Members jerry_picker Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by RaVenCAD Not by me. I've owned 2 of them and adored both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members strat_predator Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Were all of those pics from the Mexico plant? I swear that I saw some American looking Fenders, especially near the end. Also, does Fender Mexico make guitars for Charvel and Jackson? I saw some of those and others (that V type guitar). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members georges Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 zomg jenga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stonefoot Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by RaVenCAD Not by me. I've owned 2 of them and adored both. Word. My Mexican Classic kicks all kinds of ass, I'd get another one but I'm not sure if I really need a fourth Strat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mika Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 So where are the elves that build the geetars for santa??? JK So you guys like your Mex fenders, maybe I should get one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kentuckyklira Posted April 16, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by Mika So where are the elves that build the geetars for santa??? JK So you guys like your Mex fenders, maybe I should get one. I don´t have one and doubt I´ll get one soon. From what I´ve heard and seen, there are a few issues. Most important for me, the quality of their fret material is supposed to be disgraceful. They might have changed that now, but I´ve seen some older MiM Fenders that hadn´t seen much action, but had fretwear as if they had been gigged with every night for a few years! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members axegrinder Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 I think there is a lot more handwork than you realize at any factory (asian, mexican, etc.). You don't think the production work is actually exported because they have cheaper machines do you? The difference is labor costs & material supply, pure & simple. If a factory allowed its workers to spend more time on each instrument then certain details would be attended to better: * Wood selection suffers when one is rushed.* Assembly problems and mistakes go up when one doen't take their time.* A good finish takes time too. If a factory gave its workers better materials to work with, of course the end product benefits: * Quality wood equals better tone and in some cases is easier to work with.* Properly cured wood equals instruments that take finish better and are lighter in weight.* Better machinery and better cutters make the job easier for the workers.* Better hardware and electrical components make a HUGE difference that we talk about everyday here. In the end, ALL of this is affected more by the manner in which the factory is managed, NOT by the people who strap on the safety equipment (whatever is provided) and push the wood and wire through the processing. Give the workers better materials and more time and you get better instruments at the other end, but they cost more. Give the workers medical benefits & paid vacations, and institute more labor laws.... costs go up. I'm not saying it's right or wrong...it just is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members strat_predator Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by axegrinder I think there is a lot more handwork than you realize at any factory (asian, mexican, etc.). You don't think the production work is actually exported because they have cheaper machines do you? The difference is labor costs & material supply, pure & simple.If a factory allowed its workers to spend more time on each instrument then certain details would be attended to better:* Wood selection suffers when one is rushed.* Assembly problems and mistakes go up when one doen't take their time.* A good finish takes time too.If a factory gave its workers better materials to work with, of course the end product benefits:* Quality wood equals better tone and in some cases is easier to work with.* Properly cured wood equals instruments that take finish better and are lighter in weight.* Better machinery and better cutters make the job easier for the workers.* Better hardware and electrical components make a HUGE difference that we talk about everyday here.In the end, ALL of this is affected more by the manner in which the factory is managed, NOT by the people who strap on the safety equipment (whatever is provided) and push the wood and wire through the processing. Give the workers better materials and more time and you get better instruments at the other end, but they cost more. Give the workers medical benefits & paid vacations, and institute more labor laws.... costs go up. I'm not saying it's right or wrong...it just is. That is true. It's not like American workers in American factories (Gibson, PRS, etc) are any better trained or educated than the workers in that Mexican factory or factories over in Korea. It's all about the quality of materials used, the quality of machinery, and the morale of the workers. American factories use better materials and machinery and possibly are better to their employees (good wages, benefits, etc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members supercow3 Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by JimAnsell i wish we had a ton of pics of the korean factories too. +1It would be very interesting to see those guitars being manufactured in the korean factories:thu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GRANKOR Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by cloudnine Mexico... Catholics... ... I am 100% positive that the man on the right is Yuriy (sp?) Shishkov, one of the Custom Shop master builders. here he is with Jimmy Page BTW he's russian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members xspace Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Wow... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members supercow3 Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by GRANKOR I am 100% positive that the man on the right is Yuriy (sp?) Shishkov, one of the Custom Shop master builders. here he is with Jimmy Page BTW he's russian yuri looks more like a roc star than page:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BowerR64 Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 I didnt know the VanHalen Charvels were MIM? I thought they were San Dimas or somthing? And i didnt know they did the relic {censored} at that place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cloudnine Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Are you sure some of this isnt Fender USA? SRV Strats, EVH Charvels...AFAIK all the EVHs are custom shop. And no Jacksons are MIM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GRANKOR Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by BowerR64 I didnt know the VanHalen Charvels were MIM? I thought they were San Dimas or somthing? And i didnt know they did the relic {censored} at that place. I don't think all the pics are from the mexico factory, there's been custom shop master builders pop up in there, and in the Charvel pic you can see a Jackson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BowerR64 Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 I wouldnt be suprised if they were MIM with made in USA on the headstock though. I mean we know that some of the {censored} we buy that says made in the usa isnt but this would be just one more thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Buckethead2 Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Did anyone notice the picture of the double cutaway tele on the wall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members axegrinder Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by strat_predator That is true. It's not like American workers in American factories (Gibson, PRS, etc) are any better trained or educated than the workers in that Mexican factory or factories over in Korea. It's all about the quality of materials used, the quality of machinery, and the morale of the workers. American factories use better materials and machinery and possibly are better to their employees (good wages, benefits, etc). I can't speak to all that: Are American workers better educated? I would like to compare the percentage of domestic workers to those abroad who have high school level educations. Labor laws in the USA probably translate to more training especially with regard to safety. Of course it's all done to avoid a lawsuit, not because any of the big cheeses give a {censored}. I don't know first hand how they are treated abroad, but I hear bad things. Is morale higher in American factories? I imagine many of them clock out and climb into POS cars and sit next to some rich bitch in a bimmer in commute traffic. You can bet if it's an American worker that they probably want more (because they are told they deserve more). Will there come a day when the workers in timbuktu realize they deserve more? Everyone deserves more...I want more guitars! Better machinery? Materials? I couldn't say. I believe at one time (I will say more than 75 years ago) the culture in america was that the imported {censored} was the good {censored}. Since WWII we've been taught otherwise. So US guitar makers who also have import lines (Gibson, BC Rich, Dean, Fender, PRS) have taken the approach that the american lines will get the better hardware & better material. The import lines get the cheaper stuff. They could have marketed the import guitars as exotic and given them the good wood, hardware, and pickups, but it would go against our patriotic culture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members axegrinder Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Is it possble that they have a few competors instruments lying around in an R&D department? OR perhaps the OP wandered across the border without realizing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members supercow3 Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by axegrinder I can't speak to all that:Are American workers better educated? I would like to compare the percentage of domestic workers to those abroad who have high school level educations. Definitely not anymore..the american education used to be the best in the world but now its no where near the top 20 in the world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members strat_predator Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by axegrinder I can't speak to all that:Are American workers better educated? I would like to compare the percentage of domestic workers to those abroad who have high school level educations. Not likely. It's not like the workers in the Mexican factory just wandered in off of the street. I'm sure that Fender Mexico has certain qualifications that need to be met. Plus, it's not like a high school education REALLY matters for this job; it's not like it makes them more qualified anyway. No one is learning to make guitars, amps, or guitar parts in high school. My main point on the education thing was that it is not likely that any factory worker at any guitar factory (in any country) has anything beyond a high school education or at least needs more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Splendor Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by GRANKOR I am 100% positive that the man on the right is Yuriy (sp?) Shishkov, one of the Custom Shop master builders. here he is with Jimmy Page BTW he's russian Bingo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GRANKOR Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 well spotted eagle eyes!! I didn't notice that, I just recognised him from an article about him in a guitar magazine, searched for a picture and found that one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hhsuey Posted April 16, 2006 Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Child labor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kentuckyklira Posted April 16, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 16, 2006 Originally posted by cloudnine Are you sure some of this isnt Fender USA? SRV Strats, EVH Charvels...AFAIK all the EVHs are custom shop. And no Jacksons are MIM. As I already said on the Ibanez thread, I just copied these pics from a German site and posted them here because I figured you might like them. No guarantee that they´re all Fender Mexico. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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