Members Question Posted February 7, 2003 Members Share Posted February 7, 2003 I joined jazz band last week and I've been confronted by the fact that I'm going to have to be comfortable with tough chords. I already know that I don't really have to play the tonic or 5th, and I can drop the 9 in an 11 or 13 chord (not sure when). I know that drop X voicing is putting the X highest note in the bass, block voicing is all the notes normally, and open voicing is putting the second lowest note in the treble. However, I have no idea when to use all these different voicings and exclusions on guitar, and the band teacher hasn't played so he can't provide insight and throws things at me like a drop 2 voiced E9 chord, which is rather difficult to finger straight up and down. What voicings would you guys use for these chords if you were me, and which notes would you leave out in an ensemble context? Notes in ascending order please not fingerings... thanks! 3 note chord... let's say Gmin4 note chord... let's say A+75 note chord... let's say B7(b9)6 note chord... let's say C11 I have been playing the Gmin block, playing the A7 with no b5, and playing the B7(b9) with no b9 in this one song. Needless to say, this is bad. C11 is out of the realm of these pieces, I haven't seen it yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TubeAddict Posted February 7, 2003 Members Share Posted February 7, 2003 Voice leading on the top note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mikeSF Posted February 8, 2003 Members Share Posted February 8, 2003 good questions. pick up the Ted Greene book, "Chord Chemistry". it is great for getting you started on common (and not so common) voicings for jazz. as you already said, pick out voicings that use just the color tones(3, 7 and important extensions), and learn those first. add in others as you progress. is there a pianist(or vibes) in the band? if so, you need to be careful with your extensions or altered notes so you do not clash together. Joe Pass always said to play simple(ie 3&7)chords with a pianist because they have 88 keys and more fingers than you do, and will win every time. just learning one or two movable forms for each chord type may get you by for starters, but the more inversions you can memorize, the faster you will be able to incorporate position playing, voice leading, chord soloing, memorization of the fretboard, etc... also, for regular comping with an ensemble, sticking to drop 2 voicings(and all inversions) on strings 1-4 and 2-5 will get you pretty far. even just playing 2 or 3 good notes from each 4-note form will sound good. remember, those big 6 note campfire chords dont work for jazz - keep it simple. there another concept called polychords where you can think of a complicated chord as two simple chords(triads). when you are ready for this, it can be very enlightening. check it out. goood luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Terje Posted February 9, 2003 Members Share Posted February 9, 2003 Originally posted by Question What voicings would you guys use for these chords if you were me, and which notes would you leave out in an ensemble context? Notes in ascending order please not fingerings... thanks! I'd play 3 note voicings only. Sound so much less cluttered. Guitars should not play those big chords in a jazz ensemble setting, it just {censored} everything up. And it sounds better with those more open chords even in small settings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members florestan Posted February 9, 2003 Members Share Posted February 9, 2003 This is something that Fareed Haque taught me in one of my first lessons. If you don't know, guy is a worldwide badass who is hidden away at Northern Illinois University. If you're ever in the Chicago area, he plays some excellent live shows. Start with just the D and G string. If you play a tritone on those strings, you've got the 3rd and the 7th of some chord. Comp like that for a while. Then almost any note within reach on the 1st and 2nd string is a tension (some sort of 9, 11, or 13). Pick one. If you {censored} up, try another one. The bass and piano are covering the root and 5th, so don't worry. Just play 3, 7, and one tension. It will come to you. You're ear will tell you which ones sound good. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thamiam Posted February 10, 2003 Members Share Posted February 10, 2003 Originally posted by florestan Start with just the D and G string. If you play a tritone on those strings, you've got the 3rd and the 7th of some chord. Comp like that for a while. Then almost any note within reach on the 1st and 2nd string is a tension (some sort of 9, 11, or 13). Pick one. If you {censored} up, try another one. The bass and piano are covering the root and 5th, so don't worry. Just play 3, 7, and one tension. It will come to you. You're ear will tell you which ones sound good. Good luck. Marvelous advice. Remember, you can even comp with only one note. Try linking the 3rd to the 7th as you go from chord to chord.For instance, if you see this progression from Blue Bossa: D-7b5 -> G7 -> C-7 -> C-7 -> Eb-7 -> Ab7 -> Dbmaj7 You can comp a single line like this:C -> B -> Bb -> Bb -> Bb -> C -> C You never have to move more than two frets (one step), and you are free to make it rhythmically interesting without worrying about complicated chord shapes. This is not some beginner's short cut either, many professional guitarists use this technique when playing rhythm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PSA Posted February 12, 2003 Members Share Posted February 12, 2003 also, arranging your chords mostly in 4ths gives a nice, ambiguous jazz sound. it also gives you a lot of easy fingerings because guitar strings are also spaced in 4ths. Like you can play a minor chord with the root on the E string with just one finger - the top 4 strings being D G B E - an e9. when you see a chord with some normal extensions (9, 11, 13) you usually can use whatever of those extensions you want, you don't have to play the chords exactly as written. In fact I only use I think 4 chords for any kind of (dominant) 7 chord. I have a dominant voicing I like with the root on the E string, and another voicing I like with the root on the A string. Then I have altered shapes I use for the "abnormal" extentsions ( b9, b13, etc.). I do this because I have very limited skills at this point, but despite my lack of skill, it works and sounds good. example. for E11 I'd play maybe d g# c# f# and then for E b9 I'd play d g# c f. which also happens to be what I would play for a Bb7... but anyway, the point is, for starters it was easier to find a handful of good voicings and move them around than to play the chords exactly as written. I hope this helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chrisgraff Posted February 15, 2003 Members Share Posted February 15, 2003 Originally posted by florestan This is something that Fareed Haque taught me in one of my first lessons. If you don't know, guy is a worldwide badass who is hidden away at Northern Illinois University. If you're ever in the Chicago area, he plays some excellent live shows. Start with just the D and G string. If you play a tritone on those strings, you've got the 3rd and the 7th of some chord. Comp like that for a while. Then almost any note within reach on the 1st and 2nd string is a tension (some sort of 9, 11, or 13). Pick one. If you {censored} up, try another one. The bass and piano are covering the root and 5th, so don't worry. Just play 3, 7, and one tension. It will come to you. You're ear will tell you which ones sound good. Good luck. Yes! Start with the guide tones - the 3rd and 7th of the chord. For instance Em7 - A7 - Dm7 - G7 -Cmaj7 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------7-------6----5-------4----4----------------------5-------5----3-------3----2-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- now put the root of the chord underneath: Em7 - A7 - Dm7 - G7 - Cmaj7 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------7-------6----5--------4----4-----------------------5-------5----3--------3----2-----------------------7-------------5-------------3-------------------------------5-------------3-------------- (Sorry if the tabs don't line up just right) This is a really good place to start! A famous guitar player named, Freddie Green (Count Basie's guitar player) played this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members - SG - Posted February 16, 2003 Members Share Posted February 16, 2003 i was looking around to try and find what those chords meant cause ive listened to jazz but as for those chords i got no idea, i found this chord generator site: chord generator site Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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