Light Music sync

[Bonus]

How is this achieved,

 

Presume its some software.......fill me in cheers.

[Schlam]

yes, software...And hardware, and alot of patience over the month, with nothing else to do.... LOL

 

Im assuming you mean you would like to run an audio file (backing track or click track for a drummer??)), and have the light show do what you programmed it to do at certain points??

OK, ready for one huge stinking can of worms???LOL

 

For starters, you need to be quite PC savvy.

I can give you what I've done up to this point, Im sure there are other ways, but finding the information is the tricky part. ;-)

 

You need a laptop/desktop with USB.

Buy an "open USB-DMX" converter OR a USB-DMX Pro. This will come with software...... actually, the hardware comes with the software...LOL

I got EntTec LightFactory. This software will run the light show with an operator, or it can be triggered by certain things (I've chosen to sync to timecode).

The tricky part comes in when you are running a 3-4 hour show like I am. Doing it this way requires you to be really happy with your setlist.

Make one huge wav or mp3 file of the entire show, run it in WinAmp (which, strangely enough, is one of the only players that outputs timecode).

Light factory needs to be opened once winamp is already open to link properly.

Use Cool Edit, or some other editor to mark out the timecodes that represent the change spots, and write it all down.

Go into Light factory, set up your scenes and show runners, as per the instructions. Set each song to its own show runner, and assign a "go command" number (like a midi note number).

Take your timecodes and enter them into the "external triggers" list along with the "go command" numbers.

 

Go back to WinAmp, reopen Lightfactory, run the show.

Providing you have setup Lightfactory correctly (so it runs with you providing the "go"(cue) commands, and you have some DMX lights attached(well duh)... you should be in business.

I got a DMX Dimmer to run my par cans, 2X 250w Colour Changers and 2X 350w scanners going.

 

Its a bloody steep learning curve mate.

Bottomline is though, Im Windows advanced but I've never used DMX lighting before, I understood how it worked, but had never used it. One month later, I have a virtual lighting guy, not too flexible, or helpful packing down (LOL) but its bloody effective.

If you spend soooo long perfecting the sound, why not spend equal time making it look good too??

Read the manuals, work on a single song first, then plan a whole set, then a whole show....

 

Im still trying to find a better way though.

I need to find a media player that will output the setlists timecode, not reset to 00:00:00:00 on the next song (the logical way to create a player I guess).

 

Then I only need to select the song in (the player), the show runner to use in LFactory, and the set can change on a whim.

 

Anyone good at creating simple media players??? There'd be a market (albeit small) for it.

 

I hope this helps you somewhat....

Cheers

Matt

[Schlam]

If you get this far, this might help you too...

 

If, at the end of it all, when running WinAmp the entire show seems to be running behind of your timecode cues, this is probably due to latency.

Dont start adjusting the external triggers list, open the audio file in Cool edit, and add silence to the beginning to the file (I needed to add half a second (20 frames @ 40fps) so that the playback was in sync.

 

Its rewarding when you get to that point, all of a sudden it all works. ;-)

Cheers

Matt

[Khazul]

The real answer to this has to be to find a VST plugin than can drive your DMX hardware for something like ableton Live and then do all your light programming as short midi clips.

 

The other day I came across a USB-DMX controler for windows that had some Win32 API documentation with it - so thought about writing a VST wrapper for it.

 

Now to remember where I found it - grrrrr!

 

Oh another excellent trick I have found with controller with an audio input - just give them a really clear direct audio feed from a drum machine - say just kick and snare - dont feed them with exactly the same drum machine sound that you using - the point is just to give the light controller enough sound to work with, but not enough to confuse it.

[gbprs1]

I've had great success with the PCDJ DMX software lighting controller. It has built in apps for sound to light. Like any software/DMX, there is a learning curve, but the results have been well worth it. It also has a utility to run a program live from the stage with a midi footcontroller. You can program in looks/scencs and change between them in real time. It's pretty cool and you are not completely locked into timecode.

[Zeromus-X]

You know what I'd love to see? And this doesn't sound like it'd be that hard... they make this little gadget for a drummer's snare drum that gives you the current BPM you're playing at. I'd love to see one of these used to control lighting changes. A really basic device that would send a MIDI note or command or whatever you wanted to your device to step to the next scene. Figure out the current BPM and trigger the lights to change in between the beat. Man, that'd be awesome for just keeping the lights moving at the pace of the song. Hell, take it a step further and give it a switch that toggles between switching at curBPM, curBPM*2, and curBPM*4, so you can have them cycling slower for slow songs.

 

Ah, wishful thinking of a device that would be useful. Anyway, carry on.

[Khazul]

Thats relatively easy to do.

 

Actually there is probably an easy hack for that - mic up the snare - any old cheap mic will do - undirection dynamic probably ideal for minimum bleed. Then stick that through a pre-amp, output of pre-amp into audio input of your light controller. Set the level on the pre so that only fuller hits come through (ie so that ghost hits are ignored). In theory that should give you scene advance triggering on beats 1 and 3 for most stuff.

 

Otherwise using a roland TD12 kit solves this problem as that is midi anyway

 

Another approach similar to the above - ie effectively extracting a kind of click track from the snare is to run that into a fly-wheel type midi sync device (for eg motu av midi patch bay/sync box). That will then general midi sync - however then you really need to use a gate on the mic feed so only hard hits make it through to the trigger.

 

Look around DJ gear - there are also loads of BPM extractors around in various guises - I have a Korg Kaoss Pad V3 that does audio beat to BPM extraction - works work when there is an obvious 4/4 kick for it to work with.

 

If you really want this - there are loads of ways of doing it.

[Darkstorm]

Whats been said does of course apply well. But no ones mentioned another very important thing. You must be able to sync yourself with the music. If you dont got rythum, you aint gonna be any good. If you cant get on with the music all the techno babble knowhow isnt worth squat. Become a dancer if you arent allready. If you cant "trip" with music, learn to. If you cant be uplifted by the spirit of the music and party, you dont got no reason to be there unless its to learn to let go so you can be turned on by it. Sure, technique and know how is important. But if your not physically and mentally turned on and lit up by the music yourself rythmically and ambeince wise, your not going to do nearly as well as someone who is. Even if their techno babble level is lower then yours.

 

I'll make a comparisson to musician types: The full of soul player trumps the sterile techno wizard. The full of soul also a techno wizard blasts the universe open.

[Schlam]

 

Whats been said does of course apply well. But no ones mentioned another very important thing. You must be able to sync yourself with the music. If you dont got rythum, you aint gonna be any good. If you cant get on with the music all the techno babble knowhow isnt worth squat. Become a dancer if you arent allready. If you cant "trip" with music, learn to. If you cant be uplifted by the spirit of the music and party, you dont got no reason to be there unless its to learn to let go so you can be turned on by it. Sure, technique and know how is important. But if your not physically and mentally turned on and lit up by the music yourself rythmically and ambeince wise, your not going to do nearly as well as someone who is. Even if their techno babble level is lower then yours. I'll make a comparisson to musician types: The full of soul player trumps the sterile techno wizard. The full of soul also a techno wizard blasts the universe open.

 

 

Umm, yep..... thats why we are professionals, we learnt that stuff a while ago.......

Now Im confused, is this a lighting forum?

For a musician to be at the stage where he/she is considering lighting, you'd have to assume they have the performance angle sorted out.

Being a dancer IS NOT a pre-requisite at being an entertainer/musician, and should never be made a priority over (most importantly) music theory, and live experience.

A true musician cannot remember when "music first moved them".

If you want a shot at Australian Idol (Idle), or work in theatre, go ahead, get jazz ballet lessons...... while you are at it, go for the trifecta (singing, dancing and acting lessons). Then you'll really be entertaining for the mums on daytime tv.

 

Assume nothing about the people that join forums like these.

The simplest questions could be coming from the MOST successful people, you never know.

And so could the answers.....

Dancing is but one form of performance.

Im sure that the members of the foo fighters, didn't start out with dancing lessons, ......to give one example.

Im not annoyed, just giving perspective for those impressionable young kids that may come across this.

Im sure you are trying to be helpfull in your way, but to me (with 20 years live experience in the Australian rock industry) that comment was "left field" to say the least, misleading to say the most.

Dont ever think that being ONE thing will do it. The ability to execute a dance routine is SOOO not as important as you are making it out to be.

You need::::

 

1. Confidence (good attitude also)

2. Knowledge (includes techno babble, sorry, but this is 2008 and the industry works at THIS level now.)

3. Experience (the LIVE kind)

4. Product (you need something that sets you apart from the field)

5. Perseverance (to block out unhelpful comments and advice ;-)...lol )

 

 

AND

 

6. LUCK.

 

 

So good luck to all.

 

BTW Darkstorm, again, Im not having a go at you personally, just stating my opinion on that comment.

This is all new stuff we are talking about, changing weekly., or daily. I'll take the others methods and try to learn, as will the others from mine.

Injecting stuff that is left field doesn't make sense and isn't helpfull.

 

Cheers

Matt

[brady_cress]

Schlam,

 

I have several questions, but let me first explain my current situation.

 

Our current set-list is 5 songs (right now we're mainly opening in bars and clubs). All of our songs utilize some electronic sounds from fruity loops. These fruity loop projects are programmed to include a click-track panned hard left.

 

The laptop sits next to our drummer, who starts the show the show by hitting play in fruity loops. The audio signal out of the computer splits 2 ways. The left goes to headphones that sit in my drummers ears. The right goes to the PA. This limits us from using stereo effects in fruity loops, but that's ok.

 

To date, everything works great. Our drummer is synced up perfectly with fruity loops audio coming out of the PA.

 

Here's where the fun starts. We recently acquired 4 homemade light boxes (essentially plywood wedges encasing one worklight apiece, with the tops covered by plexiglass). We would like to program a light show on the laptop and sync it with the fruity loops file.

 

Questions:

 

1. If you're manually typing in the timecode for each change spot, why does Light factory need to be open at the same time as winamp? In other words, I feel like I'm missing something. Does light factory actually read something from winamp as the .mp3 file plays?

 

2. Once I have the USB-DMX pro, what other hardware will I need to run to my light boxes? Will I need to buy four dimmer packs (one for each light), and then run midi cable from the USB-DMX pro to each light's dimmer pack in daisy-chain fashion?

 

As you answer these questions, I'm sure I'll have more for you. I apologize if I seem clueless. Thanks in advance for the help!

 

Brady

[astraeus000]

 

How is this achieved, Presume its some software.......fill me in cheers.

 

 

I use a very basic Midi setup, using two old Alesis MMT-8 hardware sequencers connected to my keyboard controller. I write the lights, slave the light sequencer to the music sequencer, and sometimes I slave the light sequencer to my Korg 3200 32-tracker via Midi. I have the lights plugged into 2 American Dj stand-alone Midi dimmer paks, and I also use a Leprecon Midi dimmer pack as well, all chained. Works very well, and no computer.....