The man in the middle

[tbry]

New song I'm working on...it is pretty much done at least for what I can do...suggs are welcome or just listen comments are always appreciated...Thanks!

 

http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=10550140

 

The man in the middle

 

Doesn

[grace_slick]

Yikes. Some serious stuff there, eh? I like it...it READS clumsily to me "living in a living hell" but it may not sound off. I can't listen right now...my stuff is playing up.

[Lee Knight]

I really like the idea. And most execution. I'm only talking lyrically cause I can't listen right now. So, I like everything but "living hell" and "Edgar Allen Poe". Here's why...

 

Living hell. Too melodramatic. Even if you did feel he was living in a living hell, it takes the steam out of your argument to say that. Keep showing it instead. Like Eleanor Rigby is lonely, but Paul never actually says that. All the lonely poeple... It would have robbed the melancholy of the song to sing, "She's so lonely!"

 

But I think you're doing fantastic in that department, with the exception of that line.

 

And Poe... it's too specific for the tone of the rest of the lyrics. It feels like cold water splashed on you while taking a hot bath. Plus, I don't really get the allusion. But regardless, it feels out of place.

 

But aside all that, I think you've really got something cool. I love the idea of the man in the middle not being the guy being pulled this way or that like it usually means, but you using to it to talk about riding the fence. Very cool.

[rhino55]

Disclaimer: I know some folks need them. I'm not trying to start a debate about Rx drugs

 

I read this as a piece about a guy taking prescription drugs. Lots of folks take them to get rid of life's downs but they also take away from the ups. All that's left is the middle.

 

Poe was a pretty manic kind of guy. That reference to me means the person in the middle reads Poe to feel edgy but cant really "get it," because they wont go there.

[Lee Knight]

Ah!^ Oh... yeah. That's good. Would it make sense to make that point a little clearer? It's a good direction.

[rhino55]

I do agree the living in hell reference is a bit melodramatic. I think the hell reference is cool I'd just set it up differently

[tbry]

 

Disclaimer: I know some folks need them. I'm not trying to start a debate about Rx drugs I read this as a piece about a guy taking prescription drugs. Lots of folks take them to get rid of life's downs but they also take away from the ups. All that's left is the middle. Poe was a pretty manic kind of guy. That reference to me means the person in the middle reads Poe to feel edgy but cant really "get it," because they wont go there.

 

 

Thats it or very close...it can be different for different people but my effort was to show a man distanced from himself, not really engaged enough to even understand what he is doing but all the same feels something isn't quite right.

[Lee Knight]

 

Th Edgar Allen Poe reference is used to show he is hiding in his books of fiction rather than live in reality.

 

 

I get that. It's clear but... Poe? Poe carries baggage. The name strikes a chord. Which is fine if that's what you're saying. Poe's insane. Spooky. Fantastical. Gothic. The problem for me is you alluding to something and not making it clear. Why Poe? Could it be any fiction? Then I'd say "stories". But Poe... it distracts me cause my gut says you don't really mean Poe, Poe just rhymes with "know". So that's my gut reacting.

[LCK]

I like the production. Was that a celeste?

 

I'm not sure I "get" what the song is about, though. Maybe it's just me, but I have the feeling that such a person -- who seems to waffle (or ride the fence) on every issue, who doesn't know or care what's right or wrong -- is too out of touch with his inner life to be living in a living hell. I could very well see how such a person might cause those around him to experience a living hell, but he'd be unaware that that's what he's doing.

 

Upshot: I don't think the lyric, as currently written, makes that particular case well enough.

 

Also, it doesn't feel right that such a person would be reading Edgar Allan Poe. Poe would stir up too many emotions.

 

Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

 

LCK

[tbry]

I like the production. Was that a celeste? I'm not sure I "get" what the song is about, though. Maybe it's just me, but I have the feeling that such a person -- who seems to waffle (or ride the fence) on every issue, who doesn't know or care what's right or wrong -- is too out of touch with his inner life to be living in a living hell. I could very well see how such a person might cause those around him to experience a living hell, but he'd be unaware that that's what he's doing. Upshot: I don't think the lyric, as currently written, makes that particular case well enough. Also, it doesn't feel right that such a person would be reading Edgar Allan Poe. Poe would stir up too many emotions. Anyway, that's my 2 cents. LCK

 

Stir up emotions...hmmm...your a songwriter....I would think at the very least you would want emotions...I guess it is not working on the lyrical level for some...heck actually most but for some reason I think it is somewhere inside the man.

 

Thanks..you guys are pretty much saying the same thing as another group of writers is saying....hey!!!, could you all be wrong!! Na, your right......then again I don't get half the rock and pop songs I love...Did you like the music singing production playing?

[Lee Knight]

As quoted from Wiki Genres...Poe's best known fiction works are Gothic, a genre he followed to appease the public taste. His most recurring themes deal with questions of death , including its physical signs, the effects of decomposition, concerns of premature burial, the reanimation of the dead, and mourning. The EAP reference in the lines later on says Afraid to live say goodbye farewell...he is conflicted by life and death whether physical or metaphysical...maybe thats a bit deep but its in there somewhere. Stir up emotions...hmmm...your a songwriter....I would think at the very least you would want emotions...I guess it is not working on the lyrical level for some...heck actually most but for some reason I think it is somewhere inside the man. Thanks..you guys are pretty much saying the same thing as another group of writers is saying....hey!!!, could you all be wrong!! Na, your right......then again I don't get half the rock and pop songs I love...Did you like the music singing production playing?

 

 

I like the song! Don't misunderstand me. I'm giving reaction as a writer to help cause you're asking for it. The second you say, "I'm done with the lyrics", I say, "They're GREAT!". Seriously, if you like them as is, that's great. Listening to the tune, now that I've had a chance, I'll stick by my initial assessment. Those two bits of lyric feel out of character. Even more so after listening.

 

Your performance has a direct, no bs, almost folksy appeal. Poe and living hell pull in a whole other direction. I'd focus more on that man in the middle not making choices. That's good.

 

For me. That what I think. You certainly don't have to.

 

Having said all that, I like it. As I said in my initial post, I think what you've done is clever. If you're done, great. If you're still looking to try and up the ante... cool too. I misunderstood and thought you were looking for ways to improve it? That's cool. I like it as is.

 

[rhino55]

 

I misunderstood and thought you were looking for ways to improve it?

 

 

like it was a work in progress?

[LCK]

 

Stir up emotions...hmmm...your a songwriter....I would think at the very least you would want emotions...I guess it is not working on the lyrical level for some...heck actually most but for some reason I think it is somewhere inside the man

 

 

The way you've written him, this guy seems to be unconnected to or disconnected from his emotions. If he's "living in living hell" that implies that his emotions are out of control, or that no matter how hard he tries to suppress them, they're still kicking him in the ass in some way. I'm not getting that from the lyric as currently written.

 

If he's really the "man in the middle," what is he really in the middle of?

 

Re the Poe line. Try this:

 

Not interested in truth

Doesn

[LCK]

Back from a walk. Might've found something to steer you in the "right" direction.

 

The man in the middle is comfy in his little hell.

Hasn't got any demons. If he did he'd wish them well.

 

The sun and rain are the same as far as he can tell.

It's all one shade of gray in that little hell.

 

The man in the middle is happy in his little hell.

He's as snug as a turtle living inside its shell.

 

The man in the middle will never understand

The sands are shifting, drifting through his calloused hand.

 

(You could replace calloused with "hardened" or "stony.")

 

Just a reminder, in case you're still feeling like I'm saying that this particular song isn't worthwhile: I never comment on anyone's songs unless I think they have potential, or feel they wouldn't benefit from my feedback.

 

LCK

[rhino55]

 

Back from a walk. Might've found something to steer you in the "right" direction. The man in the middle is comfy in his little hell. Hasn't got any demons. If he did he'd wish them well. The sun and rain are the same as far as he can tell. It's all one shade of gray in that little hell. The man in the middle is happy in his little hell. He's as snug as a turtle living inside its shell. The man in the middle will never understand The sands are shifting, drifting through his calloused hand. (You could replace calloused with "hardened" or "stony.") Just a reminder, in case you're still feeling like I'm saying that this particular song isn't worthwhile: I never comment on anyone's songs unless I think they have potential, or feel they wouldn't benefit from my feedback. LCK

 

 

That's cool but it raises another question, at least to me. If the man in the middle is comfortable, is he really in hell?

[Lee Knight]

I've liked it as it was but with minor changes for focus:

 

The man in the middle

 

Doesn

[LCK]

 

That's cool but it raises another question, at least to me. If the man in the middle is comfortable, is he really in hell?

 

 

I think so. But instead of a "living hell," it's a little hell, one he's acclimated himself to. He's asleep, dead inside.

 

I just came up with another word to replace calloused.

 

The man in the middle will never understand

The sands are shifting, drifting through his sleeping hand.

 

LCK

[tbry]

I like the song! Don't misunderstand me. I'm giving reaction as a writer to help cause you're asking for it. The second you say, "I'm done with the lyrics", I say, "They're GREAT!". Seriously, if you like them as is, that's great. Listening to the tune, now that I've had a chance, I'll stick by my initial assessment. Those two bits of lyric feel out of character. Even more so after listening. Your performance has a direct, no bs, almost folksy appeal. Poe and living hell pull in a whole other direction. I'd focus more on that man in the middle not making choices. That's good. For me. That what I think. You certainly don't have to. Having said all that, I like it. As I said in my initial post, I think what you've done is clever. If you're done, great. If you're still looking to try and up the ante... cool too. I misunderstood and thought you were looking for ways to improve it? That's cool. I like it as is.

 

Thanks Lee...if it sounds like I'm defensive I don't mean to be...you guys are great and I asked for suggestions and I'm getting them because there are some holes that I didn't see from someone elses POV...problem is, how do you edit out some of your most favorite parts? Leave them in and be happy or take them out and have people understand it more clearly...I usually opt for more clearly.

 

LCK...all good points...IDK what I'm gonna do now...I thought the songwriting Gods had picked me out this time and I was delivering a message of profound wisdom and knowledge!!!!

[LCK]

I thought the songwriting Gods had picked me out this time and I was delivering a message of profound wisdom and knowledge!!!!

 

They did and you were. It's all a matter of how well we're able to channel whatever message the gods or muses let us tap into.

 

I still like my suggestions better than what you've re-written. Sorry. I do sort of like one verse, though I might do it this way:

 

Got no opinions

or common sense

Keeps his balance by riding the fence

 

By the way, here's another version of the turtle line.

 

The man in the middle loves his little hell.

He's like an armadillo in its little shell.

 

LCK

[tbry]

 

I like the production. Was that a celeste? LCK

 

 

I had to look up what a Celeste was...no, it was just a cheap Yamaha keyboard set to a synth sound. Thanks for all our thoughts and ideas...for now I'll leave as is and will come back to it and refine...all good ideas.