Members Ovid9 Posted March 16, 2012 Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 So....I don't really use tremolos yet. Hell, I don't know if I ever really will. I've never used any of the 3 trem arms I have lying about from various guitars with strat style trems. However, I might be getting a guitar with a Kahler Flyer trem on it. An old Peavey Mantis LT. Is there anything I should know about these in particular? I know I'll have to learn how to restring a floating trem guitar now....but...any serious issues to look out for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members magh8 Posted March 16, 2012 Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 the flyer is a direct mount...if they are anything like the kahler pro trems soloing will almost always throw it out of tune.at the end of any run do a dive with the trem and it will reset itself unless the cams are wasted.if you are use to hartails and tunamatics you will like the feel of the kahler...I prefer kahler trems because I am more comfortable playing them...most floyded guitar out there are recessed and I don't like that {censored}.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ovid9 Posted March 16, 2012 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 the flyer is a direct mount...if they are anything like the kahler pro trems soloing will almost always throw it out of tune and the end of any run dive with the trem and it will reset itself unless the cams are wasted I understand the words...but...not all together like that. So...assuming I learn to solo. And I use the trem....it goes out of tune. BUT, if I use the trem to dive....it will reset itself? I think is what you said? Direct mount..yes. That good, bad, indifferent? Thanks man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members magh8 Posted March 16, 2012 Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 I understand the words...but...not all together like that. So...assuming I learn to solo. And I use the trem....it goes out of tune. BUT, if I use the trem to dive....it will reset itself? I think is what you said? Direct mount..yes. That good, bad, indifferent? Thanks man. sorry fixed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ovid9 Posted March 16, 2012 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 sorry fixed... Thanks dude. Yeah I'm used to tuneomatics, teles and strat style trems that i never use. I may never learn to really use this one, but I did wanna know a lil bit about it. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goop Posted March 16, 2012 Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 The saddle assemblies are the weak link on the Flyers. As the saddles wear they slide around and the springs lose their tension which makes it difficult to intonate. Kahler sells a saddle upgrade for the Flyer for around $100. I have purchased and installed a few over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members magh8 Posted March 16, 2012 Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 The saddle assemblies are the weak link on the Flyers. As the saddles wear they slide around and the springs lose their tension which makes it difficult to intonate. Kahler sells a saddle upgrade for the Flyer for around $100. I have purchased and installed a few over the years. really???that sucks.I never owned anything with the flyer but did have a strat with a spyder trem and it was all {censored}ed up..I got rid of it quick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Krank'N Posted March 16, 2012 Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 Having owned both FR's and Kahlers ,heres my 2cents...Kahlers are easier to change strings and get in tune..Its easier to dive with Kahlers : its the cam -but ironicly it makes return to pitch more difficult....The shorter springs on Kahlers wear out faster...Floyds return to pitch more accurately..When the springs get loose on a floyd ,you just tighten the claw-problem solved...The knife edge on FR's goes bad and its time for a new bridge...If I rarely used the whammy then I would prefer the Kahler for its easy restringIf I was a dive bomber I would want a Floyd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ovid9 Posted March 16, 2012 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 Easier restring you say? WIN! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mesa/Kramer Posted March 16, 2012 Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 Flyers are tone killers. Had a buddy who had a Hamer blitz with a non locking trem.He had a flyer installed.It killed the tone of that guitar.Even unplugged, the strings sounded half muted once he put the khaler on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goop Posted March 16, 2012 Members Share Posted March 16, 2012 Flyers are tone killers. lol. This track was recorded with a stock Flyer.http://soundcloud.com/scrub-tillman/song014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ovid9 Posted March 17, 2012 Author Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 lol. This track was recorded with a stock Flyer. http://soundcloud.com/scrub-tillman/song014 Yeah, that tone was totally dead...... if by dead you mean full and thick and crunchy. Nice tune and playing man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goop Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 Yeah, that tone was totally dead...... if by dead you mean full and thick and crunchy. Nice tune and playing man. Thanks and I hope you score that Mantis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members -Assy- Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 Coming from a guy who is a Kahler collector/enthusiast, I gotta say the Flyer is probably the absolute worst, {censored}tiest tremolo Kahler has ever constructed. The company takes pride in precise craftsmanship and the highest quality materials, but the flyer might as well be made out of tin foil and baby farts. Most guitar they are stuck on from the factory are also pretty bottom-of-the-line {censored}ty. They were a piece of crap OEM tremolo that went on a lot of beginner guitars (and for some reason that is probably unexplainable, a few higher end models here and there, the mantis not being one of them). If you want to get into tremolos, look for the old Kahler floyd rose copies. Those tremolos are incredible as far as quality and construction goes, and usually the guitars they are mounted into are medium-high quality and can be found dirt cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ovid9 Posted March 17, 2012 Author Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 Coming from a guy who is a Kahler collector/enthusiast, I gotta say the Flyer is probably the absolute worst, {censored}tiest tremolo Kahler has ever constructed. The company takes pride in precise craftsmanship and the highest quality materials, but the flyer might as well be made out of tin foil and baby farts. Most guitar they are stuck on from the factory are also pretty bottom-of-the-line {censored}ty. They were a piece of crap OEM tremolo that went on a lot of beginner guitars (and for some reason that is probably unexplainable, a few higher end models here and there, the mantis not being one of them).If you want to get into tremolos, look for the old Kahler floyd rose copies. Those tremolos are incredible as far as quality and construction goes, and usually the guitars they are mounted into are medium-high quality and can be found dirt cheap. I was hoping you'd chime in. More good info to know. Pretty much as long as it stays in tune/doesn't constantly break my strings/doesn't disintegrate and fall off the guitar I'll most likely be fine. But if I do start fiddling around with it some and actually look to try and learn how to use a tremolo and incorporate it into what I call "playing" I might look around for an upgrade. Otherwise I probably won't worry about it too much. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members -Assy- Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 That being said I try to stay far far away from those old Peavey guitars UNLESS they are neck-through/set. Those neck joints are the {censored}tiest things I've ever seen. They are caked in paint, making the neck sit uneven. They tried to correct this by adding a neck-angle set screw, which removes the wood-to-wood contact making it sound even more like {censored}. Peavey = on that one. However if you find an old Peavey Destiny, BUY IT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goop Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 but the flyer might as well be made out of tin foil and baby farts. I love that description. Here's some tin foil and baby farts: I removed this from one of my Flyers and upgraded the saddle set. FWIW here is a quote attributed to Wammi World/Kahlerparts.com: "Did you know that you can turn your Flyer into a Pro by simply upgrading the saddle sets to the 2300 Series Saddles? All cams and saddles in our 2200 and 2300 series are interchangeable, including the 2230 Stud Mount and 2330 Flat mount Flyers. Feel free to upgrade your Flyers......go pro!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ovid9 Posted March 17, 2012 Author Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 I love that description. Here's some tin foil and baby farts: I removed this from one of my Flyers and upgraded the saddle set. FWIW here is a quote attributed to Wammi World/Kahlerparts.com: "Did you know that you can turn your Flyer into a Pro by simply upgrading the saddle sets to the 2300 Series Saddles? All cams and saddles in our 2200 and 2300 series are interchangeable, including the 2230 Stud Mount and 2330 Flat mount Flyers. Feel free to upgrade your Flyers......go pro!" I was on the wammi world site yesterday. I saw some of the upgrade stuff. If I ever want to upgrade, it doesn't look like it'd be too tough. Of course, I actually have to get the guitar first. *hates waiting* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goop Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 Those neck joints are the {censored}tiest things I've ever seen. They are caked in paint, making the neck sit uneven. They tried to correct this by adding a neck-angle set screw, which removes the wood-to-wood contact making it sound even more like {censored}. Peavey = on that one. I had a Peavey Patriot from the late 1980s. I could never get the action and intonation where I wanted it and that "neck angle set screw" baffled me. I ended up selling it after a few months. I never thought about the neck joint caked-in-paint thing being the cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goop Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 This thing is cheap enough I'm not worried about it, but I understand what you're saying. I was on the wammi world site yesterday. I saw some of the upgrade stuff. If I ever want to upgrade, it doesn't look like it'd be too tough. Of course, I actually have to get the guitar first. *hates waiting* The Flyer, especially with an upgrade is probably good enough for basement hacks like us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rock Hardness Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 My cousin drove a friend to Tower Records in the late '80s so that the friend could enter a contest. The guy entered himself 25 times and entered my cousin once for driving. Guess who won a Gibby Explorer and backstage passes to a Scorpions show without knowing it? Long story short, I bought it off of him because I didn't know any better. Kahler flyer mounted on a plastic shim. Total tonesuck. Removed the shim and changed the pickups to Duncan Invaders (yeah, right). Still sucks the tone. Will not stay in tune for love or money. Haven't played it in 15 years. I should really convert it to a hardtail. Someday... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ovid9 Posted March 17, 2012 Author Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 The Flyer, especially with an upgrade is probably good enough for basement hacks like us. Hell yeah! Course...you're a better basement hack then me! Hell, the only song I even sort of know that uses a trem is "Possum Kingdom" by the Toadies. If I do get the guitar that's the first thing I'm gonna play when I get home. Edit: Gibson Explorer with Trem? Yeah, hardtail that bitch up dude! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rock Hardness Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 Edit: Gibson Explorer with Trem? Yeah, hardtail that bitch up dude! Yes, I really should!! Low on a long list of must-do stuff. Like fretjobs for the other girls that get more lovin'. And steady work. And credit card balances. First world problem'd:mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goop Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 I should really convert it to a hardtail. Someday... Good idea. That's the only way to really know if it's the Kahler's fault or not. Some guitars sound like ass no matter what bridge you put on them. Unfortunately I've owned more than my share. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kardula Posted March 17, 2012 Members Share Posted March 17, 2012 Flyers are tone killers.Had a buddy who had a Hamer blitz with a non locking trem.He had a flyer installed.It killed the tone of that guitar.Even unplugged, the strings sounded half muted once he put the khaler on it. in general locking trems will kill tone/sustain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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