Piracy domino effect finally being in full effect

[satannica]

 

I will dispute it because from a realistic standpoint it cannot happen. To reduce file sharing by 100% is impossible. Even a 50% reduction would be extremely difficult. You have countries like Sweden which are granting religious freedoms to those who follow a file sharing belief. You have people in Russia and Ukraine who download whatever they want to, because they are outside of US jurisdiction, and they (or at least Russia, I'm not sure about Ukraine) do not have an extradition treaty with the US. The Chinese copy American movies and TV shows, at will. In fact, they regularly violate Patent laws by copying commercial and military hardware. This has been going on for decades, and the United States hasn't been successful at stopping it precisely because they can't do anything about it. Again: The only way to realistically put a dent in online piracy is to completely shut down the internet. Simply shutting down a handful of websites and calling it a day isn't going to work in the long term.

 

 

They cannot do anything about China because that's where we get all our cheap hardware from. If we set up embargos or trade sanctions until they stopped ripping off western-world inventions, we would only be cutting off the arm to solve the problem of the cut finger.

 

IMO, when the Internet first came to the fore to everyone and nobody in about 1995/1996, about half of what you clicked on resulted in some sort of dodgy child porn or extreme mutilation stuff. However, ISPs, internet watchdogs and local law enforcement have all but eradicated both save for I would suppose a few sites hosted in who the hell knows where. I'm sure if you wanted it, you could find it, but it's certainly nowhere near as proliphic as it used to be.

 

I see no reason why illegal downloads cannot be smacked with the same brush. Its not a question of whether or not the technology is there to disallow this sort of sharing and yes, it will impenge on civil liberties - there's nothing anyone can do about that.

 

Let me put it to you this way. If an open and free internet one day disrupted you heavily from doing your job, what would your reaction be? Regardless of whether or not it was actually possible technically or even the specifics of it. If you turned up one day and your boss said "Now we have the internet, you better do what you do for bare minimum wage, or we'll get the internet to do it for us for free!"...

[NeloAngelo]

 

lol...such a tough guy...every time you post.

 

i asked a question.

[satannica]

 

Chew on this. Koloss leaked in pristine quality, sold a lot, obzen leaked at decent quality sold more than catch 33, catch 33... I don't think it leaked. Sold little.

 

 

Chew on this:

Catch 33 was their first album; I don't think they were at the height of popularity with their first disk. Certainly I didn't really even listen to them until recently.

The amount of press and advertising I've seen done for Koloss is insurmountable. Just leafing through a couple of magazines, I see at least 30 mentions of Koloss, be it in review form, Meshuggah talking about latest music or interviews. It's had serious marketing.

 

Regardless, you or I would have to ask Meshuggah what their opinion is regarding the matter; let me know what they say won't you since you obviously have the direct line.

 

Similarly, the point a lot of us are arguing is about who piracy hurts most. Sadly, you've missed it continuously;

 

When an artist is at a place where they can gig nationally and draw a crowd and have been selling product, they are fast reaching a point where they need help to get onto better tours, better support slots, get better reviews for their output, get some advertising budget, get some revenue to record something that wasn't done in the guitarists' basement with an mBox, get some revenue to go and do some gigs where people want them. This is where a label is invaluable and a fact of life for a lot of bands. No, youtube and facebook alone is insufficient for the most part. I'm sure you're going to wax on about how great Ola is doing or yada yada, but surely you can see that he is a classic case of right place, right time; the fact he was walking around MusicMesse with manufacturers practically throwing gear at him is testament and, frankly, enviable!

 

Back on point; eventually an artist needs the services of a label. During the negotiation process (which I have been a part of numerous times), the label will want to see some good accounting work. This includes you demonstrating that the business side of the artist has been operating to a profit. They don't expect efficiency or well oiled machines, but they want to see numberwork. 99% of the time, this means "how many copies of your last album did you sell". There are only three answers they can give:

 

- We sold loads and continue to be inundated with orders which we're struggling to keep due to how long it takes to manufacture product

- We sold none, but we have generated income from doing xyz - possibly being picked up by an amp company and on loads of advertisements, or television work, etc.

- We manufactured loads but haven't shifted any. But we got 10/10 in Metal Hammer.

 

Only two of those answers will lead to a label remaining seated at the table.

 

I'd hope you can make up the rest.

[DVaz]

Chew on this: Catch 33 was their first album; .

 

Except for the 4 before it.

 

The rest sorta falls apart from there

[NeloAngelo]

 

Chew on this: Catch 33 was their first album

 

then what the {censored} were chaosphere, or destroy erase improve, or contradictions collapse?

 

i didn't know meshuggah started in 2005? who the {censored} were the meshuggah who put out contradictions collapse in 1991?

 

i never knew who the {censored} meshuggah was, until i started pirating and i heard destroy erase improve in the late 90's (napster ftw!). after that, when i could afford to buy music, i bought everything i pirated by them and everything they released since.

 

 

tell me again how pirating hurts music.

[satannica]

Except for the 4 before it.

My mistake for not being Encyclopedia Meshuggah? I don't even like em hahaha.

 

The rest sorta falls apart from there

 

No, you're just too arrogant to read or try to understand it!

[DVaz]

 

then what the {censored} were chaosphere, or destroy erase improve, or contradictions collapse? i didn't know meshuggah started in 2005? who the {censored} were the meshuggah who put out contradictions collapse in 1991?

 

 

They were Nothing

[satannica]

 

then what the {censored} were chaosphere, or destroy erase improve, or contradictions collapse? i didn't know meshuggah started in 2005? who the {censored} were the meshuggah who put out contradictions collapse in 1991?

 

 

Like I said, I don't have Meshuggah's mobile number... clearly you do, so maybe you can garner their $0.02?

 

I have DEP... it's {censored}.

[DVaz]

My mistake for not being Encyclopedia Meshuggah? I don't even like em hahaha. No, you're just too arrogant to read or try to understand it!

Your mistake for not doing 5 seconds of research, then going off half-cocked, under-informed and over-opinionated.

Then bluster around insulting people to try and cover your mistake is just the icing on the cake

And you actually own one of the albums that precedes catch 33 as well

[NeloAngelo]

Your mistake for not doing 5 seconds of research, then going off half-cocked, under-informed and over-opinionated. Then bluster around insulting people to try and cover your mistake is just the icing on the cake And you actually own one of the albums that precedes catch 33 as well

i'm reminded of the titanic lol.

[satannica]

 

i'm reminded of the titanic lol.

 

 

I'm reminded that trying to debate anything with you guys is rather akin to stabbing myself in the eyes with a metal ruler!

 

{censored} it, you're right, we're all wrong.

[DVaz]

i'm reminded of the titanic lol.

 

 

I also pirated Destroy and chaoshpere, ages ago when I did that all the time.

 

I disliked them instantly.

 

I would never have bought them if I just heard them once.

 

They kept coming up when I stick all my music on random.

 

I grew to like them, and get more of what they were about

 

I now own all the main releases (as in primary albums + I, none of the EPs (except I, if that qualifies) or rare stuff) on CD.

 

Just sayin'.

 

Edit: except kolloss. I dont like it. But then I've only heard a couple of tracks. Maybe if I pirate it and give it a year to sink in I'd buy it

 

I'm being only partially flippant btw: I dont pirate as a matter of course any more, but I do also know with complete certainty that I wouldnt own quite a large amount of CDs if I didnt. I dont know if thats representative of your average music-pirate, I rather doubt it but it is one way that the practice can play out.

[satannica]

I also pirated Destroy and chaoshpere, ages ago when I did that all the time. I disliked them instantly. I would never have bought them if I just heard them once. They kept coming up when I stick all my music on random. I grew to like them, and get more of what they were about I now own all the main releases (as in primary albums + I, none of the EPs (except I, if that qualifies) or rare stuff) on CD. Just sayin'.

 

Excellent; I'm sure they'd thank you in person if they could

[NeloAngelo]

 

I dont pirate as a matter of course any more, but I do also know with complete certainty that I wouldnt own quite a large amount of CDs if I didnt. I dont know if thats representative of your average music-pirate, I rather doubt it but it is one way that the practice can play out.

 

+1

 

if i didn't pirate back in the day, i would still be listening to metallica today. and only metallica.

[satannica]

 

I'm being only partially flippant btw: I dont pirate as a matter of course any more, but I do also know with complete certainty that I wouldnt own quite a large amount of CDs if I didnt. I dont know if thats representative of your average music-pirate, I rather doubt it but it is one way that the practice can play out.

 

 

I don't disagree with your sentiment at all! Fully agree; however there are avenues to go down. So the eradication of piracy if, for sake of argument, it came about would not prevent you from doing so. I buy a lot of CDs on the strength of covermount disks, youtube mixes and very occasionally bands supporting other bands I'm paying to see. Piracy is not the only method of finding new bands. Indeed, it's easier probably, in many ways, but that doesn't make it acceptable.

[NeloAngelo]

 

I don't disagree with your sentiment at all! Fully agree; however there are avenues to go down. So the eradication of piracy if, for sake of argument, it came about would not prevent you from doing so. I buy a lot of CDs on the strength of covermount disks, youtube mixes and very occasionally bands supporting other bands I'm paying to see. Piracy is not the only method of finding new bands. Indeed, it's easier probably, in many ways, but that doesn't make it acceptable.

 

if i go the youtube route, and it's a band from another country, i usually get "this video is not available in your country." that doesn't happen on torrent.

 

as for going to shows, not every place in america hosts live music. and {censored} traveling for hours one way for a show. i don't own a car or have friends.

[satannica]

Spotify?

 

Artists/labels often stream new albums for free prior to release too!

 

Also, I've never had an issue with accessing videos from anywhere; I'm in the UK too. Where are you, Russia?

[Stevetemp]

i asked a question.

 

 

Not sure about your stuttering problem so I can't verify that. Also not sure how your auto-correct is working.

 

But usually "wat" means don't get your point. But it's okay. Don't worry about it.

[NeloAngelo]

Not sure about your stuttering problem so I can't verify that. Also not sure how your auto-correct is working. But usually "wat" means don't get your point. But it's okay. Don't worry about it.

 

 

No, it means you are feigning ignorance because you have no rebuttal.

[Stevetemp]

No, it means you are feigning ignorance because you have no rebuttal.

 

Well there ya go....you got me.

[uppercasenoises]

They cannot do anything about China because that's where we get all our cheap hardware from.

 

 

But it's not just that. They are copying our military hardware as well...hardware that is produced in the US by American companies using American workers. A lot of this stuff is top secret, yet the Chinese get access to the information by hacking their way in. Example: A couple years ago the Chinese hacked their way into the F-35 program and downloaded data off of BAE and LM servers.

 

IMO, this is a MUCH bigger threat than downloading some songs off the internet, because they are going after technology where trillions (literally) of dollars have been invested. This really leads me to doubt their capabilities on stopping people from downloading music.

 

Unless multiple governments work to shut down the entire world wide internet, you're still going to have plenty of people downloading music when they want to. This idea of just shutting down a handful of websites and then saying "okay we're done here, online piracy is no longer a problem", isn't going to convince me.