TC Electronic G Major do not work in mono.

[glenecho]

Here's a thread that came about from some interaction in HCAF. Basically I noticed that my new G Major didn't sound as lush and wonderful as I expected...especially when using only the mono output. So I created a problem ticket with TC. Here is how it went down.

 

A lot of you followed my thread on my frustrations with the TC Electronic G Major. Bottom line is that the Mono output does receive a stereo mixdown of effects. This makes it so the unit ONLY works in stereo. Yes I know it's kind of long, but it really uncovers something pretty weak about the G Major, so the owners or possible buyers may want to know this:

 

My email to support:

I just bought a new G-Major and am using with a Mesa Mark IV in mono...using the mono in and mono out jack on the G-major.

 

When going through some presets that use Stereo Delay I noticed that I could not hear delays that were panned hard right. If I take that delay and pan it hard left I can hear it. This is unexpected behavior to me. On any other effect unit, when I use the mono out it takes the whole stereo field and sends it all to that mono out. For instance, the same delay on my Boss GX-700, and I would be able to hear the delays that are panned hard right and left. Only if I plugged a cable into BOTH outputs would I only hear one or the other.

 

This also concerns me because I'm wondering if I'm going to be able to get the most out of the choruses/phase effects that are in the G-Major.

 

Any thoughts on this? I can't find a setting to tell the G-major that I specifically am running a mono out. I really don't want to have to purchase a line mixer just to get the most out of this unit. And frankly, for a guitar effect unit I have to imagine that most guitarists are running this thing mono through an effect loop.

 

1st Response, along with my comments that I sent back:

I confirm that the unit is not summing left + right when you only connect left output. It is not a mistake but a deliberated choice.

 

This is not a problem with chorus or phaser. It is actually better not to sum left and right in this case as you would probably end up with no effect. So you should not be concerned about these. They work perfectly in mono.

 

I spent some time working with this today and making some comparisons.

 

The chorus and phaser not only do work summed, but they sound better that way. It sounds like you have two separate chorusing effects going for some patches

[Lanefair]

I commend you for keeping at them. They obviously didn't put as much thought into it as they say they did.

[IvIark]

The G-Force is the same. I connect my rack effects using a 6 channel splitter/mixer so I can get both outputs summed at the mixer.

 

It's not ideal but it's the best way of doing it, and something like the Behringer MX882 is pretty cheap and works extremely well.

[glenecho]

 

The G-Force is the same. I connect my rack effects using a 6 channel splitter/mixer so I can get both outputs summed at the mixer. It's not ideal but it's the best way of doing it, and something like the Behringer MX882 is pretty cheap and works extremely well.

 

 

Maybe so, but considering my old ART Multiverb from 1988 summed the stereo signal (as do my Line 6, my Boss GX-700, my SE-50 and every single other effect processor I've ever owned).

 

For me it's a G Major...a 399 piece of gear. If I'd plopped down what you did for the G-Force, I'd be a very upset camper.

 

IMO this is pure laziness on their part...I don't buy into the fact that "it is designed that way".

 

As far as a mixer is concerned, I didn't bother. I just made a Y cable and it seems to work fine. Both signals seem to be equal in the mix and I haven't noticed any phase issues (and I flat out REFUSE to buy yet another piece of gear in order to get my NEW piece of gear to work...that's ludicrous).

[IvIark]

 

For me it's a G Major...a 399 piece of gear. If I'd plopped down what you did for the G-Force, I'd be a very upset camper.

 

 

The only reason that I wasn't upset is because I have used a splitter/mixer for a while anyway and so I didn't have to buy anything special. The G-Force is slightly more annoying though as it says explicitly that you can sum left and right, but the difference when you return both left and right outputs is like night and day. I sometimes think this is why some people think the G-Force effects sound sterile, because when you sum it and only use the left output, it sounds considerably thinner.

[glenecho]

 

The only reason that I wasn't upset is because I have used a splitter/mixer for a while anyway and so I didn't have to buy anything special. The G-Force is slightly more annoying though as it says explicitly that you can sum left and right, but the difference when you return both left and right outputs is like night and day. I sometimes think this is why some people think the G-Force effects sound sterile, because when you sum it and only use the left output, it sounds considerably thinner.

 

 

I'm currently in the studio and while I was struggling with this one of the engineers says that he hears complaints all the time of the G Major/Force not sounding as rich or lush (sterile as you put it) as what people expect out of TC. When he saw the Y-cable fix, he immediately got on the phone with some of his clients. The difference in the chorus and reverb effects is like night and day.

 

Honestly, this is kind of pathetic for TC. Nothing in my email correspondence convinces me there is any benefit in doing it this way. Personally, I think this is an engineering oversight. If these units were made strictly for pro audio racks for studios...fine. These are specifically designed for guitarists though.

[IvIark]

 

Maybe so, but considering my old ART Multiverb from 1988 summed the stereo signal (as do my Line 6, my Boss GX-700, my SE-50 and every single other effect processor I've ever owned).

 

 

Incidentally Eventide are the same, you always need to return left and right with a mono input.

 

Some of the effects like reverb and panning are naturally stereo, so it may be that with this level of product they expect to be used more in a studio with stereo returns. I don't know, I've never heard an answer from either company that I was altogether convinced by, especially considering they are both widely used with guitars and summing is hardly rocket science.

[glenecho]

 

Incidentally Eventide are the same, you always need to return left and right with a mono input. Some of the effects like reverb and panning are naturally stereo, so it may be that with this level of product they expect to be used more in a studio with stereo returns. I don't know, I've never heard an answer from either company that I was altogether convinced by, especially considering they are both widely used with guitars and summing is hardly rocket science.

 

 

Eventide and even TC's approach is fine for studio effects. The G-Major and G-Force are quite specifically guitar effects, which is the only reason why I pitched such a fit with them.

[Alex Pareja]

{censored}..is the G system this way too? I might have to just get a Y cable then. Do you sum it Mono from the stereo outputs? Thanks

[glenecho]

 

{censored}..is the G system this way too? I might have to just get a Y cable then. Do you sum it Mono from the stereo outputs? Thanks

 

 

I don't know about the G-System, but the emails from TC Electronic sort of imply that this is their "philosophy" in a way. I'd build/buy yourself a Y-cable just in case. I plug the 2 cable side of the Y into the GMajor Left and Right Output...the single ended side goes...well...wherever you need it to go (effects return on an amp most likely).

 

Incidentally...my bass player has been playing a TC Electronic chorus pedal for years and I told him about this last night. He was like "well I like the way the pedal sounds but I'll try a Y-cable on it just to see if there's any difference...I know I've heard TC chorus users say it doesn't sound 'right' unless you use it in true stereo".

 

He called me back a half hour later..."MAN...thanks so much for that tip...this chorus pedal sounds much much better than it did".