Members kpatz Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 We just must set some standard for detune amount. It is easy to dial +/- X cents on Andromeda, but on Jupiter 8 and OB-8 there are no numbers to set. Filter is wide open and VCA is set to sustain = max, some gentle attack, and medium release. But since the filter is 90% of what gives a synth "that sound", how about "the patch" including a filter sweep. Start wide open and have it close down over time. Then filter characteristics can be compared. Either that, or do more than one patch.. one to show the oscillators' sounds, one for the filter w/o resonance, one with resonance, etc. As for normalizing parameters like detune, if one uses the base patch as a reference point (listen to it, and match it best you can on your synth), that should take care of differing parameter ranges/units on different synths. Do it by ear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Carey M Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 We just must set some standard for detune amount. It is easy to dial +/- X cents on Andromeda, but on Jupiter 8 and OB-8 there are no numbers to set. Filter is wide open and VCA is set to sustain = max, some gentle attack, and medium release. As of MIDI sequence, i like your Omega example. It covers everything. Just record the same thing into MIDI, without quantization and we can start the project. True, it'd be nice to get the detune amount as close as possible. Omega's detune amount is not exact like Andro's, so I'll leave it to you to approximate the detune amount (not wobbly, not too slow?). There's also going to be differences in the pre-filter mix levels, and apparently the Andro can even set post-filter mix levels, AND Andro's filters open up way more than Omega's. Still, I think this could be fun I'll try to make some sort of sequence & comparison sound file tomorrow. - CM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Don Solaris Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 I still prefer the interface and the mod capabilities of the xpander in many ways, but I think that this is actually a better sounding synth to my ears. First two days i wasn't too happy with Andromeda's sound. But then i found the formula. The magic formula (takes 40 minutes, but it is worth): Turn on Andromeda. Disable background tuning. Disable temperature tuning. Leave it on for about 40 minutes. Get back to unit. Press Autotune. Oscillators will be tuned now, and since the unit is warm, it will remain stable for longer time (mine does) Prepare yourself for a totally different Andromeda!FAT, warm, and totally big sound! I couldn't stop playing the thing till 04 AM next day. Oh, and did i say that it sounds really FAT !!! P.S: I've heard rumors that background tuning eats the cpu and reduces the sound quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Marzzz Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 Any thoughts on the Andromeda sound vs. the Omega. I have terrible Andromeda-gas atm, but I don't think I can justify buying one when I have an Omega... If I were going to boil it down in two sentence fragments, it would be: Andromeda- warmer/smoother/paddier Omega- more powerful/bassier/punchier/in your face/8 monosynths in a box -Marshall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members droolmaster0 Posted November 16, 2008 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 Did you get something to replace it? I seem to remember some chatter about an Omega?Any thoughts on the Andromeda sound vs. the Omega, meister Drool? You had an Omega too, at some point, right? I have terrible Andromeda-gas atm, but I don't think I can justify buying one when I have an Omega...- CM As I recall the Omega's sound, it was considerably bigger, and very smooth. But the Andromeda is a much more flexible machine and can do weird sounds much better. I'd rather have the Andromeda. A better comparison for me is the sunsyn, which has a rawer sound, and though having a smaller mod matrix by far, can really make some amazing sounds. Probably not as good for traditional synth sounds, but I'm not that interested in them. the sunsyn also has an amazing ui, and interacting with it in real time is quite a pleasure. For pure, traditional synth sound quality, probably the Omega is the best of the 3. But of course, these things are subjective anyway. The Omega sound was just stunning to my ears - but I got bored with it as a synth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mildbill Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 We need to make this idea another thread:http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2155216 Might as well. 2 detuned saws with a wide open filter isn't going to tell much.Probably every synth ever made (including softsynths) will sound a littlealike. As people have commented, the interface, the programming options available, and a whole host of other factors have an influence on how well you'll get along with a synth, as well as its raw sound. The Access Virus series is a good example of this. Lots of people have said that the raw sound of its oscillators is weak, but it remains a wildly popular synth for a lot of other reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members droolmaster0 Posted November 16, 2008 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 First two days i wasn't too happy with Andromeda's sound. But then i found the formula. The magic formula (takes 40 minutes, but it is worth): Also - seems to make a small difference, though I don't know if it's in me head - use the aux outputs rather than the main outputs. According to Mike Peake in the 'tips and tricks' - "The FX are a sidechain and when OFF only contribute the DAC's self-noise to the Main outputs (unless the additional summing is changing the overall signal). The Mains DO run through a few feet of wire as they go out to the Volume knob and then back; the Aux outputs are a straight path on the PCB, as are the Individual outputs. At the lower levels that Colin is using to tap the purity of the analog signal path, the FX self-noise begins to become apparent and objectionable. The Aux outputs are recommended in their place. By me, not by Alesis :-)" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members droolmaster0 Posted November 16, 2008 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 We can make a test. Take the same midi sequence and make a patch with two detuned saws and opened filter. What are the % chances that such a test will actually be of which machine's sound you'd like better while actually tweaking it and going through a wide range of sounds? These tests are never really satisfying, though they can be amusing. I never use a simple sound like the one described except maybe if I'm starting from scratch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cl516 Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 AUX Output thing is definitely true. There's less noise also.Also keep your osc levels relatively low if possible.Some people also recommended taking the individual outs and summing it into a little mixer.Oh and try Numerology and mix mode to have 16 channels of fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Carey M Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 Marzzz, drool, thanks for your comments. Also, mildbill and drool, I don't think this is going to be "teh definite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members raffor Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 The magic formula (takes 40 minutes, but it is worth): There is plenty of more magic when you dig into the menu structure. However, at the end of the day, compare the results with the one you get from your other jewels and see if it was worth all the effort. If it is NO, than you know how I felt at the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Delicious Lamprey Problem Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 Leave it on for about 40 minutes. I hate analog so very, very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members raffor Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 The Access Virus series is a good example of this. Lots of people have said that the raw sound of its oscillators is weak, but it remains a wildly popular synth for a lot of other reasons. The thing with the Virus is that the waveforms instantly mushes into one big ball of bloop when you start detuning them. Same with the PWM. It would win over any detuned waveforms I have heard. To make it that fat sounding, I guess they have to shift the pitch quite a bid around and thus probably limied the frequency range of the oscillators (meaning the frequency range of the harmonics). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cl516 Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 There is plenty of more magic when you dig into the menu structure. However, at the end of the day, compare the results with the one you get from your other jewels and see if it was worth all the effort. If it is NO, than you know how I felt at the end. Wow, I could not have said it better. For me it was NO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soundwave106 Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 I hate analog so very, very much. Eh, you don't have to be that pickyl about it. My procedure with the Andromeda is as follows: (*) A tune-up at the beginning (*) Occasional VCO-only tunes after that. In a temperature stable environment it usually only needs one about 10-15 minutes after power-on. The background tuning is nice to have, though, for *non*-temperature stable environments (some gigs for instance). Sure, I can tell the difference immediately, but I doubt that the audience can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members raffor Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 I hate analog so very, very much. Maybe you should have waited 40 minutes before you sold them all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Delicious Lamprey Problem Posted November 16, 2008 Members Share Posted November 16, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Carey M Posted November 17, 2008 Members Share Posted November 17, 2008 As of MIDI sequence, i like your Omega example. It covers everything. Just record the same thing into MIDI, without quantization and we can start the project. I posted the following also to this thread... Sooo... I recorded some "detuned saw" sounds today. One boring sequence with a little attack and release and one silly sequence with just a gated envelope. Filters were wide open, all modulation and dynamics were turned off. Just two sawtooth oscillators detuned apart. Each file starts with just a single held note, so that people can figure out the detune amount (which varies from voice to voice on the Omega), and approximate attack and release parameters. Both sequences were recorded straight from Omega's mono out, and recorded twice, once with the Moog filter, once with the SEM clone filter. The resulting wave files were converted to 320Kbps MP3s, to save a little bandwith. The files can be found here: http://www.saunalahti.fi/~matikon/detunedsaws/ Also the MIDI sequences can be found there. I have no idea, whether this will be acceptable to you lot, but this is all I had time for today. - CM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkShovel2 Posted November 17, 2008 Members Share Posted November 17, 2008 I have really enjoyed the past five or six weeks with my new A6. I really appreciate the 16 voices when operating in mix mode. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members raffor Posted November 18, 2008 Members Share Posted November 18, 2008 I have really enjoyed the past five or six weeks with my new A6. Does this mean you have to wait 5-6 years and not just 40 minutes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkShovel2 Posted November 18, 2008 Members Share Posted November 18, 2008 Your attempt at humour can not make it through my several glasses of wheat beer....... I'll raise you two V-Synths, an OB-8 and OB-Xa and back it up with a JD-800. I'm hiding a Fantom X8, VC-2 and Juno-60 in my sleeve. I can burn two JX-3Ps, two JX-8Ps and a JX-10 and not even care. I don't even want to mention the rest of my synths. Don't make me whip out my 1968 Gibson Les Paul Custom, Marshall 100W heads and four 4x12 cabs. It might need the 3500W dual subs, a large truck and several roadies...They would be pissed to re-string my 23 guitars. I need another beer....:blah: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members raffor Posted November 18, 2008 Members Share Posted November 18, 2008 Your attempt at humour can not make it through my several glasses of wheat beer....... I'll raise you two V-Synths, an OB-8 and OB-Xa and back it up with a JD-800. I'm hiding a Fantom X8, VC-2 and Juno-60 in my sleeve. I can burn two JX-3Ps, two JX-8Ps and a JX-10 and not even care. I don't even want to mention the rest of my synths. I need another beer.... :blah: You will need all these synths to bridge the 5-6 years warm-up!! P.S.: mmmmhhhh wheat berr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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