Members estew72 Posted August 18, 2004 Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 for my dorm? I'm going into college as a composition major and would like to have a nice 1 or maybe 2 octave keyboard that I could use with Finale to compose with. I would like something that has the best midi sounds possible. Can anyone give me a suggestion? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members estew72 Posted August 18, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 and I meant orchestral midi sounds when I said the best midi sounds possible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cybermooks Posted August 18, 2004 Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 Well when you say "midi sounds" your talking about a Rompler, which means Korg, Yamaha, Roland, or Kurzweil. However I can't think of any that come with less than 61 keys, unless it is one of those cheapo built in speaker things. If size is that much of a problem your other alternative would be a rack from one of those companies with a small midi controller keyboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr. Riceguy Posted August 18, 2004 Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 I not sure but maybe a Yamaha S08 or S90 this is the S08http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=key/search/detail/base_pid/700827/ this is the S90 But don't take is from me. test it out. and wait for what the senior members have to say about ithttp://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=key/search/detail/base_pid/707421/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members estew72 Posted August 18, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 Originally posted by cybermooks Well when you say "midi sounds" your talking about a Rompler, which means Korg, Yamaha, Roland, or Kurzweil. However I can't think of any that come with less than 61 keys, unless it is one of those cheapo built in speaker things. If size is that much of a problem your other alternative would be a rack from one of those companies with a small midi controller keyboard. so basically, I would need one piece of equipment with all of the midi sounds/programs in it and then a separate keyboard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cybermooks Posted August 18, 2004 Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 Well yes if you can't fit a keyboard that size. I would probably work out much cheaper for you as racks cost much less than the keyboard versions and all you need is an extra pair of midi cables. How much are you looking to spend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members estew72 Posted August 18, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 Originally posted by cybermooks Well yes if you can't fit a keyboard that size. I would probably work out much cheaper for you as racks cost much less than the keyboard versions and all you need is an extra pair of midi cables. How much are you looking to spend? price isn't so much an issue as convenience is... so far, I did find something that doesn't seem to expensive: http://www.zzounds.com/item--KRZME1 now I just need to find a midi controller keyboard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cybermooks Posted August 18, 2004 Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 Sorry I'm not familiar with that model, but the K2-- series. However, Kurzweil samples are top of the line, followed by Yamaha. As far as a small controller keyboard there are many, many of them out there these days. I don't really use them but if I were going to buy one I'd go for the Korg MicroControl, but really for what you want anything with keys will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members estew72 Posted August 18, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 Originally posted by cybermooks Sorry I'm not familiar with that model, but the K2-- series. However, Kurzweil samples are top of the line, followed by Yamaha. cool... I'm not familiar with it either, I just saw it and thought it looked like what I was looking for... I'll see if there are any reviews for it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Darkstorm Posted August 18, 2004 Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 Korg x5d. Smallest footprint rompler I know of. Is 61 full size keys in very comact houseing. Is also a fave keyboard among death metal bands ect for rich symphony voices. Also verygood for new age music. Available new for about $600. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members estew72 Posted August 18, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 I'm just looking for something to aid me in composing for orchestral instruments, 3 octaves at the most Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members harmonicat Posted August 18, 2004 Members Share Posted August 18, 2004 Estew,a 61 key keyboard is not going to bust a hole in your dorm. http://www.ke-musik.dk/Upload/HtmlArticles/Article1284/RolandEXRKE_musik.mp3 Roland EXR-3 $495 from Sweetwater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members estew72 Posted August 19, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 19, 2004 Originally posted by harmonicat Estew,a 61 key keyboard is not going to bust a hole in your dorm.http://www.ke-musik.dk/Upload/HtmlArticles/Article1284/RolandEXRKE_musik.mp3Roland EXR-3$495 from Sweetwater maybe you're right... that one sounds great, but I didn't really like the orchestral sounds at all, and since that's all that I'll be using... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chick korea Posted August 19, 2004 Members Share Posted August 19, 2004 just buy does 2 octave keybaords and a roland xv 2020 with the string exp and orchestra exp..and that would be perfect! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cybermooks Posted August 19, 2004 Members Share Posted August 19, 2004 Forget Rolands. The orchestral sounds aren't as good as Kurzweil or Yamaha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members baldo Posted August 19, 2004 Members Share Posted August 19, 2004 think casio and get 'yer own sounds. maybe $399. good keybed and limited options. @ least you have basic keys - piano, rhodes & b3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mucsusn Posted August 19, 2004 Members Share Posted August 19, 2004 estew, Do yourself a favor, and scour the greater Buffalo area for a few good full line music stores, then go and try some things out. The Kurz you looked at online is a good basic unit, but not really geared to orchestral. Kurz has a rack mount called the PC2R that is much more robust in sound and polyphony. It has Kurzweil's Orchestral ROM factory installed. Since you have indicated a willingness to drop a little coin, you owe it yourself to shop hard. As a developing composition major, your ear will become more critical, and your desire for more sounds will also increase. All four major manufacturers make a rack module that will make good music. Korg Triton rack (I don't have much experience with Korg products) Yamaha Motif rack (I think a gorgeous soundset, but orchestral? You decide) Kurzweil PC2R (again good sounds, you be the judge) Roland Fantom XR (a few hundred dollars more, but adds the capabilities of sampling, which might interest you down the road depending on where composition studies lead you. Also the most expandable of the lot, with two boards on the market dedicated to string sounds) Last but not least, don't forget the resources your PC or Mac can give you, be it a virtual orchestra or soft Rompler. Again........your money..........your ears......so, shop, shop, shop! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chick korea Posted August 20, 2004 Members Share Posted August 20, 2004 with the roland xv 2020 its really small half rack space.. 2.- has 2 exp spaces and has usb cost about 400 dlls 3.- you can buy 2 exp board rochestra and string exp... that sound nice i think you will apreciate the sound.. each board will cost about 230 dlls but if you really want killer orchestra strings... then buy a pc laptop with gigasampler 3.0 and vieana orchestra library..... (the library alone will cost alone about 5000 dlls just in case you need the ultimate ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members isosceles Posted August 20, 2004 Members Share Posted August 20, 2004 dude, seriously get a small controller like a MicroKontrol or a Novation Remote 25 and get Garritan Personal Orchestra or East West Orchestra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kirumamoru Posted August 20, 2004 Members Share Posted August 20, 2004 Originally posted by estew72 I'm just looking for something to aid me in composing for orchestral instruments, 3 octaves at the most That's where it starts, man, but there's no telling where it'll end. I was looking for a little something to give me some decent sounds for composing, and settled on a Roland XV-88 with 88 hammer-action keys so I could use it to practice piano. Well, it's been 2 1/2 years, and I've sold the XV-88 and bought a Yamaha digital piano (P-250) and synthesizer (Motif ES 7) and a pair of monitor speakers (Yamaha MSP10's), a couple mixers, some headphones... I've bought and sold rack modules and desktop synths... and while I'm happy with my setup, I still want some stuff, like a wind controller (like a virtual soprano sax) and some expansion cards and a subwoofer... it doesn't end, and you might as well start off with something good, trust me. For one thing, you say you only want a small keyboard and orchestral sounds, but consider this. If your school is anything like mine, you'll have to take keyboard lessons, and you'll be really grateful to have something you can practice on in your room, instead of having to fight for practice room time. You'll need a keyboard that can cover at least six octaves (usually 76 keys, or 6 1/4 octaves). The reason for this is simple; you'll need to be able to play four-octave scales, in parallel octaves (so, five octaves), but you'll need to be able to play in any key (so add one more octave). You don't need two keyboards, and I wouldn't even recommend it, per se, but you should get yourself one instrument with either 76 semi-weighted (synthesizer) keys, or 88 hammer-action (piano) keys. If you're really concerned about space, go for the 76 keys. Don't worry TOO much that the keys are lighter than a real piano's, but DO take the time, before playing tests, to play on a real piano some to acclimate your hands. Any keyboard will do to teach you fingering patterns, though. Something else to keep in mind is that there's more to buying a keyboard, expense-wise, than just the instrument. You need a stand (unless it comes included) and maybe a bench, and some headphones and/or speakers. And you need cables to connect it to your computer, either MIDI or USB. Now, if money were no object, I would offer my recommendation for the Yamaha Motif ES 7. I base this on their generally high-quality acoustic sounds, including their pianos (the one on the ES is quite nice). The thing is, of course, that once you take care of the accessories, you'll be lucky to only shell out $2500. I don't know if this is something you are willing or able to do. Don't dispair, though, because there are other choices. You might be able to shave off a nice chunk of change if you were to go shopping for a second-hand (or even a new) Yamaha Motif 7 (note, no ES). You might also look at instruments like the Kurzweil PC2... I'm not a Kurz fan, personally, but your mileage may vary, and you could buy one new or used. I would avoid Alesis for orchestral sounds, as well as Korg. Roland makes some OK sounds, though you have to buy expansion cards for the best sounds. You could even go as far down as a Yamaha DGX-something, though an instrument like that is going to suffer from limitations on how many notes it can play at a time. A synth like the Motif ES comes with a lot of extras like sampling and a built-in sequencer, and it seems like you're going to be using notation software (an additional $200-$300 expense). You might find that you like using a hardware sequencer, though, you never know (come over to the dark side... we have cookies! ). Anyway, I guess my point is, don't rush into a purchase, and be flexible in considering other options. I've probably lost about $1000 in reselling gear (and that bum Behringer mixer), so learn from my mistakes and consider all the angles before making a decision. Kiru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members isosceles Posted August 20, 2004 Members Share Posted August 20, 2004 dude, seriously get a Roland A37 controller and GPO or East West libraries then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members APCenter Posted August 20, 2004 Members Share Posted August 20, 2004 I'm gonna kick out an idea here that may work for you: I was a composition major for 3 years (before deciding to switch over to a percussion performance concentration, thus making my undergraduate career substantially longer...). In my experience, you really don't need sample libraries to give perfect playback in Finale when composing music that is intended to be played by live performers. In fact, I always felt that if the playback was too good, it actually made me write worse...sort of writing around what the computer can do best/worst. That said, you have a few options. I don't know if you're using a PC or a Mac, but if you're using a PC, you can pick up a SB Audigy sound card that will work great for hearing things back in Finale. You just need appropriate soundfonts to do what you want to do. In fact, if you follow my "playback doesn't have to be perfect" philosophy, a SB Live! will be just fine, and they're available for $30 or less. You would need samples, though. I would recommend a soundfont called "Cadenza!" to start out with. It's available for free download, and although the samples are not always spot-on realistic, it has served me quite well. Go to hammersound.net and look for it if you want to go that route. You could go with higher end soundfont libraries that you have to purchase, as well. The Garritan Personal Orchestra sounds like it might be a great collection of samples, although I don't think it is in soundfont format, so you'd have to either use Vienna Studio to build a font from the samples, or use a software sampler. This brings me to my other option. This applies to using GPO or other non-soundfont sample libraries, as well as if you have a Mac (or just simply don't have a SoundBlaster card). Kompakt works very well for your application, and is academically priced at $99. Worth checking out. As far as a keyboard controller, that depends on what you're after. I'm really not much of a pianist, so I don't have a lot of need for an 88 weighted-key controller. I mostly just need something to punch notes into Finale in step-time via Speedy Entry. For me, a 49-key Rat Shack POS that I picked up on clearance for $39 works just fine. If you want to enter notes in realtime via Hyperscribe, you need something better. But if you do it the way I do, this works great. Anything, as long as it has keys and a MIDI out will do. An interesting option for this type of application might be the new combination QWERTY/MIDI keyboard that Creative Labs is making now, not sure on the pricing though. Hope this helps! Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dr.Tom Posted August 21, 2004 Members Share Posted August 21, 2004 ...midi 2-3 octave controller/keyboard ? I'm not a keyboard or synth player but I'll be funding the purchase ! Regards, Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members estew72 Posted August 21, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 21, 2004 Originally posted by APCenter I'm gonna kick out an idea here that may work for you:I was a composition major for 3 years (before deciding to switch over to a percussion performance concentration, thus making my undergraduate career substantially longer...). In my experience, you really don't need sample libraries to give perfect playback in Finale when composing music that is intended to be played by live performers. In fact, I always felt that if the playback was too good, it actually made me write worse...sort of writing around what the computer can do best/worst. That said, you have a few options.I don't know if you're using a PC or a Mac, but if you're using a PC, you can pick up a SB Audigy sound card that will work great for hearing things back in Finale. You just need appropriate soundfonts to do what you want to do. In fact, if you follow my "playback doesn't have to be perfect" philosophy, a SB Live! will be just fine, and they're available for $30 or less. You would need samples, though. I would recommend a soundfont called "Cadenza!" to start out with. It's available for free download, and although the samples are not always spot-on realistic, it has served me quite well. Go to hammersound.net and look for it if you want to go that route. You could go with higher end soundfont libraries that you have to purchase, as well. The Garritan Personal Orchestra sounds like it might be a great collection of samples, although I don't think it is in soundfont format, so you'd have to either use Vienna Studio to build a font from the samples, or use a software sampler.This brings me to my other option. This applies to using GPO or other non-soundfont sample libraries, as well as if you have a Mac (or just simply don't have a SoundBlaster card). Kompakt works very well for your application, and is academically priced at $99. Worth checking out.As far as a keyboard controller, that depends on what you're after. I'm really not much of a pianist, so I don't have a lot of need for an 88 weighted-key controller. I mostly just need something to punch notes into Finale in step-time via Speedy Entry. For me, a 49-key Rat Shack POS that I picked up on clearance for $39 works just fine. If you want to enter notes in realtime via Hyperscribe, you need something better. But if you do it the way I do, this works great. Anything, as long as it has keys and a MIDI out will do. An interesting option for this type of application might be the new combination QWERTY/MIDI keyboard that Creative Labs is making now, not sure on the pricing though.Hope this helps! Good luck! thanks... I did get through a whole year as a composition major at Interlochen Arts academy using Finale alone, no keyboard to input notes, and that worked fine for me... but my teacher over the summer always used his keyboard to write his music, so I thought maybe I'll try that.... the playback I had last year sucked emmensly, but I didn't care...like you said, I had a live performance in mind, rather that just harping on midi sounds... but my teacher from the summer was very different, he didn't like it when he couldn't get a good idea of the sound from the midi, so I thought, maybe a nice midi realization wouldn't be so bad, especially if it would come with a keyboard... sooooo.... all I really care about is having a small keyboard. I don't plan on using this keyboard at all for real piano playing/practicing...as for having to take a keyboard class, as someone else mentioned, I'm pretty sure I can test out of it with my experience... I just want a small keyboard so I can hear bigger chords/clusters without having to run to a practice room... nice midi sounds would be nice but not totally essential Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.