Why was/is hendrix the best?

[Jimi Ray Halen]

Originally posted by StatesboroBlues Jimi Ray Halen, "Um, I hate to burst your Duane bubble but Derek Trucks (what's he about 24 now?) is a better slide player then he was. Warren Haynes is right up there." Derek & Warren are very good slide players. I hate to burst your Derek & Warren bubble, but both of them have said Allman was the best & most everyone agrees with them. The Allman bubble is intact. "But even though both learned their chops in the South, Jimi played the Chitlin' Circuit where showmanship was expected. Just playing well wasn't enough." I know just playing well was not enough for Jimi. Duane didn't need to do anything but play. "But Duane didn't have the Beatles, Stones, Clapton, Beck, Townsend, etc. coming out to a small club to see him before he even recorded." Um, let's see, weren't all these guys in the same city? Yeah, it was London. Not to difficult to drop in to see someone play. Since Allman was in the USA, it would have been a little more difficult. But, Clapton did know about Allman & when he came to the USA he did go see Allman play. He was so impressed with Allman's playing that he asked him to play on his album, Layla. Could you image the song Layla (you know, probably Clapton's most famous song) without the opening riff? Say thank you Duane, he came up with it, not Eric. I don't remember Clapton asking Jimi or Derek to play on an album. "Duane impressed other musicians. Jimi changed how they played." I didn't hear Clapton's playing change until he played with Allman on the Layla album. Many believe this was Clapton at his best & it was because he was being pushed by Allman. I do believe Hendrix was one of the best, just not the best.

I've heard Duane and I've seen Derek (twice) and he has developed into a better player than Duane was. I'm not the only one who thinks so. That's pretty much a consensus. Maybe that's because he doesn't party and is totally devoted to learning. Of course he's going to say Duane was the best. What's he supposed to say - "Well I've studied Duane's techniques very intensely and played with the Allman Bros. for awhile now and I think I've surpassed him"?

Duane wasn't able to pull off the showmanship stuff. None of the white boys at the time were. It adds a degree of difficulty to playing that unless you've tried it, you don't know.

One of the first things that Jimi did upon landing in London was get on stage with Cream. This was before he even had a group or had recorded Hey Joe. So I don't think that recording with EC would have been a problem, had he lived long enough. (Derek wasn't even born yet) JH rocked their worlds. Clapton has said that he was depressed because he knew that he couldn't do what Jimi did. As great as he is. Jeff Beck was a fan for chrisakes. The Beatles & Stones went to see him in a small club based strictly on word of mouth. Imagine doing one of your first gigs and seeing Jagger, Richards, McCartney, Lennon, Beck, Clapton, Townsend, et. al. sitting in the audience. This kind of stuff just doesn't happen every day.

Actually Clapton's playing took a turn for the worse for awhile after Cream. I know that being a heroin addict will do that to most folks but if it wasn't for J.J. Cale, EC might have faded away. His best playing was Disraeli Gears and Wheels of Fire. I mean, Delaney, Bonnie, and Friends?

Why do you think most of the greats switched to Strats? Coincidence?

I see all these names mentioned and some of them are probably better at individual aspects of playing. They may have better slide skills. They may be able to do jazz chording better or shred faster. Or whatever.

But nobody has named one single person who was better at being the entire package - singer, songwriter, guitarist, performer, frontman who has had as many or more hits in such a brief period of time. Hits that still get airplay 35 years later.

The scary thing was that if Jimi hadn't been writing, singing, being a showman, etc. and could have just played guitar as a sideman, he would have set the bar even higher. But he didn't have that luxury.

I read an interview with Babe Ruth once where he said that he tried to hit home runs every time he came up to bat. That if he had tried to hit for average he probably would have finished with a .600 batting average. But he gave the people what they came to see.

So did Jimi.

[Codmate]

Originally posted by Jimi Ray Halen It's been my experience that either you "get" Jimi immediately or you never quite will. The man was simply the best. Consider: snip...

 

 

Sums up my feelings about JH pretty much.

 

I think 'feel' is the main word.

 

I don't think the guy was 'the best' of all time. I don't think anybody can be.

 

All the greats are great for different reasons - this is why individuality is important, and Jimi had this in spades.

 

There are other guitarists who are just as great in their own ways though.

Django Reinhardt, Lenny Breau, Tommy Emmanuel, Chet Atkins, John Williams, Julian Bream, Jimmy Page, John McLaughlin and many more.

 

Jimi is simply the most visible great guitarist of all time.

[jerry_picker]

For musicianship, composition, teaching, depth and breadth of career, recordings, and influence, almost singlehandedly bringing guitar from a folk or ethnic/novelty status to a highly respected and recognized instrument for virtuoso performance, it would undeniably be Andres Segovia.

Without question.

The greatest guitarist to date.

Very probably the greatest musician to play the guitar to date.

[Codmate]

Originally posted by jerry_picker For musicianship, composition, teaching, depth and breadth of career, recordings, and influence, almost singlehandedly bringing guitar from a folk or ethnic/novelty status to a highly respected and recognized instrument for virtuoso performance, it would undeniably be Andres Segovia. Without question. The greatest guitarist to date. Very probably the greatest musician to play the guitar to date.

 

 

Yes Segovia was a genius of the guitar.

 

Could he improvise an incredible multi-layered, multi-genre solo though?

 

Lenny Breau could.

 

So again - no one guitarist can ever be 'the best'. There are many greats, they all have their place and we can learn from all of them.

[jerry_picker]

Originally posted by Codmate Yes Segovia was a genius of the guitar. Could he improvise an incredible multi-layered, multi-genre solo though?

 

 

Does a flamenco-flavored rendition of a Bach trumpet concerto count?

[Tonemeister87]

I don't know what all the fuss is about. Hendrix wasn't one of the greatest players at all.

He was a cool artist, but thats about it.

FLAME ON!

[Codmate]

Originally posted by jerry_picker Does a flamenco-flavored rendition of a Bach trumpet concerto count?

 

 

No.

 

Lenny Breau could fit country, jazz, blues, classical, flamenco styles and more into one entirely improvised tune that, not only would make sense, but also be stunningly beautiful.

 

Accept that there are some things Segovia could not do on the guitar that others could and a whole world will open up.

[StatesboroBlues]

Jimi Ray Halen,

After reading your last post, I can see we have very, very different tastes in music. Not just the Hendrix thing, but also Clapton's best playing & Derek surpassing Allman. So, although I'm sure we could both go on forever stating different reasons why we like who we like, I think we have said enough. I'm not going to change your opinion & you're not going to change mine. It's been fun, we can take it up again in twenty years. At least by then one thing won't have to be discussed, Derek will be long forgotten. I know, you'll say "No he won't" & I'll say "Yes he will" & you'll say "Oh yeah" & I'll say "Yeah" & ............................... Forget I said it.

[jerry_picker]

Originally posted by Codmate No. Lenny Breau could fit country, jazz, blues, classical, flamenco styles and more into one entirely improvised tune that, not only would make sense, but also be stunningly beautiful. Accept that there are some things Segovia could not do on the guitar that others could and a whole world will open up.

 

 

"No" is pretty definitive...

I certainly acknowledge that Lenny Breau was a very great guitarist, perhaps (perhaps) with no technical or improvisational peer. However, it seems downright flip to dismiss Segovia's abilities outright.

[buddy.H]

i absolutely love hendrix, he was the reason i started to play guitar. Recorded my fathers lp of BOG on tape and listened to it a whole summer on my walkman untill the tape died. He had something incredibly special going on. But my number one player is Django Reinhardt, and i find it weird he hasnt been mentioned before. He also did all his soloing with just only 2 fingers . I listen to hendrix more, but damn, django, unbelievable !

[Jet Bycraft]

Originally posted by Jimi Ray Halen It's been my experience that either you "get" Jimi immediately or you never quite will. The man was simply the best. Consider: 1. He fronted a power trio. Not too many other guitar Gods did that. Beats Page right there. 2. He wrote all the songs (except for the covers, of course, which he did better than the originals). 3. He changed everything guitar when he came onto the scene. Who else did Beck, Page, Clapton, Townsend, etc. line up to go see play live in London? Nobody else, that's who. 4. He was only famous and producing music for three years. Three years! Look at the impact he had in three years. Look at how much he recorded. It takes some bands that long to be able to record one CD. 5. His versatility is unmatched. A lot of people think of Purple Haze or Foxy Lady when they think of Jimi. Great tunes. But listen to his songwriting ability and genius on his pretty songs. Little Wing is but one example. 6. He was the consumate showman. He didn't just stand there and play (Clapton), although he would have liked to. He learned early on how to entertain. Why do you think he played with his teeth, behind his head, while doing rolls, etc.? Because most White folks had never seen showmanship like that before. It became a trap for him after awhile, but he felt obligated. THIS is why some folks have the mistaken idea in their heads that somehow he was a sloppy player. Say what? Excuse me? If you think that he was sloppy then pick up an old straight-from-the-factory Strat and playing the {censored} out of it like Jimi did (don't forget to turn it upside-down first), using the wammy bar the whole time, and see how in-tune you sound. Quick, play behind your head and see how many clams you hit. Do a roll onstage while playing a lead and see how perfect that Pentatonic comes out. Equipment was primitive compared to nowadays. Hell, guys were inventing gear for Jimi and he'd take it up on stage and make history with it. Besides that, Jimi came up on the so-called "Chitlin Circuit" backing up all the lengendary performers of the time. How long would a "sloppy" guitarist last there? About one set. Maybe two. Then they'd be back to washing dishes. Jimi never set out to be "The worlds' greatest guitarist". It just turned out that way. He saw himself as more of a singer/songwriter than anything else. He idolized Dylan over everybody. That tells you something right there. But more than anything else, it's his music that sets him apart. His songs still stand up 34 years later. You might say "Well so does the Beatles and Zeppelin music". Well, the Beatles wrote as a team and LZ were a 4-piece. You might say that Clapton fronted a power trio, but Jack Bruce did most of the singing. Jeff Beck is a "more technically brilliant" player. How many Beck songs can your average listener name off the top of their head? None. And so on. He was one of a kind. There will never be another one like him. He was so far ahead of his time that some people still don't get him, all these years after his passing. All you have to do is listen to Machine Gun off the Band of Gypsys album to get a feel for what Jimi was all about. He played from the heart and painted sonic masterpieces with the most basic materials. He was simply the best. (Getting off soap box now)

 

 

That says it all! Great post!

[jerry_picker]

Originally posted by Jet Bycraft That says it all! Great post!

A hymn for believers, a sermon to the choir...

[Sparky6string]

Everyone is right here since it's opinion. There are no scientific instruments to measure guitar greatness. I won't get into the debate but I'd like to say that IMO Jimi was indeed the best guitarist ever, songwriting, showmanship and his other talents aside. He's my all time fave as well as the idol of many a guitar god. I don't think that what he did on the guitar as well as his impact on music can be overstated.

[Jimi Ray Halen]

Originally posted by jerry_picker A hymn for believers, a sermon to the choir...

Yes, but all true nonetheless.

You would be in the "just don't get him" camp. I asked for someone to name one guitarist who did it all Like Jimi and did it better and so far no one has. So it's more of an opinion based on logic.

[Codmate]

Originally posted by jerry_picker "No" is pretty definitive... I certainly acknowledge that Lenny Breau was a very great guitarist, perhaps (perhaps) with no technical or improvisational peer. However, it seems downright flip to dismiss Segovia's abilities outright.

 

 

In what way does saying he was a genius of the guitar "dismiss Segovia's abilities outright."?

 

All I'm saying is that, in his field, Lenny Breau was better and therefore you can't say that Segovia was 'the best guitarist ever'.

 

Lenny was just as good a guitarist, as were and are many others.

[brikus]

Originally posted by G-tarist What do you think it was that made him the greatest? Was it technical ability? Creativity/Songwriting skills? Charisma? I'm trying to work out who I like more out of Hendrix and Page...so far I can tell what makes Page so great, but Hendrix I'm having a bit of trouble figuring out.

 

 

who the {censored} told you he's the best ? There is no best.

[flyguitar]

Jimi establihed electric guitar as original instrument. Not just "the electric spanish"

[Jimi Ray Halen]

Originally posted by brikus who the {censored} told you he's the best ? There is no best.

 

 

Well, you're right in some respects in that it's all subjective.

 

And what does it matter anyway?

 

But I have to tell you, I watched Jimi at Woodstock the other night doing the Star Spangled Banner and again I was struck with the techniques that he was doing way back then. The whammy bar, the controlled feedback, the chaotic sound effects all done with his hands - I don't remember anybody else doing that type of thing back then. He was able to truly express what he heard in his head through his guitar. He broke a lot of new ground.

[flyguitar]

Originally posted by Jimi Ray Halen The whammy bar, the controlled feedback, the chaotic sound effects all done with his hands - I don't remember anybody else doing that type of thing back then. He was able to truly express what he heard in his head through his guitar. He broke a lot of new ground.

 

[flyguitar]

Originally posted by Jimi Ray Halen The whammy bar, the controlled feedback, the chaotic sound effects all done with his hands - I don't remember anybody else doing that type of thing back then. He was able to truly express what he heard in his head through his guitar. He broke a lot of new ground.

 

 

That's exactly my point in previous post.