery/power supply negative. And there are also circuits that use bipolar power (-9v and +9v, with ground in the middle), just to make things more complicated Daisy-chaining a PNP/positive ground pedal with normal NPN/negative ground pedals won't work, simply because the common ground connection will cause the battery/power supply positive to short out. "Positive ground" and "positive center" (or "reverse polarity") are indeed two different things. The adapter jacks in most pedals are insulated from the box, so you could theoretically wire them any way you like. Reverse polarity does not automatically mean "positive ground", just like there are positive ground pedals that have normal polarity jacks. The reason Boss started wiring the barrel type jacks center negative is because of the battery switching - you want the jack to disconnect the battery positive when a plug is inserted, and those jacks can only switch the sleeve/barrel connection. So center negative became the standard. Many positive ground pedals will also have reverse polarity jacks (Fulltone '69, Soulbender etc), once again because of the battery switching (this time, it's the battery negative that you want to switch, as the positive is hooked up to ground). But there are those that wire their jacks center negative as normal (Voodoo Lab Proctavia, MJM etc), even though the circuit is positive ground. So it's a bit of a jungle out there... /Andreas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hooya Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I kinda wish the standard was positive center, then you could just ground the metal chassis and be done with it and not have to worry about isolating the DC jack with a plastic jack or a grommet of some kind. Would be easier to deal with in a build. Not that just buying the plastic jack is hard if you know where to get them, it's just not as cheap or easy to find as a metal jack. Whatever. You learn something new every day (I learned TWO new things today!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coverdale Posted October 19, 2009 Members Share Posted October 19, 2009 scolfax, I just got a Germania 44 and tried it with the battery adapter for the 1 Spot. It worked without any problems.EDIT : I tried it with only the Germania plugged in, no other pedals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scolfax Posted October 19, 2009 Author Members Share Posted October 19, 2009 scolfax, I just got a Germania 44 and tried it with the battery adapter for the 1 Spot. It worked without any problems.EDIT : I tried it with only the Germania plugged in, no other pedals. Thanks for the info. From the posts above it sounds like the trouble begins when you add other pedals into the chain. I wouldn't try it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members olgluefoot Posted October 19, 2009 Members Share Posted October 19, 2009 I guess I still dont see how using the 9volt battery adapter would hurt things. There is only one way to connect a 9volt battery. You cant mix up positive and negative. so.... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RadioSilence Posted October 19, 2009 Members Share Posted October 19, 2009 I guess I still dont see how using the 9volt battery adapter would hurt things. There is only one way to connect a 9volt battery. You cant mix up positive and negative. so.... ? if the positive is connected to ground on one pedal, and the negative is connected to ground on another pedal, the positive and negative are connected together which means a short circuit and your power supply burns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coverdale Posted October 19, 2009 Members Share Posted October 19, 2009 scolfax,I just checked and the FAQ on the Visual Sound (1Spot makers)website says that it can't be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scolfax Posted October 19, 2009 Author Members Share Posted October 19, 2009 scolfax,I just checked and the FAQ on the Visual Sound (1Spot makers)website says that it can't be done. Cool, thanks for checking! So is the solution to have two one spots per board for daisy-chaining? One for negative ground and the other for positive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members andreas Posted October 19, 2009 Members Share Posted October 19, 2009 Negative ground pedals can share the same power supply (some will be noisy when daisy-chained, but they will get power). Positive ground pedals can share the same power supply (again, with the same limitations), but you can't combine the two groups. Like RadioSilence said, + goes to ground in one pedal, and - to ground in the others. Combine the two (connect them both through the power supply and signal cables) and you're shorting the power supply out. As 99% of all pedals are negative ground, most of us will never come across this issue. And since most positive ground pedals are simple fuzz/octavia pedals which draw very little power, you can easily power those from batteries (you can use a dummy adapter jack plug to shut them down when you're not playing). But if you want to run positive ground pedals with adapter power, you'll need a separate adapter for them, yes. If the positive ground pedal has an adapter jack, you'll need to verify its polarity as well - don't assume it's wired in reverse, simply because most of them are. Check with the manufacturer before trying. /Andreas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scolfax Posted October 19, 2009 Author Members Share Posted October 19, 2009 And since most positive ground pedals are simple fuzz/octavia pedals which draw very little power, you can easily power those from batteries... My Sunface seems to eat batteries. Of course it might be because I often forget to unplug the input cable coming from my tuner... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OverdrivenEL34s Posted November 29, 2009 Members Share Posted November 29, 2009 i have a throbak stone bender and have noticed if i use a 1spot power supply with it and other pedals it won't work. it will work if the throbak is the only pedal hooked up or the 1st and the rest of the pedals end up not get power. at 1st i thought maybe this pedal draws a lot of power. i'd guess a power supply with isolated power jacks would work. however, i usually use small pedal board (5-6 pedals) and all my other pedals work fine with the 1spot...anyway i'll use batteries for time being or other pedal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members andreas Posted November 29, 2009 Members Share Posted November 29, 2009 Tonebenders, octavias, germanium fuzz faces and rangemaster pedals are often positive ground, and therefore need a separate power source (regardless of if the adapter jack is wired center positive or not). If you get a second, separate power supply for the Throbak, you'll have yourself the isolation you need. It'll be a fair bit cheaper than getting a PP2+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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