Perfect pitch courses ?

[Tai Mai Shus]

i'm sure the chicks would dig it.

[SirGarrote]

Originally posted by louvega I think having perfect and relative pitch is a great achievement. Not only is a clear indicative of music knowledge, but could also be terribly practical for composing songs without the need of an instrument. Being able to listen music in your head without actually hearing it would be an amazingly practical skill for all musical purposes. Also the ability of recognizing tonalities, intervals and chord progressions just by listening would boost your ability to understand music, compositions and note relations. Similar to being able to recognize any language in the world just by listening to it, understand it and be able to join the conversation. Or singing a bassline in your head, knowing exactly what notes you are playing. Or going to a concert, be surprised by the use of certain notes while an improvisation and automatically knowing what is going on and how. There are many applications of perfect and relative pitch. I cant believe people dont see any advantages in such ability. Its the most pure, raw musical knowledge: being able to exactly identify and understand the material used for any musical composition. I dont think it makes you a better musician by any means, but it could make you a more complete one IMO.

 

everything you said applies to RELATIVE pitch, NOT PERFECT pitch. so don't combine them in your little thesis here.

 

-G

[louvega]

Oh, please excuse me if I didnt express myself clearly enough for you but I'm sure some of what I said applies to perfect pitch and some to relative pitch. I just didnt concrete at any point in that thesis there.

 

[SirGarrote]

no. actually not one of those things can be applied to perfect pitch exclusively.

 

i'm done.

 

-G

 

edit: to explain myself more clearly, it's better ot say that EVERYTHING you said can be attributed to having outstanding relative pitch. finito.

[pink floyd cramer]

I would take on any of you perfect pitch guys in a contest to see who could transcribe a series of notes or chords more quickly and accurately, or play along with an unfamiliar song more effectively.

(Hey, this is the internet so we can brag, right? -all in good fun)

 

However I respect that there are some good transcribers on this forum as I have seen from threads asking about notes/chords in various songs- a couple of you waxed me in Stevie Wonder's "I Wish".

[pink floyd cramer]

As for perfect pitch being a curse, I know a blind guy who's sense of pitch is so acute he cannot play an acoustic piano- he has to stop and tune. He has been fired from gigs for this, in spite of repeated warnings- so he only gigs on digital pianos- now THAT'S a curse. But I have never known anyone who could tune a piano so sweetly, all by ear.

[louvega]

SirGarrote, quoting my first post (3rd paragraph), '... being able to exactly identify ...' was referred to perfect pitch.

 

Of course you could say I wasnt really specific, and I completely agree, reason why I said on my second post 'I just didnt concrete at any point in that thesis there.'.

 

If you dont agree, lets just agree to disagree on such matter and give it a rest. Thanks.

[JLo]

So this may turn out to be long...

 

From My collegiate studies, I know no less than a half dozen people with perfect pitch.

 

One guy who can rattle off a pitch name without thinking about it - BUT he is consistently 15 cents flat.

 

Two guys that use it in combination with having great relative pitch also... These are some very good musicians.

 

One professor who has IMHO learned perfect pitch, bu the insists it is a learned talent over MANY years of teaching and learning. He is my theory mentor and absolutely amazing to talk to.

 

I have another professor with the "color" perfect pitch. He is innate, not learned and is the type of "Eb is blue"

 

I know another girl who's pitch is so good she can tell you th pitch of a chair scraping across the floor. She considers it a curse.

 

I know a studio engineer thatcan reduce feedback, woof, or hum with an EQ without a blink of an eye.

 

I know a keyboardist that doesn't know pitches on a page if you paid a million dollars, but can play ANYTHING just by listening to it twice. He's has like a photographic memory of the pitch. It amazing, but he is highly UNtrained, but amazing to sit and watch figure out a song.

 

I myself have good relative pitch, and an acuteness to knowing approximately what key someting is in. I am usually within a whole step ne direction or the other.

 

 

OF all these people, the types I find are the best musicians are the ones that rely on more than "knowing the pitch". They have good listening skills and know they need more knowledge about music that what perfect pitch can bring them. One guy I know plays tuba and still has to practice singing difficult melodies so he knows how the intervals of the melody sound aurally and intervalically, not just in his head. My buddy who is always flat thinks he's right and will not listen to others who kow differently. He does not realize there is more to music than perfect pitch (like decent intonation.)

 

There is a difference in people that play a transposing instrument like trumpet or sax also. most of them learn ho to deal with it, though as par for the course of playing their instrument.

 

Perfect pitch is relative. There are some player than couldn't sing to you a meldoy if you paid them, but as soon as they pick up their horn or violin or whatever, they know exact intonation and intervals. The learn melodies by fingering and hearing the notes on their instrument, not necessarily by hearing them in their head.

 

It is a blessing and a curse. I have good pitch in general and hate things out of tune. Others, like my dad, wouldn't know if something was out of tune if it was a horse singing pop music on the radio. the curse is the thought of knowing too much and not being able to let the little things pass by. Its a blessing because it makes music simpler to learn in some ways. Dictation is simple for them... learning a new chart comes easily... kinda makes ya sick watching it sometimes.

 

 

My personal thoughts are that good reative pitch, concerning interval and modes and things is essential. I don't think perfect pitch can be learned AT ALL. It is a genetic and inner trait that only a few have naturally.

 

 

I'll stop, because I could probably say more

[skyyder]

 

Originally posted by Trillian No, I am very aware of the difference. I have quite good relative pitch. I am just curious if perfect pitch can be learned as some of these courses claim. -Sheryl

 

 

I have always been curious about this thing too. Heck if it were that easy to learn from a few CDs, how is it then that so few people seem to have perfect pitch. and I tend to want to agree that relative pitch might be more important as it allows you to defines where you go in relation to any note that you are on or in respect of the root note. but hey it can't be bad having both

[MorePaul]

Tough question

 

even within "perfect pitch" there is some Looseness in definition (ie are we talking identification of a tone or of a pitch)

Some refer to the identification of musical tone (basically pitch class..well with the octave dfined too) as "absolute pitch"

others seem to consider absolute pitch and perfect pitch the same thing

 

as mentioned earlier, there is also the question of "what is the pitch?" concert pitch hasn't been historically consistant, intonation is dynamic on many instruments (and tempered on others and some instruments are "in between") , some intruments aren't even thermally stable, then there's the various tonal systems of different cultures

 

Some research has used reaction time as part of the definition of inherent v learned absolute pitch identification - others don't

 

Some reseach suggests that perfect pitch may have a learned component (native speakers of tonal language show a higher incidence of perfect pitch) other evidence points at a genetic component (there are even one or two genetic disorders that INCREASE the expression of perfect pitch facility)

possibly these factors are interdependent, possibly independent

 

it's a tough puzzle - not the least of which is "what do I, precisely, mean by 'perfect pitch' ?"