Members contorted1 Posted October 1, 2007 Members Share Posted October 1, 2007 I'm looking to sell my like new Genz Benz GBE 1200 bass amp. This thing has more features than can be describe.Here's the link from their site: http://www.genzbenz.com/?fa=detail&mid=1839&sid=422&cid=95# The only reason I'm selling it is I got an endorsement with Basson Cabinets and they require 1500 watts continuous to run their 8x10 cab and this is only 1200 at it's highest. So needless to say I went with a Preamp/Poweramp combo to push it. The Genz Benz is truly a unique amp and I dialed in a bunch of killer tones from both the Tube section,the Fet section and both together. The sounds you can aquire are almost limitless and it is in excellent like new condition. These amps retail at Musicians Friend for $1339 so this is a deal. I am asking $900 + shipping and will be well packed for shipping.Here's the link to Musicians friend: http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/GenzBenz-GBE-1200-Bass-Amp?sku=483634 Hit me up with any questions or I am open to offers as well. I'm not really looking for any trades except maybe a high end Tube guitar amp(Framus Cobra,Engl Powerball).I'll be posting pics as soon as I can get the pics from my camera uploaded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bassdudeguy Posted October 1, 2007 Members Share Posted October 1, 2007 you need a total of 1500 watts to push it, thats bull, no cabinets run with a minimum amount of watts needed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members contorted1 Posted October 1, 2007 Author Members Share Posted October 1, 2007 No actually it isn't bull go to their site(Bassonsound.com)and see foryourself before you make comments. They are 200oz magnets in each speaker and the cabinet weighs 238lbs. So if you underpower any cabinet it will damage your speakers,and their cabinets are 2000 watts rms. Check you facts before you post!http://www.bassonsound.com/b810b.htmhttp://reviews.harmony-central.com/reviews/Bass+Amp/product/Basson+Sound/B810B+Cabinet/10/1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted October 1, 2007 Members Share Posted October 1, 2007 No actually it isn't bull go to their site(Bassonsound.com)and see foryourself before you make comments. They are 200oz magnets in each speaker and the cabinet weighs 238lbs. So if you underpower any cabinet it will damage your speakers,and their cabinets are 2000 watts rms. Check you facts before you post! http://www.bassonsound.com/b810b.htmhttp://reviews.harmony-central.com/reviews/Bass+Amp/product/Basson+Sound/B810B+Cabinet/10/1 Completely untrue and bad information Mr, Contorted.Speakers are NOT damaged by underpowering, otherwise every time you turn down the amp the speakers would blow. If THAT manufacturer chooses to recommend that power, it's up to them but it's certainly not universal within the industry, nor IMO is it good for the long term reliability of the drivers.May I suggest you search the live audio forum, this topic has been discussed in detail by several of us who are responsible for speaker designs at other companies and are intimately knowledgeable with the failure mechanisms of loudspeakers.Also, I suggest YOU check your facts before you post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members contorted1 Posted October 1, 2007 Author Members Share Posted October 1, 2007 Mr AgedHorse, Please enlighten me to what speaker company you design speakers for as I am interested in learning more on this subject, as you say I know nothing about it. Read my ad all I stated was that Basson speakers require 1500+ watts to power their cab and that this Genz Benz wasn't enough to push it without clipping. Why do you senior members find it necessary to bash in an ad to sell something with all your knowledge? The bottom line is I received a paper that said damage can occur to the speaker coils if the cab is underpowered.If this is wrong then please contact Shawn Green at Basson Sound and tell him he is wrong, but I bet he'll school you differently as I thought the same this as you stated and did a little research before posting. But since you "speaker designers" have a forum then Shawn and their designers are wrong and I'll let him know. Thanks for looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted October 2, 2007 Members Share Posted October 2, 2007 As an E.E. in this industry, I have designed speaker products for "several" companies over the past 25+ years, including Genz Benz. I have worked very closely with transducer (driver) engineers and I also designed your amplifier. I have also designed and analyzed pro audio products for some of the largest companies in the country. I received an e-mail from somebody on the forum asking if your "advice" was indeed true since he owns a rig very similar to yours, and he had been using it for a while and was suddenly concerned that he might be "blowing" his speakers. He forwarded this thread and I understand why he was concerned. I read your post and it's full of mis-information concerning how speakers work and how power ratings relate to the real world. I am not bashing with any attempt to sell anything... in fact you have already bought something! I am also not bashing the speaker manufacturer since they are free to do whatever they feel they need to do to sell their product. What I am saying is that your comment about damaging any cabinet by underpowering it is false and bad information to others here on the forum. Speakers (low frequency drivers for this discussion) fail for one reason and only one reason... excessive power. This damage can be either thermal or mechanical in nature. Thermal failure is the result of too much power causing excessive temperature rise in the voice coil and bobbin assembly, causing a softening of the adhesives, blistering of the former and a breakdown of the wire insulation. Thermal failure can occur when the speaker is used with an amplifier that is rated to large for the duty cycle the speaker sees. If the signal is heavily compressed, the duty cycle increases and the speaker power rating (thus amp size) must be decreased. Another cause ofthermal failure is using an amp that is too small for the job at hand, that amp being driven heavily into clipping. When an amp is driven heavily into clipping, the power delivered to the speaker can be as much as twice the RMS rating of the amp. This is, IMO, the primary reason behind the myth that underpowering a speaker can blow it. The failure mode is still too much power. The second failure mechanism of a speaker is due to mechanical damage. This is always caused by too much power. It's pretty simple for a manufacturer to determine how much power causes mechanical damage. The problem is putting it into a specification that is useful to the average musician. The mechanical power handling of a speaker is not a fixed number, but varies greatly by decreasing as the frequency decreases. This is due to the mechanical loading that the air mass creates to the drivers and below some point the driver is no longer adequately loaded and flops around like an undamped spring. It's not uncommon for a speaker to show a power rating of 1/4 the original mid-band rating when you approach 25-40Hz. Combine this with a grossly large power amp and you have the single most common cause for bass driver failure. Also note that an amplifier rated at say 1200 watts "RMS" by definition produces a peak 2400 watt rating because of the conversion factor for a sine wave between RMS values and peak values. I have attached a good overview of loudspeaker power ratings from my good friends over at Harman. Note their discussion relating to derating for musical applications and their references to such in examples 2 & 3.http://www.jblpro.com/pub/technote/spkpwfaq.pdf Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members contorted1 Posted October 2, 2007 Author Members Share Posted October 2, 2007 Awesome info I stand corrected AgedHorse ! Still the Genz Benz is a killer amp and is dead mint,maybe you can help me with the settings and I won't have to sell it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted October 2, 2007 Members Share Posted October 2, 2007 Let's work on it, shouldn't be too hard. Other 750 and 1200 players may also have some suggestions on how they use theirs too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bassdudeguy Posted October 2, 2007 Members Share Posted October 2, 2007 Why do you senior members find it necessary to bash in an ad to sell something with all your knowledge? funny that this senior member is a 15 year old kid eh:wave: but atleast by bringing this up you might not have to sell your amp:thu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted October 2, 2007 Members Share Posted October 2, 2007 funny that this senior member is a 15 year old kid eh:wave: but atleast by bringing this up you might not have to sell your amp:thu: If I only knew then what I know now... too bad youth is wasted on the young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hasbeen Posted October 2, 2007 Members Share Posted October 2, 2007 Another point on this. I have spoken to Shawn Green in the past. He called to see if we could set up Nikki Sixx with our GBE1200 since, according to Shawn, it was one of the only heads on the market that could power his cabs.If you talk to Shawn, tell him that I said hi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bassred Posted October 10, 2007 Members Share Posted October 10, 2007 My guess is that they put that paper dangling from the handle so that people don't buy their cab that is rated at (lets just say) 500 watts RMS and then run it with a head that puts out (lets just say) 200 watts and bitch and complain about the CAB not being 'as good as they thought it should be' and then dissing the gear.... I know a guy who is a distibuter for Basson and have had this discussion with him several times, he also thinks that just because the company chooses to put this 'Warning' on the cabs that it must be true... just some marketing aimed at musicians who may not know the technical side...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Thunderbroom Posted October 10, 2007 Members Share Posted October 10, 2007 I enjoyed reading this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members xOriginalNinjax Posted October 11, 2007 Members Share Posted October 11, 2007 I enjoyed reading this.As did I, as did I....:poke: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pickdust Posted October 12, 2007 Members Share Posted October 12, 2007 As did I, as did I.... :poke: Now at least I know WHY my 15" drivers died and subsequently made the "sand-paper" noise when I pushed on the cone.Always better to have more info from someone in the know!Thanks!PD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Smoothbass Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 If the amp is still for sale can you hold it till monday and i will buy it ? Let me know so i can stop looking. $900.00 + shipping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members contorted1 Posted October 14, 2007 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2007 Yes it is still available and all PM's have been replied to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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