Sidechaining question about my new compressor

[plaid_emu]

Any help with this would be appreciated, as I've emailed JoeMeek about a week ago and haven't yet received a reply.

 

Please excuse my noobishnish concerning hardware compressors w/ sidechain input. I've messed with sidechain compression in Ableton but I haven't tried on the JoeMeek MC2 I bought a little over a week ago.

 

The manual recommends using a TRS "Y" cable in the sidechain insert as a send/return to an equalizer to more precisely compress certain frequencies. I'm not so interested in that right now but I'd like to duck a synth pad sound with a kick drum for that swelling pad effect. Is it possible to use a standard 1/4" TS or TRS cable to send the kick into the insert point? Do I have to use a TRS "Y" cable and only use the sending lead?

 

I already have a TRS "Y" cable but my AD/DA converter box only has XLR outputs, so I can't exactly use the 1/4" sending lead on the "Y" cable. I do have some XLR - TRS cables and a couple of XLR - TS cables as well. I just didn't want to short out the unit or overload it.

 

This is from the manual:

 

INSERT POINT

 

This is simply an unbalanced

[ChristianRock]

I think what it means is that on your mixer or external equalizer, you will want to emphasize certain frequencies that you want to show up more than others when the side-chain kicks in. It sounds more like a suggestion than something you have to do - if it's a bass drum, the frequencies will be obvious. Not so much with the snare, you could play around a bit more with that, and depending on how you EQ the snares it will define what will be thrown to the background when that snare shows up. Same thing with vocals. I think if you don't use an EQ, it might have a broader effect than you desire.

 

This is all theory of course, I'm still about to do some testing with hardware parallel/sidechain compressions on my own mixes.

[plaid_emu]

Thanks, I'm thinking you're right about that. No need to mess with an EQ for that particular task.

 

Now my concern is using the proper cable. TRS or will TS be OK? The only reason I haven't just tried it is because I don't want to damage the compressor by using the wrong cable, shorting something or whatever. I'm not that knowledgeable about those kind of technical details.

 

Probably being paranoid but I'd rather not have to send this thing to be serviced. If it takes them over a week to reply to my question there's no telling how long a repair would take! That said, it's a wicked little device and I'm really liking it so far.

[ChristianRock]

It's not expensive, either... definitely worth looking into. Let me know how the side chain compression works

[plaid_emu]

It's not expensive, either... definitely worth looking into. Let me know how the side chain compression works

 

The build quality is pretty damn impressive for $230. Sturdy black steel enclosure, thick-ass aluminum faceplate with beautiful dark green glossy paint. Machined metal knobs with the perfect amount of resistance. Inside looks quality too.

 

 

I was tempted by the tubes and the big fancy VU meters of the ART PRO VLA II although decided on the MC2 after reading about the component choices and the background of the design engineer.

 

I definitely will keep you updated once I figure the cable thing out. I'll probably even do a little review with audio clips because I had trouble finding decent user reviews and absolutely NO audio samples out there.

[veracohr]

That's kind of a weird setup. It looks to me like it was meant for you to be able to, in the case of de-essing, split the vocal signal right from the unit instead of sending a second signal from your mixer for the sidechain input. Convenient I guess but I don't think the manual explained it very well. So if you are using a second signal for sidechain, as in the case of ducking, I think you can just run it straight in. The signal needs to be on the ring, since it says the ring is the "return" (input). If you use a TS plug, the signal will only be on the tip.

[donaldcrunk]

as mentioned earlier, feeding your sidechain input a raw signal will be fine.

 

are you using this with an analog mixer, or an audio interface of some type? that information will determine how you go about setting up the sidechain.

[plaid_emu]

 

are you using this with an analog mixer, or an audio interface of some type? that information will determine how you go about setting up the sidechain.

 

 

I've got the JoeMeek's I/O wired to a Behringer ADA800 which is hooked up to an RME Fireface 400 via ADAT. All the mixing is done ITB with Ableton Live.

 

I'm really happy with the ADA8000 so far. It sounds great, works as advertised and stays out of the way. If you want to hear it in action here's a little something I recorded a few weeks ago when I was testing it:

 

Spectral Audio Neptune 2 - 24 bit @ 44.1k - 12.6 MB .WAV file

 

I'm using the RME's wordclock output to sync the ADA8000 with an Apogee "Wyde Eye" BNC cable.

[soundxplorer]

 

I'd like to duck a synth pad sound with a kick drum for that swelling pad effect. Is it possible to use a standard 1/4" TS or TRS cable to send the kick into the insert point? Do I have to use a TRS "Y" cable and only use the sending lead?

 

 

 

I would still use a TRS Y cable, but you'll leave the "send" half of the Y cable unplugged. Plug the "return" half into your drum machine, or wherever the kick is coming from.

 

Tip: send

Ring: return

Sleeve: ground

 

The "return" signal is on the Ring. If you just used a TS cable it would get shorted to ground and you wouldn't hear anything. At least, I'm pretty sure that is what would happen.

[plaid_emu]

 

I would still use a TRS Y cable, but you'll leave the "send" half of the Y cable unplugged. Plug the "return" half into your drum machine, or wherever the kick is coming from. Tip: send Ring: return Sleeve: ground The "return" signal is on the Ring. If you just used a TS cable it would get shorted to ground and you wouldn't hear anything. At least, I'm pretty sure that is what would happen.

 

 

The only reason I don't want to use a TRS "Y" cable is because all the 1/4" outputs on my RME are already being used. That's why I bought the ADA8000 in the first place, but the problem is the ADA8000 only has XLR outputs, so that's why I'm wanting to use the XLR > TRS cable. I thought using the XLR > TS cable might be a problem but what about the XLR > TRS?

[soundxplorer]

I thought using the XLR > TS cable might be a problem but what about the XLR > TRS?

 

Are you saying that you have a "Y" cable that is a 1/4" TRS jack on one end, and then two XLR connectors on the "Y" end? It sounds to me like that is just a regular balanced Y cable. It would be splitting the signal and sending the same thing to both XLR connectors. Don't use that.

 

Do you have a 1/4" TRS Y cable already ? The "Send (Tip)" and "Return (Ring)" ends should be female, right? If so, just get an XLR - 1/4" (unbalanced) cable like the one below and plug it into the "Return" end.

 

 

If your 1/4" TRS Y has male ends, that makes it harder. I would go out and buy one with female ends and then get this XLR to 1/4 cable.

 

[plaid_emu]

My outputs:

 

 

My cables:

 

Monster Cable SL500SRM1

Insert Cable, 1/4" TRS Male - Dual 1/4" TS Male, 1M Long

 

Monster Cable MSLCFX1

Audio Cable, XLR Female - 1/4" TRS Male, 1M Long

 

 

 

 

NO IMAGE - SPECIAL ORDER CABLE

Monster Cable SL500IFXM1

Audio Cable, XLR Female - 1/4" TS Male, 1M Long

[soundxplorer]

Well, that's a problem. That's the cable equivalent of a sausage fest.

 

To make that work you need a 1/4" female coupler.

 

 

That's why it's better to have the female version of the 1/4 TRS Y cable, as pictured in my other post. You just plug it in your compressor and leave it there, sort of like a "breakout" cable. You could imagine that those two female 1/4 connectors are right on the back panel of the unit itself, and thinking of it that way should make it easier. One is an Input, the other is an Output.

 

If you plugged that XLR > 1/4 TRS cable directly into your JoeMeek, you're effectively plugging the same thing into both an Input and an Output. And the "hot" pin from the XLR is probably going to the Tip, which is not what you need in this case.

[veracohr]

 

If you plugged that XLR > 1/4 TRS cable directly into your JoeMeek, you're effectively plugging the same thing into both an Input and an Output. And the "hot" pin from the XLR is probably going to the Tip, which is not what you need in this case.

 

 

There's no problem - there will be a signal on the ring, which is needed, and an inverted signal on the tip, which won't matter.

[plaid_emu]

If you plugged that XLR > 1/4 TRS cable directly into your JoeMeek, you're effectively plugging the same thing into both an Input and an Output. And the "hot" pin from the XLR is probably going to the Tip, which is not what you need in this case.

 

Thanks for taking the time to reply. Damn, maybe I'm just retarded or being really paranoid.

 

Is it still a bad idea to use the XLR > TRS cable even if I don't need to use the "send" end for an audio signal? All I'm trying to do is duck a pad sound with kick. I'm not trying to actually use a send/return loop with EQ to notch out a specific frequency.

 

What if I use the XLR > TRS cable and the compressor's sidechain output is receiving an input signal? Will something get shorted, fried?

[plaid_emu]

 

There's no problem - there will be a signal on the ring, which is needed, and an inverted signal on the tip, which won't matter.

 

 

Thanks. I'll try it.

[soundxplorer]

What if I use the XLR > TRS cable and the compressor's sidechain output is receiving an input signal? Will something get shorted, fried?

 

I don't think you'll damage anything.

veracohr says it's OK. I've never tried it.

[veracohr]

What if I use the XLR > TRS cable and the compressor's sidechain output is receiving an input signal? Will something get shorted, fried?

 

Honestly it probably depends on how the circuit is designed, but most likely that output has an opamp right before the ouput connection. You could theoretically damage it if you put a really hot signal into it, but I don't think it's likely. If you want to be safe, get a new XLR-TRS cable and cut the wire going to the tip.

[plaid_emu]

Honestly it probably depends on how the circuit is designed, but most likely that output has an opamp right before the ouput connection. You could theoretically damage it if you put a really hot signal into it, but I don't think it's likely. If you want to be safe, get a new XLR-TRS cable and cut the wire going to the tip.

 

So cut the red wire?

 

 

[veracohr]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!! DON'T CUT THE RED WI-

[plaid_emu]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!! DON'T CUT THE RED WI-

 

[plaid_emu]

It's ALIVE!!!

 

Can't believe this shit went for 2 pages for ....."cut the red wire"

 

Thanks everybody!