What Kind of Mixer/PA/Speakers Do I Need?

What kind of PA/mixer/speakers would an acoustic duo or trio need for this:

*small acoustic-style venues

*using 300-watt keyboard amp (w/ 4 channels)

*using 150-watt guitar amp

*using 3 vocal mics.

*lacking mixer

*lacking PA and speakers (so far just using our amps)

*lacking monitors (are these necessary here?)

*lacking much money!

my friends are wrapped in their Bose L1 systems - light and easy to setup, have a distinctive sound of their own unmatched by standard PAs they tell me. I know Craig likes his. You don't need foldback as they are setup behind you.

http://www.bose.com/controller?url=/shop_online/speakers/portable_amplification_systems/index.jsp

Are you using your instrument amplifiers for vocals too? If it works, keep doing it. If it doesn't work very well for you, how loud do you play those 300 and 150 watt amps? Is there a bass? Drums? Horns?

If it's basically an acoustic gig with electric instruments, I'd go for a Fender Passport Pro system and just run your vocals through it. If you're not too loud, you can probably position the speakers so that you hear them from where you're playing and they'll serve as monitors. If you need monitors, then it's probably better to start assembling a system from individual components.

Everybody wants monitors but not everyone needs them. It's mostly a matter of the size of the venue and the style of the music.

Depends on your volume level & what type of venues you play. A Bose is good for places with up to 150 people or so, with moderate (

In ear monitors are an option (and a lot easier to carry than stage wedges).

I like the JBL Eons for medium sized venues, and they double nicely as stage monitor for larger gigs, such as outside festivals.

Yes, so far we've run one mic through the one XLR input on my keyboard amp with decent results...but that's only 1 mic. Would it be possible to run all vocal mics to a small mixer, then run that to the XLR input on that amp and be done with it? No additional costs this way other than the small mixer.

150 watt guitar amp?! Sell that and get a 30 watt combo.

Low budget, I'd recommend a PA package deal like those here:

http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/live-sound/live-sound-packages

Here's a good one:

http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/Behringer-UB1222FX-Harbinger-APS15-PA-Package?sku=631030

I don't give a crap less what others may say about Behringer stuff because the fact is; if your act sounds good, it'll sound good through the Behringer stuff. If your act sucks, it'll still suck coming through the $2K Bose system.

Actually, I was just guessing at the wattage on the other amp. That may be odd guess. Ok, I looked at some of those packages on your link. Question: Could we run our amps - one 300 watt, the other may be 200? - through a PA that states that it is 200 watt? Does the PA wattage have to be higher than amps one is running through it? Or were you suggesting those only for our vocals?

You don't "run your amps through" the PA. You might want to mic them, but probably not.

(I suppose you could line out from the amps if they have a line send)

I seriously doubt your guitar amp is rated over 100w, unless it's solid state, and even then it will have the potential of being way too loud. I would search out good used gear on ebay and craigslist. You could get a good Yamaha or Mackie 808 powered mixer and some Yamaha Club series speakers and have something that sounds good and will last you, rather than some flimsy crap that sounds weak. If bought used, you could probably find those, your speaker cables, and a couple of 12" floor wedges for around a grand. It would be money well-spent.

I would recommend just running the vocals through the PA. If your amps have direct outs you could plug those into the mixer but I wouldn't think it would be necessary and it would just complicate the setup.

As Cooter mentions you could buy used gear and probably get some good stuff as well. It's all a balancing act because when you buy used gear there is no warranty or support and it's pretty hard to really know how the stuff has been treated.

I'm not much of a "brand loyalty" guy because I've seen good and bad products from nearly all these music gear manufacturers.

Just for sake of argument, if I invested in PA equipment that in the long-run I might want to use for a full band, is there a minimum wattage on the PA mixer I should go for? That is, if my 300 watt amp is run through...er...if I line out it to a PA that's only 200 watt, is that okay, or would there be some risk of blowing something?

Sure, that would be possible, and it would work, too, if your playing situation is that you can get adequate coverage with the vocals all coming through that keyboard amplifier. Practically every mixer you'll find will be stereo, so you'll want to take just one of the pair of outputs, setting the pans on the mixer either to the center or all the way to the channel that you're connecting to the amplifier.

To make connections easier for yourself, look for a mixer that has XLR main outputs and a switch that selects whether the output is at mic or line level. You'll want it at mic level. I have a cheap Behringer mixer that's like that. But you can adapt anything if you find a mixer with a different output arrangement.

It's a good way, too, to start building a more sophisticated system. You could send an auxiliary output of that mixer to a powered speaker and use that as a vocal monitor. Or if you decide that you need to put the vocals through speakers to get better coverage, you can connect the mixer's output to a pair of powered speakers and put them up on poles. And leave them at home when playing a smaller venue where your keyboard amplifier will be all you need for vocals.

You need to understand that a mixer and a power amp are different things even though they are often combined in compact systems.

A mixer deals in mic/line level signals only. Power amps and speakers have wattage ratings/limits.

When you run your guitar/keyboard amp to your mixer you're only dealing with a line level signal.

You should repost your original question in the Baskstage With the Band forum.

One last thing I want to throw at you guys since you've seen my above post, know what I have and what I'm lacking. I just got a Craigslist "WTT" offer for a Kustom Profile 300 watt PA system (150 watt for each speaker) for an old guitar of mine (worth around $300). Would that be preferable to piecemealing onto what I already have (see original post)?

That's a decision that only you can make. Since it's Craig's List, it's probably local. Why not go over and take a look and a listen to it? If you think it will meet your needs, at least for a while, and you won't miss the guitar, go for it. I didn't find a Profile 300, but I found a Profile 2 that's 300 watts, probably what you're talking about. It seems like it will work for you at least for now.

Check it out thoroughly. Make sure all the controls work and that it doesn't hum or buzz.