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Jazz Ad

Scale Shape (beginner Graal)

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Originally posted by Jazz Ad

Tonru's lefty
:D
.

 

I was looking at that trying to figure out what key that was when I saw the nut at the right. That makes sense to do it lefty.

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Originally posted by the_grouse_mouse

some good info here - thanks for your posts JazzAd and Tednagel!


Mouse

No probs. It seems to be more difficult to find tastey licks and runs for major keys than for minor or blues. Maybe it is just me. I spend a lot of time trying different things for the major key stuff. The minor and blues things allow a bit more room to stretch.

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Originally posted by tednagel

No probs. It seems to be more difficult to find tastey licks and runs for major keys than for minor or blues. Maybe it is just me. I spend a lot of time trying different things for the major key stuff. The minor and blues things allow a bit more room to stretch.

 

I agree. I've been trying to use the maj 7th, 6th and the 2nd notes a lot more in the last year. Sometimes they sound great, sometimes they suck. I cannot remember any off hand to post sorry.

 

Mouse

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Originally posted by the_grouse_mouse



I agree. I've been trying to use the maj 7th, 6th and the 2nd notes a lot more in the last year. Sometimes they sound great, sometimes they suck. I cannot remember any off hand to post sorry.


Mouse

That's cool. I think Pearl Jam used nearly every major 2nd lick ever. The major 7s are a blast to try to fit in. They work well when my guitarist plays correctly but get REAL sour when he is wandering. I like the tension they create. It's fun to leave them unresolved sometimes. My drummer hates it.

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Originally posted by the_grouse_mouse

I agree. I've been trying to use the maj 7th, 6th and the 2nd notes a lot more in the last year. Sometimes they sound great, sometimes they suck. I cannot remember any off hand to post sorry.


Mouse

The major 7th is a bitch. It only resolves to the root. When soloing, use a minor 7th, regardless of the key. It will always sound good.

 

6ths are painful but they make great passing notes.

 

Instead of the 2nd that sounds blurry on bass, use 9ths (one octave higher).

 

(edited thanks to JtheD)

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Originally posted by Jazz Ad

The major 7th is a bitch. It doesn't resolve to anything.

 

Which is why I love to end a gig on it...

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Originally posted by Jazz Ad

The major 7th is a bitch. It doesn't resolve to anything.

 

My good friend, I must disagree with this statement.

 

A major 7th (VII) resolves to the tonic (or I). The minor 7th (vii)natural resolution is to the sub-dominant (or IV).

 

 

 

Regarding playing scales in general.

 

Learn the patterns and the rest is easy. Two four finger one-position fingerings should work completely around the Circle of Fifths.

 

Practice the scales in every key. Every one of them two octaves. The do them using as many open strings as you can. Then do it without using any open strings. Then go back and do the entire Circle staying in one position for each key until you have to shift up on the top string.

 

Then start all over again without looking at the fingerboard.

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Originally posted by J the D

My good friend, I must disagree with this statement.


A major 7th (VII) resolves to the tonic (or I). The minor 7th (vii)natural resolution is to the sub-dominant (or IV).

Ahhh.

Finally, somebody disagrees.

Yes, the major 7th resolves to the tonic.

It's no exactly helpful when building a line since it doesn't bring you anywhere. Same for solos.

 

Good call on the scales.

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I made this up to help with my practice. It may not be "according to Hoyle", but it helps me.

 

----------------------------------------------------

 

Bass Scale Patterns

(Numbers indicate fretting finger)

 

Major Scale Pattern

(whole whole half whole whole whole half)

 

G --------------

D --1-----3--4--

A --1--2-----4--

E -----2-----4--

 

 

Minor Scale Pattern

(whole half whole whole half whole whole)

 

G --------------

D --1-----3-----

A --1-----3--4--

E --1-----3--4--

 

 

Pentatonic Major Pattern

(whole whole whole&half whole whole&half)

 

G --------------

D --1--------4--

A --1--------4--

E -----2-----4--

 

 

Pentatonic Minor Pattern

(whole&half whole whole whole&half whole)

 

G --------------

D --1-----3-----

A --1-----3-----

E --1--------4--

 

 

Blues Pattern

(whole&half whole half half whole&half whole)

 

G --------------

D --1-----3-----

A --1--2--3-----

E --1--------4--

 

(Edited for clarity. Tab stops didn't convert.)

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IMHO if I were starting from scratch again I would learn Arpeggios first. Every note in-between the notes of an arpeggio is valid (as they are all involved in one scale or another).

 

Just learn to hit the arpeggio notes at the right time and you are most of the way there.

 

I agree with also learning the Major scale in terms of degree. You can also use this method to easily transpose songs if you think of the chords as scale degrees.

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Originally posted by spong

IMHO if I were starting from scratch again I would learn Arpeggios first. Every note in-between the notes of an arpeggio are valid (as they are all involved in one scale or another)....

:confused:

Care to develop ?

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Well for starters every note is at least involved in a chromatic scale. Each note will also be included many other scales also. There are literally hundreds of different scales if you also include the modes of each scale. Diatonic scales are just the tip of the iceberg.

 

My point is that the arpeggio notes are the notes you want to know when to hit as all the other notes are really passing tones used to create mood/dissonance/resolution/direction/relief etc etc. The arpeggio notes are like the anchors anchoring the bass line to the chord progression.

 

As Charlie Parker could testify; Any note can be used in any chord progression - sounds pretty wild but it is true.

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the diatonic progression. Used in Asian and Hungarian trad. mooziks. (consecutive tone intervals)

this eg. in G

---------------------------------------------

------------------------3--5--------------------

-------------2--4--6-------------------------------

------3--5----------------------------------------

 

"squeak"

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I'm glad that; for our younger members you guys are talking about this...

My first musical experience was vocal...singing in the School Chior...YES...I was a Soprano :mad: ( and I still have my nuts) Thank You

BUT...I was taught that the Major scale consisted of 8 notes...like everyone else in America...Doe, Re, Mi, Fa, So, La, Ti, Da...

And that took me years to figure out what the hell was happening, (because I didn't really care for one thing) but that was what I was taught. But there is only 7 notes in the Major scale; it was like a revelation when "I" finally figured it out!!!

It still haunts my ass at times...

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hey Fran good story! Things like that are funny huh?

Did you have to do the hand actions for solfege?

 

My vox teacher was going to teach me them, but I said I wasn't really interested. She seemed a bit afronted, but is dealing it.

 

"squeak"

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Originally posted by Zomby Woof

I made this up to help with my practice. It may not be "according to Hoyle", but it helps me.


----------------------------------------------------


Bass Scale Patterns

(Numbers indicate fretting finger)


Major Scale Pattern

(whole whole half whole whole whole half)


G --------------

D --1-----3--4--

A --1--2-----4--

E -----2-----4--



Minor Scale Pattern

(whole half whole whole half whole whole)


G --------------

D --1-----3-----

A --1-----3--4--

E --1-----3--4--



Pentatonic Major Pattern

(whole whole whole&half whole whole&half)


G --------------

D --1--------4--

A --1--------4--

E -----2-----4--



Pentatonic Minor Pattern

(whole&half whole whole whole&half whole)


G --------------

D --1-----3-----

A --1-----3-----

E --1--------4--



Blues Pattern

(whole&half whole half half whole&half whole)


G --------------

D --1-----3-----

A --1--2--3-----

E --1--------4--


(Edited for clarity. Tab stops didn't convert.)

 

+1. That's how I learned them. When you get to the root note just start the pattern all over again.

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One thing I've changed recently is when I'm trying to pick up on a song from scratch is finding the main melody line and playing a simplified version of it or a (in my mind) clever variation of it in the groove with the drums. I find that it really helps me lock into a song and serve it better than thinking "I can play these notes on these scales over these chords". Like I'll try and nut out exactly what the main (usually vocal) line is, and cut it in half or so, really getting back to what the double bass did in classical music. McCartney I think constructed a lot of his basslines this way, I started doing it after learning a bunch of his lines.

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