Members crabby Posted February 15, 2004 Members Share Posted February 15, 2004 tell me about your g force,i just dropped the coin for one ,id like some input,is it better than g major?that much better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Moveable Beast Posted February 15, 2004 Members Share Posted February 15, 2004 Crabby, I currently have one of the G-Force and the G-Major. The G-Force (24-bit) is quieter than the G-Major, and the quality of the effects is infinitesimally better. Obviously, you have a lot more flexibility with the G-Force. If you're looking for pro-level gear, the G-Force fits the bill. If you're looking for stuff a small notch below, the G-Major is a great and economical alternative. Personally, I'll be selling one or the other. I have them both for sale locally, and when one sells, I'll happily keep the other. *SPAM* If anyone's interested, I'm selling the G-Major for $350 firm and the G-Force for $800 firm. Tack on $15 for shipping to the lower 48. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scarecrowfields Posted February 15, 2004 Members Share Posted February 15, 2004 I might be interested in the gforce for 800. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Moveable Beast Posted February 16, 2004 Members Share Posted February 16, 2004 scarecrowfields, check your PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tonedoctor1 Posted February 16, 2004 Members Share Posted February 16, 2004 Originally posted by crabby tell me about your g force,i just dropped the coin for one ,id like some input,is it better than g major?that much better You made the right purchase. The gmajor is not in the same league as the gforce. If you are looking for a single processor for a guitar system the gforce is ideally suited for this task. As with any dsp I would still employ the use of a mixer though. The only way you can sometimes get around it is if your amp/preamp has a parallel effects loop and not all the time then is it possible. To my ears even then it`s not the same tranparency as a good outboard mixer ie; cae dual stereo line mixer, DMC system mix, soundsculpture switchblade. Enjoy your purchase! Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members e-monkey Posted February 16, 2004 Members Share Posted February 16, 2004 How does the G Force compare to some of the comparable Eventide units like the Orville or other ones ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tonedoctor1 Posted February 16, 2004 Members Share Posted February 16, 2004 Originally posted by e-monkey How does the G Force compare to some of the comparable Eventide units like the Orville or other ones ? The eclipse is a single rack space multieffects unit like the gforce. It sounds damn good too. New it`s like $1950 instead of the gforce`s $1300. The eclipse actually sounds richer and a little more 3-dimensional. The thing that was a little disturbing about it for me was that the guitar sort of got lost in the eclipse. When I was auditioning both the gforce always sounded like guitar with effects and the eclipse always sounded like the eclipse with some guitar added. Now this may not necessarily be a bad thing with the eclipse depending on what a guy is going for with effects. Personally, I`ve come down firmly on the side of always still sounding like a guitar but the other has it`s merits as well.The other thing to point out is while I definately worked the both processors for a while there are a lot of layers to the programming in the eclipse and even though I dialed the effect levels down quite a bit there still could have been underlying parameters that would have allowed me to preserve more of the guitar`s natural sound.The gforce on the otherhand was damn near instant gratification. My eventide H3000 also was instant gratification. The eclipse is definately a little different animal though but it`s true rewards may be a little hidden it however still sounded damn good. my 2 cents, Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hurnsradi Posted February 16, 2004 Members Share Posted February 16, 2004 Is the Eventide Eclipse useable for live performances?I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Amory_tarr Posted February 16, 2004 Members Share Posted February 16, 2004 Originally posted by hurnsradi Is the Eventide Eclipse useable for live performances?I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tonedoctor1 Posted February 16, 2004 Members Share Posted February 16, 2004 Originally posted by Amory_tarr I'm in the same situation, and have heard from a few over at the Eventidehelps yahoo forum that with version 2.5 software, the preset lag is very minimal, making it finally usable for live stuff. This is my understanding. The switching lag didn`t look too bad at all. Now this can be a very personal thing. A minimal lag to one guy might be far too big a gap for the next guy. This is particuarly an issue when you are relying on one processor for all your effects.One of the benefits to having multiple dedicated processors is I have a processor for reverb that has no lag, and my delays have no lag and neither does my chorus units, so I can live with a slight lag in my H3000 because it`s only doing pitch in my system. This allows me to use it and the lag is not even really noticeable. I would say it this way; the gforce is optimized for live use in a guitar rig(templates for midi switchers with cc`s assigned to switch in and out various effects on the fly). The eclipse is not but will work and also has ongoing support from the manufactor. I would suggest anyone who is considering a single processor, download both manuals and go thru the features and then audition both to see which you prefer the sound of more. Hope this helps you guys out some, Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bob Greaves Posted February 17, 2004 Members Share Posted February 17, 2004 Originally posted by crabby tell me about your g force,i just dropped the coin for one ,id like some input... I have one, but appear to be one of the few who are not entirely convinced so far. I'm really trying to like it, as I have a few TC boxes, all of which work great, but I'm still not blown away. Despite others comments, I find the unit does create a little noise, which is in the form of a very faint digital 'whine', rather than the more common and arguably more manageable hiss. I haven't found stereo separation to be great and the unit seems a little cold sounding. I have a 2290 and it really is in a different league... Am I the only one with doubts?... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tonedoctor1 Posted February 17, 2004 Members Share Posted February 17, 2004 Originally posted by Bob Greaves I have one, but appear to be one of the few who are not entirely convinced so far.I'm really trying to like it, as I have a few TC boxes, all of which work great, but I'm still not blown away.Despite others comments, I find the unit does create a little noise, which is in the form of a very faint digital 'whine', rather than the more common and arguably more manageable hiss. I haven't found stereo separation to be great and the unit seems a little cold sounding. I have a 2290 and it really is in a different league...Am I the only one with doubts?... Bob, I don`t think you`re the only one. Terri from this forum and several others have expressed similar feelings. I haven`t heard the thing about a whine but others have expressed that some TC stuff can sound kinda cold and or sterile to them. There is no doubt the 2290 is in another league but for the purposes of this discussion I`ve tried to leave out that since the concern seems to be a single dedicated processor. I myself have committed to dedicated processors for everthing and as much analog stuff as possible without giving up flexibility. IMO, I find that what some hear as cold or sterile others hear as transparent. I further find that the other pieces of gear being used in conjunction can have considerable influence on how one piece appears to sound.There is such a thing as system synergy. If you have a particuarly warm sounding amp/source tone a processor that is very clean and transparent might be just the ticket. If a person`s source tone is very clear and detailed maybe a warm, very character influenced processor is what does the trick. Also I have found cables do make a difference(audio, speaker, and power) but that`s a whole other story and many don`t want to believe or except that. I have listened to the same piece of gear with say george l`s(not bad cable at all) and then hooked it up with Evidence Audio and heard the piece sound richer, fuller, and warmer because of a more complete spectrum of frequencies present. In case anyone is wondering my whole rig is wired with Evidence Audio cables audio and speaker, and I`m beginning to incorporate the power cables as well.Switchers, mixers, use of buffers, how things are wired, how a rig is grounded all play a considerable role in how a piece may sound in a particular system as well.I use a Sound Sculpture switchblade GL for switching/mixing and it`s audio connections are balanced which allows me to run all my DSP effects balanced and I`ve found that makes a difference as well in how they sound(ie; increased headroom, better signal to noise, purer, no ground loops)To me it`s all about putting together the right combination of pieces that deliver the sound one hears in his head. There are many good pieces out there but they don`t all sound great together.I also own several TC pieces and really like them. I have an M2000 for verb, 2 Dtwo`s for delays, and 2 scf`s for chorus, and then a H3000 for pitch. This combination is working real well for me. I`ve gone thru and auditioned a lot of gear to find this combination and it`s working nicely at the moment. I`ve never had the gforce in my rig but I did in a friends just to test it and we found it sounded really nice. I also didn`t notice any stereo separation problems. I will say that the eclipse we tested at the same time had a bigger sonic footprint and the imaging was more 3-dimentional. It also had more character. They both had their merits though. Sorry for the book. I guess I can consider myself a published author now. LOL Hope it helps someone! Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bob Greaves Posted February 17, 2004 Members Share Posted February 17, 2004 Thanks, Tom. My setup works pretty faultlessly otherwise, so I don't really want to shell out a heap of cash on mixers, etc. just to make the GForce work better. Besides which, the TC 2290 has a pretty decent built-in 'switcher' which sadly still doesn't seem to please the GForce any. I get a noticeable slight volume drop when the GF is switched-in. The only way to maintain level therefore, is to raise either the GF's input or output gain (above their present '0'), neither of which is a particularly great idea. I've tried running the GF after the Triaxis (instead of in the loop) but without improving my opinion of the sound. Given that I don't use it for much more than chorus/flange and reverb, I might just ditch it for a TC 1210 and a Lexicon PCM reverb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members crabby Posted February 18, 2004 Author Members Share Posted February 18, 2004 dude,you seem to know your stuff,im impressed,my rig now contains a marshall mode 4,2 marshall mf280 cabs,vht pitbull ul,vht 2150 pwr amp,four vht pitbull 4x12 cabs,furman pwr,korg 1000 inline tuner,nady wireless,hush superc,dunlop crybaby rack wah,yamaha rev 500(reverbs)tc d-two (delays)tc g force I replace my g major im now selling,dunlop ts1 tremelo,mxr flanger,mxr phase 100,boss octave,boss aw3 wah(humanizer effect is cool),boss super shifter,and now im ordering a switchblade gl,which i hope will make my life easy hooking all this up,also think the g force will replace the boss pedals,and then my all access foot control to click thru it all.any advice for me?let me have it,tnks chris....will this switchblade truly make it easy to set up all this,is it easy to use winblade? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tonedoctor1 Posted February 19, 2004 Members Share Posted February 19, 2004 Originally posted by crabby dude,you seem to know your stuff,im impressed,my rig now contains a marshall mode 4,2 marshall mf280 cabs,vht pitbull ul,vht 2150 pwr amp,four vht pitbull 4x12 cabs,furman pwr,korg 1000 inline tuner,nady wireless,hush superc,dunlop crybaby rack wah,yamaha rev 500(reverbs)tc d-two (delays)tc g force I replace my g major im now selling,dunlop ts1 tremelo,mxr flanger,mxr phase 100,boss octave,boss aw3 wah(humanizer effect is cool),boss super shifter,and now im ordering a switchblade gl,which i hope will make my life easy hooking all this up,also think the g force will replace the boss pedals,and then my all access foot control to click thru it all.any advice for me?let me have it,tnks chris....will this switchblade truly make it easy to set up all this,is it easy to use winblade? Thanks and just hope to help in some way. The switchblade gl will definately make like easier for you. It will allow you to hook up your gear in a very clean fashion and make use of any balanced connections. Also you will have routing options/flexibility that you would never have any other way. The winblade in definately very straightforward and easy to use. I would recommend initially getting familiar with the front panel though only because if you are at a rehearsal, gig, or session and want to make a small tweak you need to know your way around the front panel. I`ve had my gl for few years now and when I setup my new rig recently I did all the setup and programming ahead of time in winblade. It`s really nice to have a graphical representation of your routing. Then once everything was patched and ready to audition, I have begun doing the final tweaking for my presets one at a time using the front panel. Once I`m done then I can download these final versions from the gl to winblade on my laptop and print them out if I like. I also have an Alesis datadisk in my rig that I back up all the processors to in case something weird happens at a gig/rehearsal/session. If you haven`t bought the unit yet see: Brian in guitars @ washington music center. great guy and good place to buy. Tell him Tom sent you. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tonedoctor1 Posted February 19, 2004 Members Share Posted February 19, 2004 Bob, I can certainly understand why you are doing what you`re doing. It makes sense in your particular situation at this time. I will say you may be happier with the gforce`s sound in your rig by incorporating the use of a mixer though.I recommend them to everyone though who employs a dsp effect in their rigs. I`ve just heard it over and over what it can do for a system. At any rate enjoy your rig you`ve got some great gear. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr Ten Posted February 19, 2004 Members Share Posted February 19, 2004 i thought the g-force was fun and interesting at first and later found it poor and annoying. i found it very easy to work with but felt the effects sounded rather thin, cold, digital, and felt the effect output was OFTEN inconsistent across parameters. it's a decent unit but i'd much rather buy it used than new. it was a fun first rack effects unit but i'll not go back to it. maybe the eventide stuff in the future, maybe not. whatever works for you, enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tonedoctor1 Posted February 19, 2004 Members Share Posted February 19, 2004 I`m just curious. How many people that feel the gforce is cold and sterile are actually using an outboard mixer in their systems with the processor set to full wet?Believe me this is not a new concept as I`ve heard it before about TC effects in general as I stated earlier. I`m not trying to knock anyone but just trying to understand how it`s being used in most people`s systems. I`m all about furthering my understanding of what`s going on in rigs, how different gear sonically imprints, and why they sound a certain way or how various sounds are acheived. Mr Ten, One of the things about having a single processor do everything and having a number of different routings available in it is that a series chain of effects will result in a higher perceptible db level as opposed to a parallel routing. So this may explain why you heard varied output levels across parameters. I don`t want to sound like I`m just sitting here defending the gforce because I do understand where you guys are coming from and personally still believe in seperate processor instead of a single multieffect until otherwise convinced. But, the gforce does seem like a viable alternative for a guy that doesn`t want to run a bunch of seperate processors and doesn`t have the room/loops for it.If you are not running this device or any dsp effect without a mixer though you are running straight thru the d/a and a/d convertors in the piece and that always sound cold and sterile even if a little more so with TC stuff.A parallel loop does prevent this exact thing from happening but it still doesn`t sound the same to my ear as an outboard mixer designed for this application . my 2 cents, Tom ps: btw, I really am enjoying this discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hurnsradi Posted February 19, 2004 Members Share Posted February 19, 2004 I thought a lot too about adding a Switcher for my Gear!But i don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tonedoctor1 Posted February 19, 2004 Members Share Posted February 19, 2004 Originally posted by hurnsradi I thought a lot too about adding a Switcher for my Gear!But i don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hurnsradi Posted February 19, 2004 Members Share Posted February 19, 2004 Tom Thanks for your help!But doesn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tonedoctor1 Posted February 19, 2004 Members Share Posted February 19, 2004 Originally posted by hurnsradi Tom Thanks for your help!But doesn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members crabby Posted February 20, 2004 Author Members Share Posted February 20, 2004 is the switchblade considered a mixer?if not which do you prefer,i have several tc effects units,ive used them in the effects loop,ive never felt they were sterile,always thought they were warm and rich sounding,lexicon sounded thin and sterile too me,havent played with a eclipse though there is a lot of crap on their that it would never use, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bob Greaves Posted February 20, 2004 Members Share Posted February 20, 2004 Originally posted by crabby ...i have several tc effects units,ive used them in the effects loop,ive never felt they were sterile,always thought they were warm and rich sounding... That's my point really: Any other TC effect I've used has been great, but not the GForce to my ears (so far anyway) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rai168 Posted February 20, 2004 Members Share Posted February 20, 2004 I gotta agree w Tom. He brings up an excellent point (as well as he being on top of his proverbial game haha all the respect in the wolrd Tom!) I think a huge (guessing/asking?) part of this may because of the mixer/parallel/serial loop thing. I mean I couldn't imagine my tone running thru my Mod Pro, then the Echo Pro, and then The G Force - as well as whatever pedals I choose... I have a VooDoo Amps Modded VHT UL w EQ which I control via MIDI.(Axess CFX-4) I have MY tone and it's cool knowing there is no other amp that sounds like it - while it kills and still sounds warm doing so. I didn't fully know what I was getting into when I bought my Switchblade 8b. I knew it was a Switcher and you could control levels. It initially was recommended by Frank Vicario from the band Snapcase who I respect alot. Then Jim Fowler and Tom both recommended it to me. After a solid yr of playing w it, getting used to it - I could NOT live w/out it. I avoid all the crap AD/DA situations and experience no coldness - at least w the pieces/pedals I run. Winblade is invaluable and makes creating patches a breeze - let alone the fact I can carry a laptop w me and create patches on the road should I need to. Really takes no time. I also fully recommend the 8b. You get far more advantages w running balanced. (Case in point both L6 Modelers I run) Also as Tom mentioned one can run configurations not possible w a conventional switcher. That all said I understand working w/in a budget (more than you'd care to know haha) I'd still recommend a line mixer of some sort - possibly the System Mix Plus by DMC - seems like a cheap decent alternative. Does Axess have anything the way of Line Mixers? If not they should - Mario puts out one hell of a product.... Keep in mind - I'm fairly newer to the rack effects world. (past 2-3 yrs or so) and my need for effects in my band which plays a mix of Hardcore/Metal/Rock/Ambient/Atmospheric type music. Think Portishead/Bjork meets Helmet/Quicksand/Snapcase/VOD/Glassjaw - w a lil Slayer/Machine Head thrown in at times for good measure (heh) If I haven't scared any of you off yet (lol) my effects needs go from little to full blown dripping effects. The Switchblade lets me get this. I'm newer to FX but not tone. I've experienced semi-pro/regional play having shared the stage w national acts as well as regional major radio play - point being a.) I don't back crap (haha) and b.) I won't settle for anything that takes away from the tone I worked so hard to get. Hope that factors into your perception of what my tonal needs/standards are and how a line mixer literally saves my ass in this scenario. And Tom ? If it weren't for people like Tom and Jim Fowler - who have literally educated me every step of the way on this stuff - I wouldn't know 1/2 of what I know re: effects. I can't thank Tom/Jim enough and they are a true asset to the board. My $.02 Thanks guys Rai // www.DatsMusic.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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