Members padudeohio Posted August 31, 2004 Members Share Posted August 31, 2004 I'm just starting the lighting thing after many years of providing PA with minimal lighting. I'm looking for a DMX control surface that is easy (meaning I need DMX for Dummies:rolleyes: ) to program, has joystick grab and control capabilities, An audio input for beat synch. and can control at least 6-8 movers, plus dimmers for pars, strobe and fog. Any suggestions as far as brands and models to look at. Ease of programming is my primary concern here as opposed to price point. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BillESC Posted August 31, 2004 Members Share Posted August 31, 2004 Hi, There is a large range of controllers that can do what you ask, which one will depend on the complexity of show you wish to create. The Chauvet DMX 50 is simple to program but only allows for 240 scenes of memory. The Martin Freekie is simular but features 1200 scenes of memory. If software suits your fancy, NSI's new Axis 3.0 has unlimited memory, built in movement generators, multiple universes and a 3D visualizer. The above range in price from $ 239.95 to $ 699.95 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members padudeohio Posted August 31, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 31, 2004 I've used (or at least tried to use) the Chauvet ShowXpress software and interface. It is at the very least cumbersome to program, and does not offer any type of tap tempo or audio signal input to control scene tempo. The Freekie looks interesting....and I see it listed on your web site. What's the price??? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zeromus-X Posted August 31, 2004 Members Share Posted August 31, 2004 if you don't mind not having an instruction book that's worth anything, behringer's lc2412 works well. mine broke about a month after receiving it and their customer service was beyond excellent -- i had a new one within a week and a half, and they paid shipping back and forth. i'd highly recommend getting a compactflash to pcmcia card adapter ($10), and a cheap compactflash card (a few bucks for a 32 meg, or find a friend that has an old one that came with a digital camera or something). store the settings religiously. the behringer can be had for around $179. cheapest possible solution. the freekie, i believe, is $699 at guitar center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members padudeohio Posted August 31, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 31, 2004 Thanks Zeromus, but....no joystick and no audio input ...... those are musts for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BillESC Posted August 31, 2004 Members Share Posted August 31, 2004 Open box Freekies are available from $ 399.00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members padudeohio Posted August 31, 2004 Author Members Share Posted August 31, 2004 Looked at the manual for the Freekie. It seems as though it is more meant for DJ/Dance club use than live productions. I was also looking at the Chauvet items. The Tiger and the DMX 50. Both seem suitable for Live use with bands since there is a follow spot type function that can grab a scanner and use it as a pseudo follow spot. I like that. Bill, I'll be e-mailing you for some pricing tomorrow. Thanks for the insight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zeromus-X Posted September 1, 2004 Members Share Posted September 1, 2004 The lack of joystick does really suck, but for the price, I wasn't expecting much. It does have audio in, though... footswitchable and MIDI controllable as well. If you want the joystick, definitely look into the Freekie. Be aware that both the Freekie and the Behringer use a 5-pin DMX out. You'll need an adapter to connect to most DMX devices, which tend to use a 3-pin connector until you start getting into the stupidly expensive fixtures. The Freekie might have a 3-pin as well, but I don't remember seeing one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BillESC Posted September 1, 2004 Members Share Posted September 1, 2004 The Martin Freekie features two each 3 pin and 5 pin DMX outs. It also has a Joy stick with Capture ability, fog and strobe buttons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Joe Posted September 1, 2004 Members Share Posted September 1, 2004 Originally posted by padudeohio Thanks Zeromus, but....no joystick and no audio input ......those are musts for me. The Behringer LC2412 doesn't have a joystick, but it is easy to program and it does have an audio input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Never_Grew_Up Posted September 2, 2004 Members Share Posted September 2, 2004 The joystick function is really to make programming easier. Yes you can grab a fixture on the fly, but you will have limited success trying to track a moving object (like a singer moving around on stage) in realtime, especially if you're planning on running lights and sound at the same time. Better to get a board you can store lots of settings in and recall them easily. But you'll still have to edit/tweak at least some of your settings every time you set up because the angle/distance of the scanners to the stage will allways be different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members padudeohio Posted September 4, 2004 Author Members Share Posted September 4, 2004 I agree following a moving target with a thumb sized joystick isn't easy, but.....who said anything about a moving target.....When the guitar players in most of the bands I provide for are playing a solo, the don't move much except for thier mouths........ Now, back to control surfaces.... Bill, I didn't see anything in the Freekie manual about controlling dimmer packs, only fixtures. Am I missing something? I've also been looking at the Chauvet DMX Tiger. It's expensive, but looks interesting. Also the LSC DMX Operator II and Operator Pro..... Any info on these? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BillESC Posted September 5, 2004 Members Share Posted September 5, 2004 Hi Mic, Any DMX controller can control DMX dimmer packs. Some DMX controllers can even control analog dimmer packs with the use of an interface (but this is hardly worth the expense.) How many circuits of dimming do you need and what wattage per circuit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members padudeohio Posted September 5, 2004 Author Members Share Posted September 5, 2004 Told ya I was a DMX dummie...,. ..what do you expect, I'm an AUDIO guy.. I want to be able to control a dozen PAR 56's @ 500 watts ea,....6 250 watt scanners @ 6 channels ea. 4 color changers @250 watts ea. That should do it for now, If the client needs more than that, the can hire a lampie:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BillESC Posted September 5, 2004 Members Share Posted September 5, 2004 Hi Mick, Using the Chauvet DMX 50 for example, I'd set it up this way. Channel # ... Fixture (s) 1 - DMX 4 channel dimmer pack (pars 1-4) 2 - DMX 4 channel dimmer pack (pars 5-8) 3 - DMX 4 channel dimmer pack (pars 9-12) 4 - Color changers 1 & 2 5 - Color changers 3 & 4 6 - Scanner 1 7 - Scanner 2 8 - Scanner 3 9 - Scanner 4 10 - Scanner 5 11 - Scanner 6 12 - Spare This is of course only one of a number of possible configurations but should give you an idea of how to go about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members partycentral Posted September 10, 2004 Members Share Posted September 10, 2004 Originally posted by padudeohio I want to be able to control a dozen PAR 56's @ 500 watts ea,....6 250 watt scanners @ 6 channels ea. 4 color changers @250 watts ea. Dude, I light shows for live acts using a similar configuration, more or less, all the time. The thing you'll want to be able to do, IMO, is control the pars, the scanners, and the color changers independently of each other. With all that, you'll want something that can do simultaneous independent cues. I'd definitely go pc based. But programming that much stuff can take about 30 - 40 hours minimum to get it really tweaked out. Or you can hire somebody who's willing to travel ...http://www.party-chicago.com/rentals/rentals.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zeromus-X Posted September 10, 2004 Members Share Posted September 10, 2004 Originally posted by BillESC Hi Mick,Using the Chauvet DMX 50 for example, I'd set it up this way. That'd work great if each fixture was only one channel! Having all the lights working individually would use up a stupid amount of channels, and that Chauvet board doesn't have them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members padudeohio Posted September 11, 2004 Author Members Share Posted September 11, 2004 Doesn't the DMX 50 have 192 channels? That is more than enough for 6 moving heads, 4 color changers, 8 cans and a partridge in a pear tree I would think. As far as pc based....been there tried that burned the T-shirt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Never_Grew_Up Posted September 11, 2004 Members Share Posted September 11, 2004 The dmx50 only has 8 sliders + the joystick. It has 192 channels, but you can't easily grab any of the 192 at a moment's notice, meaning you have to program more. The Operator Pro has more sliders + joystick, giving you more direct control or the scanner parameters and the PARs at the same time. The question is how often will you be doing the same show with the same lighting setup, vs. how often you'll be doing one-time hired gun gigs where you've never seen/heard the band before, and don't have time to program everything. You might consider creating standard programs for the PAR cans since they won't move. So 1 slider could control all the red PARs, another all the blue, etc. Or program scenes with the PARs so 1 slider is stage right red/stage left blue. You can also create some programs for the scanners that sweep around or strobe or whatever. Then you only have to reprogram the settings where the scanners have to hit a specific spot, like the drum kit, guitar player, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members padudeohio Posted September 11, 2004 Author Members Share Posted September 11, 2004 I have 5 or 6 bands that I provide for on a regular basis. I actually think either controller will work for what I need to do. The moving heads that have to hit an exact spot at a certain time...That's why I wanted to get one with a joystick that could grab on the fly and control... I'll keep looking. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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