Why we need educational equality

[JonVengeance]

Keep people stupid. Watch as crime, teen pregnancy, drug use, etc rises. Have fun living in a society where you fear for your life. Cool, you've got a Gibson, but watch out for meth and crackheads with poor education trying to rob you.

[pamackie]

huzzah for ToS!

[imgooley]

It is stupid because you know it is right. You have no argument for why it is ok to steal from those who make the money.

You're {censored}ing retarded.

Is there an abundance of heavy metals in your drinking water?

[ComOp]

That's not a very good analogy. Musical equipment is a luxury, education is a necessity. A person with a 200 dollar agile can also be a better musician than one with a 3k gibson. And then one can argue that the things that one pays more for with the gibson are ethereal, and thus, not substantive reasons for the inequitability. Better education/more oversight in the education process/more options as far as vocational education as opposed to traditional education has far more potential for equalization in this situation. IMO, what you're trying to say is not completely without merit, it's just lacking a bit of forward thinking.

 

 

Education is not a necessity. It too is a luxury. It is a luxury that most of the civilized world takes for granted and just assumes is mandatory.

 

Thing is, education IS provided. The issue is not that some people aren't recieving an education, the issue here is that someone else is getting a BETTER education and that isn't "fair".

 

I say OF COURSE they are getting a better education, they are paying for it!!!

 

When you pay for more, you should get more!

[ComOp]

Keep people stupid. Watch as crime, teen pregnancy, drug use, etc rises. Have fun living in a society where you fear for your life. Cool, you've got a Gibson, but watch out for meth and crackheads with poor education trying to rob you.

 

 

Education does not make people any less stupid. Stupid people exist in any society, reguardless of education level. No amount of wealth redistribution has ever historically fixed that problem.

[K-Bizzle]

TOS, stop it.

[TornadoOfSouls]

[Chrisjd]

TOS, stop it.

 

 

Quiet ginger.

[TornadoOfSouls]

TOS, stop it.

Don't tell me you're enjoying this AIDS of a thread.

[imgooley]

Education is not a necessity. It too is a luxury. It is a luxury that most of the civilized world takes for granted and just assumes is mandatory. Thing is, education IS provided. The issue is not that some people aren't recieving an education, the issue here is that someone else is getting a BETTER education and that isn't "fair". I say OF COURSE they are getting a better education, they are paying for it!!! When you pay for more, you should get more!

 

 

How is education anything BUT a necessity? Should those who are not afforded one till the land and lead the life of a subsistence farmer? Should they try and be employed by the near non existent manufacturing block in the U.S? Should the panhandle on the streets, and accost gentlemen like yourself in order to feed themselves? Should the keel over and die? Should they sell drugs so they have enough money for a roof over their head?

 

Poverty begets poverty. The ONLY way out of poverty is through education of some sort. If having a large sector of the populace live in squalor, oppression, inequality, bigotry, and the root of of the above, poverty, then your issue is not with education, it's with poor people.

[K-Bizzle]

Don't tell me you're enjoying this AIDS of a thread.

There are plenty of threads I don't enjoy, but thats not the point.

See you in a day.

[ComOp]

If education were equal, my parents would still be paying more, but everyone would get a Fender.

 

 

So you would prefer to live in a lowest common denominator society? Everyone has equal access to everything they "need"?

 

Personally, I prefer the society we currently live in where success is rewarded by increased levels of luxury.

[jaytee123]

There should be more "special" schools for the kids that cause trouble all the time and disrupt the learning process for kids that were raised correctly that want to learn... or at the very least can be in school and not constantly fight, sell drugs and be disruptive.

 

You need to deal with the rejects as a whole, not chase them down intermixed in an entire student body.

 

If the parents don't like it, tough {censored}. Its their responsibility to generate an attitude adjustment in their kids, not the school's.

[imgooley]

So you would prefer to live in a lowest common denominator society? Everyone has equal access to everything they "need"? Personally, I prefer the society we currently live in where success is rewarded by increased levels of luxury.

 

 

What is there to like about the current society? Those who are more affluent are becoming more affluent, and those with less stay with less. That's recipe for revolution. You might like it now when you have all you can get, but once someone tries to take that from you, you're not going to have much to say with a knife sticking out of your chest.

 

And is your measure of success monetary? What a superficial, naive, foolhardy way to measure worth.

 

I am of the lowest common denominator of society, and the only reason why I have the opportunities I have is my education. Which was paid for by the public coffers. So since my mother (single parent household) can only afford low income housing, me and my siblings are doomed to live in squalor for the rest of our lives? How is that anything other than segregation based on income?

[ComOp]

How is education anything BUT a necessity? Should those who are not afforded one till the land and lead the life of a subsistence farmer? Should they try and be employed by the near non existent manufacturing block in the U.S? Should the panhandle on the streets, and accost gentlemen like yourself in order to feed themselves? Should the keel over and die? Should they sell drugs so they have enough money for a roof over their head? Poverty begets poverty. The ONLY way out of poverty is through education of some sort. If having a large sector of the populace live in squalor, oppression, inequality, bigotry, and the root of of the above, poverty, then your issue is not with education, it's with poor people.

 

 

Ah so your entire argument is based on the idea that the education = wealth?

 

Which society on earth has ended poverty through education? None.

[imgooley]

There should be more "special" schools for the kids that cause trouble all the time and disrupt the learning process for kids that were raised correctly that want to learn... or at the very least can be in school and not constantly fight, sell drugs and be disruptive. You need to deal with the rejects as a whole, not chase them down intermixed in an entire student body. If the parents don't like it, tough {censored}. Its their responsibility to generate an attitude adjustment in their kids, not the school's.

 

 

I do agree with this to an extent. Child criminals and repeat offenders should become wards of the state, automatically. Get them out of the decrepit environment which spawned that attitude and behavior.

 

Though it is a bit more complex than that.

[JonVengeance]

There should be more "special" schools for the kids that cause trouble all the time and disrupt the learning process for kids that were raised correctly that want to learn... or at the very least can be in school and not constantly fight, sell drugs and be disruptive. You need to deal with the rejects as a whole, not chase them down intermixed in an entire student body. If the parents don't like it, tough {censored}. Its their responsibility to generate an attitude adjustment in their kids, not the school's.

 

 

The main point is that a better education should help curb the thuggish behavior. The parents being better educated would likely know how to prevent unwanted pregnancy. Then these parents would be prepared to rear kids and take part in their education. As education rises so should poverty and crime.

 

Sure there are always going to be kids with behavioral issues and they should be dealt with. A better education should produce less "rejects."

[pamackie]

Ah so your entire argument is based on the idea that the education = wealth? Which society on earth has ended poverty through education? None.

 

 

It equals opportunity. If people don't start at the same place, they don't have a fair chance of getting to the same place.

 

I don't know why I'm bothering, since you're so obviously an idiot that even teh HCAF calls you on it.

[JonVengeance]

 

Ah so your entire argument is based on the idea that the education = wealth? Which society on earth has ended poverty through education? None.

 

 

It's impossible to end poverty,but I'm sure if you look at statistics you will see that better educated societies have lower crime rates and levels and impoverished citizens.

[imgooley]

Ah so your entire argument is based on the idea that the education = wealth? Which society on earth has ended poverty through education? None.

 

 

No, my entire argument is that education=opportunity which can translate into wealth/productivity/ingenuity/etc.

 

What society has ended poverty? None. Which societies have the best education systems? The wealthiest ones. How can a person with little affluence find opportunities in the modern career market? Education.

[TheEsupremacy]

There are plenty of threads I don't enjoy, but thats not the point. See you in a day.

 

 

Banned for a day? really? I wouldn't have thought you'd go that far Kyle. Maybe I missed something.

[ComOp]

The main point is that a better education should help curb the thuggish behavior. The parents being better educated would likely know how to prevent unwanted pregnancy. Then these parents would be prepared to rear kids and take part in their education. As education rises so should poverty and crime. Sure there are always going to be kids with behavioral issues and they should be dealt with. A better education should produce less "rejects."

 

 

 

I disagree that it is a lack of education that is the culprit for the rise in unwanted pregnancy or in the rise of thugish behavior and overall "bad" parenting.

 

We have had public education in place for well over a century in most western nations. Things aren't getting better.

[madryan]

Couple of things for clarification.

 

1) Education, both the requirement to fund it and the requirement to attend it is compulsory in our country.

 

2) Since we've got the federal government (and to a lesser extent the state and local government) holding a gun to our heads demanding we pay for the schools we should be able to demand performance from our teachers. This is not often the case.

 

3) My stepdad was a teacher for 3 decades. He hates the fact that you essentially can't get rid of a bad teacher. The lobby is so strong that the teacher in question has to get caught fornicating with a student or something similarly serious to get actually fired. This isn't helping the problem.

 

4) District to district pay is widely different and as others have stated the talent goes where the money is. Additionally there's no such thing as merit based pay (thanks again to the union) so the gym teacher who occasionally teaches drivers ed or health gets paid the same as a physics teacher with the same seniority. Sounds {censored}ed to me.

 

Until someone fixes the infrastructure in the public school system that primarily relates to many of the issues I've raised nothing is going to change and that says nothing of the parents.

[imgooley]

I disagree that it is a lack of education that is the culprit for the rise in unwanted pregnancy or in the rise of thugish behavior and overall "bad" parenting. We have had public education in place for well over a century in most western nations. Things aren't getting better.

 

 

Do you have any evidence for your claims?

[imgooley]

Couple of things for clarification. 1) Education, both the requirement to fund it and the requirement to attend it is compulsory in our country. 2) Since we've got the federal government (and to a lesser extent the state and local government) holding a gun to our heads demanding we pay for the schools we should be able to demand performance from our teachers. This is not often the case. 3) My stepdad was a teacher for 3 decades. He hates the fact that you essentially can't get rid of a bad teacher. The lobby is so strong that the teacher in question has to get caught fornicating with a student or something similarly serious to get actually fired. This isn't helping the problem. 4) District to district pay is widely different and as others have stated the talent goes where the money is. Additionally there's no such thing as merit based pay (thanks again to the union) so the gym teacher who occasionally teaches drivers ed or health gets paid the same as a physics teacher with the same seniority. Sounds {censored}ed to me. Until someone fixes the infrastructure in the public school system that primarily relates to many of the issues I've raised nothing is going to change and that says nothing of the parents.

 

Points one and two are parts of the argument I was making earlier.

 

I totally agree with all the statements here.