Members congaron Posted June 7, 2007 Members Share Posted June 7, 2007 The monitor becomes even more important when you play a hard, large room like a gymnasium. Our band has songs that come to a screeching halt...pause...and come back in full tilt. In a gym, you really hear the delay during those moments (yes, it sounds really cool then). It's a real challenge to get the FOH levels right so this isn't evident to the audience during the rest of the show. It's a nightmare trying to sing there without monitors...that's why I ring out the monitors and set their levels first...that habit came from playing a gym youth rally. God bless! -Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fingerpicker Posted June 7, 2007 Members Share Posted June 7, 2007 The reason I use one (or two) subs is because I play at several spots where there are alot of younger people and the girls get drunk and want to dance. With just me and my guitar I have to play percussive and get some thump without a drummer. If its pretty loud and I play hard it doesn't sound good through just the tops. If I add a sub I roll a good amount of bass off the tops and it clears everything up. Adding a sub clears up your sound and lets the tops handle what they are supposed to, its not the other way around. I don't know alot about live sound but I do know how to sound "big" when you do a solo act, And a sub gets me there. If your in a restaurant and playing laid back you can get away without a sub, but at my lively gigs I don't sound nearly as good. Here is a pic of my two EVs, one sub, mixer, chord case, stands and everything I need. Put the gutar on my back and its ONE LOAD! I set one of the EVs towards me which doubles as my monitor. Also I really like Peavey, but those PR's just dont sound goo to my ears. If you would A/B the PR's with the EV's it's night and day. The Impulse speakers are the good ones that Peavey makes as far as molded cabs go. There is a bar with a house system and they have the PR series speakers in there--I love playing there but hate the sound no matter how I EQ it. near the bar they have Some JBL EONs that are hooked into the PA and it sounds 10 times better by the bar area. The reason the PR's are popular is because they are cheap, else noone would be buying them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members joko Posted June 14, 2007 Members Share Posted June 14, 2007 I have the EV SX100 speakers and really like them...Do you need a crossover to use that Sub? Does it have a built in one? How does the hookup work with a powered mixer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fingerpicker Posted June 14, 2007 Members Share Posted June 14, 2007 The EV model sub they have out now; the SB122 has a built in crossover/filter at 160HZ. The older model; the SB121 does not. 1)With a powered mixer, you could go out of your main out into the sub, then from your sub to the top. I did it this way and it works good. 2)You could also go out of your monitor out into your sub, and then your main outs directly to the sx100's. The advantage of this is now you have a seperate volume for your subs, and if you have seperate EQ for Mains and Monitors, you can adjust your eq accordingly. The disadvantage is you cant have monitors run through the mixers amp. I have been doing the second way, but either will work. I have an odd number of these subs, and would be willing to sell one off for $225 plus shipping. They are under six months old, and at 35lbs or so shipping UPS ground wouldn't be too much. email me if you are interested. I have been pretty happy just bringing one to my gigs. Here is a link to find out more about this cool little sub: http://www.music123.com/EV-SB122-i487881.music Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 14, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted June 14, 2007 That's a good point about using the "controller" with the 802's, which is nothing more than an active equalizer. It comes with a specific curve designed for use with these speakers, which has been ( supposedly ) optimized by Bose. Having said that, one can achieve pretty good results without the controller IF they know how to use an active EQ, which most decent powered mixers have. Most powered mixers have at best a 7 or 9 band EQ that would be more accurately labeled "phase distortion". The fact that the Panarray needs active EQ speaks volumes for its performance. This retrofit may have been quaintly impressive for the 901's back in the 70's, but today???? Considering how often and how vehemently you've turned your nose up at pro sound speakers, I'm stunned you'd consider the Panarray for suggestion. New or used, for the money they are awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 14, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted June 14, 2007 The reason I use one (or two) subs is because I play at several spots where there are alot of younger people and the girls get drunk and want to dance. With just me and my guitar I have to play percussive and get some thump without a drummer. If its pretty loud and I play hard it doesn't sound good through just the tops. If I add a sub I roll a good amount of bass off the tops and it clears everything up. Adding a sub clears up your sound and lets the tops handle what they are supposed to, its not the other way around. I don't know alot about live sound but I do know how to sound "big" when you do a solo act, And a sub gets me there. If your in a restaurant and playing laid back you can get away without a sub, but at my lively gigs I don't sound nearly as good. Here is a pic of my two EVs, one sub, mixer, chord case, stands and everything I need. Put the gutar on my back and its ONE LOAD! I set one of the EVs towards me which doubles as my monitor. Also I really like Peavey, but those PR's just dont sound goo to my ears. If you would A/B the PR's with the EV's it's night and day. The Impulse speakers are the good ones that Peavey makes as far as molded cabs go. There is a bar with a house system and they have the PR series speakers in there--I love playing there but hate the sound no matter how I EQ it. near the bar they have Some JBL EONs that are hooked into the PA and it sounds 10 times better by the bar area. The reason the PR's are popular is because they are cheap, else noone would be buying them. FWIW, this pic illustrates why I suggested he consider the Bose PAS. As an acoustic solo, he doesn't need the sub. He could walk in with his guitar and the L1 in one trip with no handtruck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fingerpicker Posted June 14, 2007 Members Share Posted June 14, 2007 No you can't. I had the Bose and you still need your mic-mic stand-cables-accesories-mixer if you want any control over the Bose-and the little sub. W/O the sub the Bose really has no low end. I don't know if you have actually used the Bose on real life gigs, but I have. try using the L1 without the little sub(s), or any sub, at an outdoor gig then you're really screwed. Even Bose recommends one sub for a full acoustic guitar . For the record I think the Bose concept is a good one, but too limited as a true plug and play. With more of a mixer section, simillar to the extras you would have on any decent mixer w/built in FX, it could be a usable piece of gear for me. That picture shows everything I need-including my cheater book and case for harmonicas,etc. The only things that aren't on there are a tip bucket(which could still fit) and my guitar(on my back) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aw_dee_o Posted June 15, 2007 Members Share Posted June 15, 2007 Craigv: I think that you are guilty of what you try to lay on me i.e. jumping up and down without asking for clarification first and / or taking personal potshots at others. Please apply the same standards to your posts that you expect out of others. Outside of that, the Bose 802 / subwoofer system that i used dated back to over 20 years ago. These were full-sized subs with large cone drivers. Don't know the make / model, but the subs were about 2.5' -3' tall. I had no idea what a Bose Panaray was until i looked it up on their website. Once again, i was talking about buyinig older, used speakers. If you re-read my post, i never recommended that this party buy a Bose sub. Outside of that, if you've read any of my other posts pertaining to speaker design, you should know that i would never use, nor recommend using "tiny" drivers for subwoofers. If you want high output low frequency extension, you need relatively larger drivers in relatively bigger boxes. The Panaray's don't qualify on either term. As far as your comments about multi-band EQ's go, they all distort the phase of a signal. At the same time, they alter amplitude linearity, which is what the Bose Active Equalizer does too. As such, one could probably get better sound out of an outboard multi-band EQ than they could out of the factory provided Bose EQ if there were enough bands and one knew what they were doing. The older factory Bose EQ was quite limited in adjustability with very broad, vague response curves. Since not all rooms or installs are the same, being able to fine tune individual bands using a multi-band EQ would be more appropriate, albeit less convenient and more time consuming. Sean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 16, 2007 CMS Author Share Posted June 16, 2007 Craigv: I think that you are guilty of what you try to lay on me i.e. jumping up and down without asking for clarification first and / or taking personal potshots at others. Please apply the same standards to your posts that you expect out of others. Outside of that, the Bose 802 / subwoofer system that i used dated back to over 20 years ago. These were full-sized subs with large cone drivers. Don't know the make / model, but the subs were about 2.5' -3' tall. I had no idea what a Bose Panaray was until i looked it up on their website. Once again, i was talking about buyinig older, used speakers. If you re-read my post, i never recommended that this party buy a Bose sub.Outside of that, if you've read any of my other posts pertaining to speaker design, you should know that i would never use, nor recommend using "tiny" drivers for subwoofers. If you want high output low frequency extension, you need relatively larger drivers in relatively bigger boxes. The Panaray's don't qualify on either term. As far as your comments about multi-band EQ's go, they all distort the phase of a signal. At the same time, they alter amplitude linearity, which is what the Bose Active Equalizer does too. As such, one could probably get better sound out of an outboard multi-band EQ than they could out of the factory provided Bose EQ if there were enough bands and one knew what they were doing. The older factory Bose EQ was quite limited in adjustability with very broad, vague response curves. Since not all rooms or installs are the same, being able to fine tune individual bands using a multi-band EQ would be more appropriate, albeit less convenient and more time consuming. Sean> Where do I mention anything at all about subs? "Jumping up and down"????? "Personal potshots"??? What did I say that's a personal potshot? Where was I jumping up and down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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