Members smartinez1984 Posted January 20, 2004 Members Share Posted January 20, 2004 Trying to figure out how to properly mic & control the sound on the drum kit at our church. We purchased a 5-piece mic kit and a drum shield to help us out because our church is fairly small. The sound is fantastic through the live sound (although I'm still trying to figure out the tricks to monitoring live sound) but we need to find a way to keep each mic from picking up sound from all the other drums. Do we need to purchase a compressor/limiter or another device to resolve this issue? If so, any recommendations? Thanks! -Samson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bassknave Posted January 20, 2004 Members Share Posted January 20, 2004 Gates are what you need. They'll open only when the drum is struck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members smartinez1984 Posted January 20, 2004 Author Members Share Posted January 20, 2004 Cool, thanks! Any recommendations on brand, model, etc.? -Samson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Old Steve Posted January 20, 2004 Members Share Posted January 20, 2004 Gates are one solution, but you may be complicating your things by adding them. IMHO, a bad gate is worse than bleed. Some stuff to consider: Anyway, if you want total control out of every drum, gates can help if you set them up right and use them well. On the other hand, if you just want good drum sound and don't NEED all of that control (i.e. your drummer plays well and 'self-balances' his own mix by playing with proper dynamics) you can get very good sound without using up as many inputs on the board. With the shields up, it's not likely that you're getting all that much bleed from other instruments up on stage anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members billiam Posted January 20, 2004 Members Share Posted January 20, 2004 APHEX 105 gate is an old standard for about $100-$200 on ebay. I just used my "new" used Symetrix 564e which has frequency conscious controls. I can set the filters so only the sound I want will open the gate. It worked SUPER on the hi-hat, the snare didn't trigger it once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members smartinez1984 Posted January 20, 2004 Author Members Share Posted January 20, 2004 Great info Old Steve! We have rehearsal tomorrow and I'll put some of your tips into the action. As for the toms, how would you go about micing them internally? Would you leave the bottom skin removed? Thanks again! -Samson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Drumtech Posted January 20, 2004 Members Share Posted January 20, 2004 Originally posted by smartinez1984 As for the toms, how would you go about micing them internally? Would you leave the bottom skin removed?-Samson I'd stay away from internal mic mounting hardware on drums... It's not cheap and you can probably solve your problem using gates or simply accepting the bleed (as a not so bad thing). Use gates on toms, and kick drum but don't get into gating the hats or overheads. Make sure you have a good drum sound (acoustically) and the bleed will not be an issue... If the room is small, you may want to individually mic the toms and hihat. Snare will bleed into everything from the hihat mic to the vocal mics. Internally mounting mics on toms, floor toms, kicks, etc., refers primarily to MAY type mounts that are installed in a semi-permanent fashion that allows both heads to stay on the drum. Results vary and probably overkill for your particular application... Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members smartinez1984 Posted January 21, 2004 Author Members Share Posted January 21, 2004 Great info, thanks! Are there any good books or websites that cover this type of info? -Samson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Parallex Posted January 21, 2004 Members Share Posted January 21, 2004 yes http://homerecording.about.com/cs/toppicks/tp/topdrumtips.htm it's for recording, but it should still apply. Also, the Drummer's Studio Survival Guide by Mark Huntly Parsons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Old Steve Posted January 21, 2004 Members Share Posted January 21, 2004 In addition to May internal mics (where the company actually customizes typical mics to work with their mounts, i.e. Shure's SM57 and the like) you can also look at internal mounts made by SIB Systems. They're cheaper, but you have to use your own mics. May's versions also come in a semi-permanent and a permanent installation model, and I believe that the permanent ones have some adjustability placement-wise from outside the drum. Internally micing drums has its own pros and cons, just like anything else. Once inside the drums and mounted, and with the heads (both) reattached, it's a pain in the butt to reposition the mics compared to just moving a mic stand. On the other hand, it can actually provide a cost savings....use the cheaper SIB systems mics and you may be able to keep the per-drum cost lower than the money you'd spend on gates (obviously that depends on the price of the mouts, mics, and type of gates you're looking at). In fact, if you're moderately handy, you can actually construct your own internal mic mounts. But as Drumtech pointed out, all of this might well be overkill for your situation. The key is to get your drums sounding good and working from there. Anyway, like anything else there are a thousand different ways to attack the problem, and the K.I.S.S. theory tells me that you should work WITH the bleed rather than completely trying to eliminate it. I also recommend the Drummer's Studio Survival Guide...I loaned my copy out and never got it back. It's a little dated, but the theories inside are still rock solid, and they writer tends to lean toward a more minimalist, organic approach to micing which is a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members smartinez1984 Posted January 21, 2004 Author Members Share Posted January 21, 2004 Speaking of which (since it seems to be the obvious place to start)... Is drum tuning basically done to taste or is there actually a "tuner" for drums? You probably guessed it, I'm not the actual drummer. My son plays drums and no one in the band is a professional drummer or even remotely close to understanding the tuning aspects of a drum set. My son is an excellent talent, place tremendously well, but is not trained. Any help I can get him would be great. Thanks! -Samson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ATOMICDOG1 Posted January 21, 2004 Members Share Posted January 21, 2004 Though I have a natural aversion to the "B" word, I have used the Beh... Beh... Behringer (Whew!) Quad noise gates before, and they have worked very well. http://www.americanmusical.com/item--i-BEH%20XR4400.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members beenabadbunny Posted January 22, 2004 Members Share Posted January 22, 2004 Originally posted by smartinez1984 Is drum tuning basically done to taste or is there actually a "tuner" for drums? You might find this useful: http://www.gibraltarlivemusic.com/tech/1039686092-drumtuning.pdf It's a drum tuning guide from Peavey. You'll need Acrobat Reader (available free from www.adobe.com ) to view it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Old Steve Posted January 22, 2004 Members Share Posted January 22, 2004 Click across to the drum board...lots of help there. The first thing they'll (we'll) tell you is to download Professor Sound's Drum Tuning Bible at http://www.drumweb.com/profsound.shtml. It's about 40 pages long, talks about head selection, different tuning methods, and tuning in special situations. Professor Sound lurks around on the Drum board himself, and he's usually pretty good about answering specific questions. Bottom line, it's a goldmine...and it's free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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