Got an M50: Sounds Great, Lame Action - Shoot Me..

[vinceg]

McHale, btw - what case do you use for the M50 73 key, to transport to gigs & such?

 

 

McHale answered this in another thread (couldn't find it). I think he's using the SKB 1SKB-R5220w. I have one on order, too. That case, the M50 73 and stand should all be in next week. Getting anxious.

 

Between McHale and Goldphinga, they've pretty much defined my new rig. Thanks, guys.

[McHale]

McHale answered this in another thread (couldn't find it). I think he's using the SKB 1SKB-R5220w. I have one on order, too. That case, the M50 73 and stand should all be in next week. Getting anxious. Between McHale and Goldphinga, they've pretty much defined my new rig. Thanks, guys.

 

Also posted a few posts up.

 

Remember kids, NEVER gig without a hard case. Regardless if you move your own gear, things can and will happen. A soft case is *NOT* enough when you're going out in public. Unless you are in complete control of your environment, anything can happen.

 

-Mc

[McHale]

I wouldn't return the M50. I would try to accommodate to the keys.

+1

[mildbill]

It plays out of tune sometimes, like an oscillator's dying... not all the time but at certain times, the worst times on gigs - in the middle of a ballad, when I'm laying on a nice string patch - it'll play sour-sounding notes...

Sure it's not just a dodgy pitch wheel? Maybe there's some type of reset/calibration you can do on it.

[GigMan]

Sure it's not just a dodgy pitch wheel? Maybe there's some type of reset/calibration you can do on it.

Nah - it's dying a slow death... last wknd. it gave me some kind of system error message on the screen and the note I was playing froze - luckily this was at home before the gig.

[GigMan]

I wouldn't return the M50. I would try to accommodate to the keys. The M50 gives a lot, considering its price.

Agreed - which is why, after yet another trip to Guitar Center tonite, to try out the actions of a bunch of different synths - I have decided to do just that: keep the M50 and "accomodate to the keys" (ie, get used to them or at least, learn to live w/them). I also have to "accomodate to" the fact that there's no aftertouch on the M50 (which my Triton Le does have) but it's not the end of the world.

My impressions of all the synth actions on the other semi-weighted 'boards:

*********************
Korg M3 73/61:
M3's keybed is only slightly better than the M50's, the way I felt it. It is not a real pleasure to play

Yamaha Motif XS6/7
Not bad but not as good as the Fantom G. Sounds are too simliar/same as my S90ES so I wouldn't get one for that reason anyway.

Yamaha Mo' 6
Not quite as good as the Motif XS but not horrible, better than the M3, in fact. Sounds are also too simliar/same as my S90ES so I wouldn't get one for that reason anyway.

Roland Fantom G6/7
Excellent - I found this to be the winner, a pleasure to play. Good snap back, lightweight yet not mushy. This one really tempted me to return the M50 and get a Fantom G - but the M50 just has so many instantly useable sounds for me it didn't seem worth the hassle of switching, not to mention the vast price difference... Fantom G7 is $2,300 at the cheapest - Korg M50 73key was $1,250.
*********************

Of course, your mileage may vary - the bottom line is, you really need to try out keyboards before buying them, not just to hear the sounds but also feel the touch of the keys... I had tried out the M50 but was focused so hard on the sounds forgot to gather an impresson on the action.

[GigMan]

Also posted a few posts up. Remember kids, NEVER gig without a hard case. Regardless if you move your own gear, things can and will happen. A soft case is enough when you're going out in public. Unless you are in complete control of your environment, anything can happen. -Mc

I'm guessing you meant to say, "A soft case is NOT enough when you're going out in public..."

Yah, I like the looks of that SKB Roto case you have, the R4215W - I'll probably go for that one. I had the Triton Le in a soft case since I got it in 2002, so I guess I got lucky it lasted this long.

[playstation]

I've been bummed about Korg key action for some time. My Triton Ex. had Yamaha FS action which felt substantial. Juno Stage feels better to me than any Korg synth action even on much more expensive boards. Korg just likes spongy little levers now.

[GigMan]

I've been bummed about Korg key action for some time. My Triton Ex. had Yamaha FS action which felt substantial. Juno Stage feels better to me than any Korg synth action even on much more expensive boards. Korg just likes spongy little levers now.

Yes, I forgot to mention the Juno Stage as another 'board I played tonite - good action but the sounds didn't thrill me, even though I did like the 76 key layout.

Another thing is Korg's decision to make the M3/M50 73 keys instead of 76 is annoying - & the keys they left out seem are missing from the top, where I need them, whereas they should have left them out from the bottom end of the keyboard.

[McHale]

The M3 keybed is a pretty decent keybed. I have several issues with it though. For one, it's the ONLY keybed on all my synths where my fingers slip off the keys when doing fast runs. The other is like you said, 73 keys blow. It has eliminated me playing a few songs live now because I needed ALL 76 keys for some of the complicated splits I use. The best keybed is still the keybed used on the Triton stuff (classic, studio, extreme). That Yamaha keybed is awesome - the feel of the keys, the action, everything.

 

I've stated quite a bit that I prefer the keybed on the M50 over the M3. I still feel that way. The M50 as cheap as it is doesn't cause my fingers to slip off and it's very fast.

 

I think if you give it a little more time, you won't think about the keybed any longer and in a few months you'll wonder why you didn't like it.

 

-Mc

 

p.s. I fixed my post above. I rushed that post... Thanks for catching it.

[midi]

I'll second the M3-61 action...

[GigMan]

Ok, so after truckin' back to Gtr. Ctr. last nite and trying the keybed/actions on a whole bunch of synths I felt better about the underwhelming action/feel of my new Korg M50's keys (since they actually feel better than some of the others I tried) & had decided I'd keep it and be happy w/it strong points (cool, fun sounds, ease of interface, similarity to what I already know [Triton Le]) & accept it's weakness (keybed)...

BUT... ?!?!

I've found another glaring weakness w/this board that I think will put me over the edge & make me return it 'cause I don't think I can live with: it is a 73 key machine, yet the high end of it doesn't go any higher than my 61 key Triton Le - all the extra notes seem to be jammed at the lower end!

You might say, "No big deal, GigMan - stop whining... transpose the patches you want higher up an octave, blah blah blah..." - - but the thing is, I bought the extended keyboard (73 key instead of 61) just to have those extra notes up top, needed sometimes on string lines and certain other patches. If I'm going to spend time transposing patches up an octave, I could've just gotten the 61 key version and saved myself some dough!

[GigMan]

I'll second the M3-61 action...

Ok, which means what - you also don't like it?

[McHale]

I don't see the extra octave up/down being a deal breaker. I program all of my own patches to everything I play. And most of the patches where it matters (pianos for example) have SW1 or SW2 set to octave up or down already. Some of the stock patches have *NO* usable notes in an additional upper octave. For example, take a wind instrument. If you are playing a patch on your M50 that is supposed to replicate it, adding an octave ABOVE the realistic range of that instrument may sound OK, but it probably won't. Most instruments don't have a 5 or 6 octave range. So when you throw the usable range on a synth, how the extra keys are used are a judgement call.

 

After playing my Triton Pro (76 keys), I could never go back to 61 for a workstation. In one song we do, I have a combi that uses 5 splits and uses 13 different patches. I couldn't do that with a 61 key. That extra octave is well worth the extra price. I'm still miffed that they didn't make a 76 key instead of the 73 but I'm living with it.

 

-Mc

[GigMan]

I don't see the extra octave up/down being a deal breaker. I program all of my own patches to everything I play. And most of the patches where it matters (pianos for example) have SW1 or SW2 set to octave up or down already. Some of the stock patches have *NO* usable notes in an additional upper octave. For example, take a wind instrument. If you are playing a patch on your M50 that is supposed to replicate it, adding an octave ABOVE the realistic range of that instrument may sound OK, but it probably won't. Most instruments don't have a 5 or 6 octave range. So when you throw the usable range on a synth, how the extra keys are used are a judgement call. After playing my Triton Pro (76 keys), I could never go back to 61 for a workstation. In one song we do, I have a combi that uses 5 splits and uses 13 different patches. I couldn't do that with a 61 key. That extra octave is well worth the extra price. I'm still miffed that they didn't make a 76 key instead of the 73 but I'm living with it. -Mc

I went thru the M50's string patches (which is where this lack of extra keys on top really matters, for me) & I found that the SW1 button is set for transposing - an octave down not up...

so, what - now I would have to go thru every string patch and change that setting on the SW1 key, to change it to go an octave up instead - and then save that change, itself, so that I don't have to remember to hit the "SW1" button every time I play strings...

Seems like a lot of work, to do have to do this to shift octaves on every string patch (and whatever else might need it) - if they had 76 keys we wouldn't need to have this conversation, would we...?

[evildragon]

...or you just find two or three excellent string patches that suit you and edit just them.

[moog man]

I would return it and get an M3. The action on the M3 is the best unweighted out there IMO. I never have liked the Fantoms and I think the G7 especially is quite a disappointment for the price. Maybe consider an XS but I think if you liked the M50 soundset then you will love an M3.

 

Note to Korg: Make a midi controller with M3 action

[McHale]

Even if he had the M3-73, he'd still have the whole upper octave issue which was his major gripe.

 

And I wouldn't go through and edit every patch. I'd edit the ones you play when you discover you need to make the change. It takes about 5 seconds. I actually went through all of my M50 *AND* M3 patches and edited every organ patch to set the Expression pedal to Leslie speed. Now THAT was a pain in the ass... and totally worth it.

 

-Mc

[Thorhead]

So in the efforts to find a good replacement for my dying Triton Le, after several trips to Guitar Wanker & mulling over the "Used vs. New" decision - I pulled the plug and ordered a brand new Korg M50 from Chris at Alto Music in Middletown, NY (great guy, good prices btw)...

I have an S90ES so I stayed away from the Motifs, thinking it'd be redundant but I had checked out a new Fantom G7, considered a used Fantom X7, even thought about getting another TLe used - just to keep things simple... I finally decided the M50 had that right combination of useable sounds, straightforward interface, reasonable price.

UPS brought it last nite so I played the M50 it last nite & this morning & have realized - I DON'T LIKE THE ACTION of THE KEYBED VERY MUCH!!

I've lived w/the crappy Triton Le action since July 2002 just 'cause I liked the sounds and didn't want the hassle of changing. But now the Le is flaking out on gigs so I have to make the change... The M50 action is only slightly better than the TLe's god-awful action. I guess I was paying less attention to the action & more to the sounds when I tried M50 it out in the store 3 different times!!

So now I see these as possible options:

Midi it to S90 Es?

[Thorhead]

I went thru the M50's string patches (which is where this lack of extra keys on top really matters, for me) & I found that the SW1 button is set for transposing - an octave down not up... so, what - now I would have to go thru every string patch and change that setting on the SW1 key, to change it to go an octave up instead - and then save that change, itself, so that I don't have to remember to hit the "SW1" button every time I play strings... Seems like a lot of work, to do have to do this to shift octaves on every string patch (and whatever else might need it) - if they had 76 keys we wouldn't need to have this conversation, would we...?

 

OR just go to global mode and transpose 12 semitotems up... What korg did might be silly, but I do have transposed every single strings patch on M3 in the time it took you to just write that.

[GigMan]

I would return it and get an M3. The action on the M3 is the best unweighted out there IMO. I never have liked the Fantoms and I think the G7 especially is quite a disappointment for the price. Maybe consider an XS but I think if you liked the M50 soundset then you will love an M3. Note to Korg: Make a midi controller with M3 action

I tried the M3 - action didn't thrill me at all. I found it only slightly better than the M50, which isn't saying much.

Looked at Yam. XS but it's soundset is so similar to my S90ES it seems like it would be redundant.

I found the Fantom's action to be the best. I liked the Juno Stage action as well, a machine that gets a bad rap but I might even consider it, it has 76 keys (not 73) and lots of decent sounds, w/out the Fantom price tag.

[GigMan]

...or you just find two or three excellent string patches that suit you and edit just them.

That is a thought that I'd even consider but then any other patch I come across that runs out on the upper octave would require the same kind of editing - not the end of the world but it's the principal of the thing: you buy an extended keyboard (usually 76 or 88, not 73) to be able to have those few extra notes up top as well as a few on the bottom, not have them bunched up down below - & buying the extended 'board is so you do not have to edit a bunch of patches to fit your playing... 'could've got the cheaper 61 keys if I was going to do that.

Who finds the layout of the 73 keys on the M3/M50 useful - anyone? Bueller? anyone?

[ekeys]

I found the Fantom's action to be the best. I liked the Juno Stage action as well, a machine that gets a bad rap but I might even consider it, it has 76 keys (not 73) and lots of decent sounds, w/out the Fantom price tag.

EM and Keyboard mag both gave the Juno Stage High Marks.

[evildragon]

That doesn't mean a thing until you go out and try it yourself

 

 

After all, keyboard action is a matter of taste. M3 appealed to me as the best unweighted synth action ever. Fantoms were so-so. Stage and Juno D were horrid. M50 was a nick better over my X5D, and that's not really much :/

[GigMan]

That doesn't mean a thing until you go out and try it yourself After all, keyboard action is a matter of taste. M3 appealed to me as the best unweighted synth action ever. Fantoms were so-so. Stage and Juno D were horrid. M50 was a nick better over my X5D, and that's not really much :/

True 'dat!

- - amazing how many different opinions/reactions come up to the same 'boards: I liked the Fantom action a lot but found the M3 action to be only so-so