Need opinions on building my new rig: QSC KW153, Jbl, Bose L1 Mod II.......

[strat2]

Application:

 

Indoor /Outdoor venues.

 

I do a solo act with backing tracks accompanied by my guitar, and with possible keyboard, electronic Drum kit added later.

 

Main focus is Journey.

 

I'm wondering if Bose could bring on a sound as big (harmonically & sp levels) as a pair of 153's or equivalent Jbl's.

 

Also the 3 way KW 153's are 83 lbs vs 64 for the two way KW in 15" .

 

There is only about $100/$200 bucks difference so I'm wondering if the 3 way will be of benefit over the much lighter 2 way.

 

I like lot's of bass if it has clarity, and am reading the 153's might be enough of it so I can skip trying to integrate sub woofers.

 

I also need a mic that isn't as prone to feedback as my e835 Sennheiser, prefferably a condensor mic.

 

Mxl ? ATM710 ? Others ?

[witesol]

get the little 122 and a single sub. I personally would not want to drag around a pair of 153 for a solo acoustic gig.

 

the 835 isn't any more prone to feedback as anything else, if not a tighter pattern than a 58. a condensor may worsen your issues and not improve your sound.

[Speedhead]

I use electric drums all the time, I would definately use subs Always when using them.

[strat2]

get the little 122 and a single sub. I personally would not want to drag around a pair of 153 for a solo acoustic gig. the 835 isn't any more prone to feedback as anything else, if not a tighter pattern than a 58. a condensor may worsen your issues and not improve your sound.

 

 

I don't do an Acoustic gig.

 

80's Rock, lots of keyboards / guitars and general loudness.

 

I drive a camry so I'm trying to avoid subs.

 

[strat2]

I use electric drums all the time, I would definately use subs Always when using them.

 

Can you haul them around for me...............

 

I'm looking to get a minivan but the camry will have to work for a few months I think.

 

 

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[witesol]

I don't do an Acoustic gig. 80's Rock, lots of keyboards / guitars and general loudness. I drive a camry so I'm trying to avoid subs.

 

ok, but you want to take 153i in your Camry?

[Special J]

Er, what kind of indoor/outdoor venues? Small bars/patios, arenas/stadiums? What kind of crowd sizes?

[strat2]

 

ok, but you want to take 153i in your Camry?

 

 

Not really, but I measured and I can get one in the trunk, one in the back seat.........

 

So would these blow away a Bose system as I mentioned or...?

 

What about the trade off between the two way Kw's, lot's of tenor vocals and keyboards ?

 

 

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[witesol]

the problem with the 153 would be getting them up high enough. as it stands they'd be blasting peoples ears with horn. the smaller models would be best on speaker stands so you can have the coverage "reach" more effectively.

 

. not a bunch of difference between the two way and 3 that you should worry about. If it were me, I'd look into something like the K12 over K subs. skip the bose. or see if a single QSC HPR151i sub might fit. then on small gigs you'd have a quick, light easy setup.

 

keys and vocals would go fine with a 12+horn or 15+ horn either way.. it's when you start adding kick drum and bass into the mix when your headroom gets eaten up. neither the 152 nor the 153 does bass better than the other.

[strat2]

 

Er, what kind of indoor/outdoor venues? Small bars/patios, arenas/stadiums? What kind of crowd sizes?

 

 

Small venues, outside , small crowds , cranked volume .

 

If I wanted maximum volume / sp and sound given the systems,

would I go with the bose or kw's ?

[monthlymixcd]

RENT equipment from both spheres until you figure out what you need to use for the coverage required. What IS the coverage required?!?... how many people?

[strat2]

 

the problem with the 153 would be getting them up high enough. as it stands they'd be blasting peoples ears with horn. the smaller models would be best on speaker stands so you can have the coverage "reach" more effectively. . not a bunch of difference between the two way and 3 that you should worry about. If it were me, I'd look into something like the K12 over K subs. skip the bose. or see if a single QSC HPR151i sub might fit. then on small gigs you'd have a quick, light easy setup. keys and vocals would go fine with a 12+horn or 15+ horn either way.. it's when you start adding kick drum and bass into the mix when your headroom gets eaten up. neither the 152 nor the 153 does bass better than the other.

 

 

 

Cool , I have to head out for a bit, I'll check out the hpr's and have more questions later this afternoon....

 

Thanks.......

 

 

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[monthlymixcd]

(...having just read another 3-way box thread...)

 

If you can audition the PRX635 it might be worth a look. For a one man show I'd almost never recommend a 3-way cab due to weight, but that new PRX is apparently only 60lb. You might be able to get by with one on a stand or one over and PRX618S-XLF sub for a larger gig. You prbably still need two of anything if your room is wider though... for coverage.

[imnotded]

I had some of the HPR 3 ways and I think they would work well. But there is the problem that they are super hard to get the HF horns over the heads of people. And they weigh a ton. Those two reason were the biggest factor to me selling mine off. If those arent concerns for you I would give them a good look.

[monthlymixcd]

HPR153i=118lb.

KW153=83lb.

PRX535=74lb.

PRX635=60lb.

 

FYI

[witesol]

FYI

 

 

yea, i just now unloaded my 153i.

 

I don't think any of those are a good choice if you only have a toyota camry

[strat2]

 

the problem with the 153 would be getting them up high enough. as it stands they'd be blasting peoples ears with horn. the smaller models would be best on speaker stands so you can have the coverage "reach" more effectively. . not a bunch of difference between the two way and 3 that you should worry about. If it were me, I'd look into something like the K12 over K subs. skip the bose. or see if a single QSC HPR151i sub might fit. then on small gigs you'd have a quick, light easy setup. keys and vocals would go fine with a 12+horn or 15+ horn either way.. it's when you start adding kick drum and bass into the mix when your headroom gets eaten up. neither the 152 nor the 153 does bass better than the other.

 

 

Great tip on the horn issue, I guess I never really thought about that, it would be irritating not being on a pole, 83 lbs on a pole is hard work for one guy.

I used to put my 79 lb (+-) eon g2's on poles, but they are short compared to the 153's , that would add to the hassle.

 

I'm glad you rule out the Bose, while I like the lessened feedback' issues, I can 't see how I could get a big sound without at least 4 or more of their sub modules, + I think the pole doesn't exactly look very impressive.

 

If I had seprate subs, then I'd need a crossover right?

 

I didn't realize a kick and bass would eat up the headroom but that makes sense to me now.

What about mp3's /cd's, with drum/ bass imbedded, would the headroom issue change ?

 

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[Crownman]

I agree with the post above that said to rent until you figure out exactly what you need.

 

 

And when you say

 

 

I don't do an Acoustic gig. 80's Rock, lots of keyboards / guitars and general loudness. I drive a camry so I'm trying to avoid subs.

 

 

YOU NEED SUBS. So rent what you need until you figure out exactly what you need and until you get a vehicle that can carry what you need. Put the money you have to spend now towards the new vehicle instead of toward sub par gear.

[witesol]

 

Great tip on the horn issue, I guess I never really thought about that, it would be irritating not being on a pole, 83 lbs on a pole is hard work for one guy. I used to put my 79 lb (+-) eon g2's on poles, but they are short compared to the 153's , that would add to the hassle. I'm glad you rule out the Bose, while I like the lessened feedback' issues, I can 't see how I could get a big sound without at least 4 or more of their sub modules, + I think the pole doesn't exactly look very impressive. If I had seprate subs, then I'd need a crossover right? I didn't realize a kick and bass would eat up the headroom but that makes sense to me now. What about mp3's /cd's, with drum/ bass imbedded, would the headroom issue change ? 0, 0

 

 

no crossover needed for active cabs, it's built in.

 

on music playback it's a bit more forgiving but kick and bass is kick and bass. it's more evenly compressed on recorded music that's been mastered. things done by you may not apply. it all depends on how loud you need to play and how much chest thump you want. A pair of 15+horn cabs can do just fine...or be flapping away trying to recover from the kick drum hits:)

[strat2]

(...having just read another 3-way box thread...) If you can audition the PRX635 it might be worth a look. For a one man show I'd almost never recommend a 3-way cab due to weight, but that new PRX is apparently only 60lb. You might be able to get by with one on a stand or one over and PRX618S-XLF sub for a larger gig. You prbably still need two of anything if your room is wider though... for coverage.

 

 

The PRX line had caught my attention, I didn't realize they had a 3 way though.

 

The size and weight looks like a shoe in for what I'm doing.

 

I had planned on getting two regardless.

 

Now I need a decent 8 or 12 channel mixer , hopefully with decent reverb, compression and phantom power xlr's, usb connectability...........

 

 

Also a big issue with me has been feedback , I need a mic that has great feedback rejection.

 

 

My budjet though doesn't allow for Allen Heath or Soundcraft lol........

 

 

Alesis , Yamaha, Behringer, Macki........

 

 

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[strat2]

 

no crossover needed for active cabs, it's built in. on music playback it's a bit more forgiving but kick and bass is kick and bass. it's more evenly compressed on recorded music that's been mastered. things done by you may not apply. it all depends on how loud you need to play and how much chest thump you want. A pair of 15+horn cabs can do just fine...or be flapping away trying to recover from the kick drum hits:)

 

 

I was thinking if it was two seperate units/cabinets sub, full range, how would each one know without a crossover what to reproduce ?

 

I don't really need an explanation though if that's what they are designed to do.

 

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[strat2]

I agree with the post above that said to rent until you figure out exactly what you need. And when you say YOU NEED SUBS. So rent what you need until you figure out exactly what you need and until you get a vehicle that can carry what you need. Put the money you have to spend now towards the new vehicle instead of toward sub par gear.

 

 

I would love to rent, the only thing between me and a rental business is a 100 miles or so.

 

Unfortunately I need to buy to try.....

 

 

[abzurd]

Being a solo act I can't think of a worse speaker type. You don't need a 3 way speaker and after a few gigs you'll likely wish you hadn't purchased. They are a PITA to load, carry, and setup and almost are never at the proper height when I see them used. Add to that doing it alone... no thanks.

 

I'm guessing you think you'll get more bass this way and avoid the need for subs.... Guess again. If you find you need subs when using a nice 2 way 12" or 15" box, you would need them even if you had a 3 way system.

 

There are plenty of nice 2 way boxes that will suit your needs just fine - QSC, JBL, RCF, Yorkville, Yamaha, FBT, EV all make nice, light, and powerful powered speakers.

[strat2]

 

Being a solo act I can't think of a worse speaker type. You don't need a 3 way speaker and after a few gigs you'll likely wish you hadn't purchased. They are a PITA to load, carry, and setup and almost are never at the proper height when I see them used. Add to that doing it alone... no thanks. I'm guessing you think you'll get more bass this way and avoid the need for subs.... Guess again. If you find you need subs when using a nice 2 way 12" or 15" box, you would need them even if you had a 3 way system. There are plenty of nice 2 way boxes that will suit your needs just fine - QSC, JBL, RCF, Yorkville, Yamaha, FBT, EV all make nice, light, and powerful powered speakers.

 

 

No , I never thought I would get more bass with a 3 way than a 2 way speaker.

 

 

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[abzurd]

 

No , I never thought I would get more bass with a 3 way than a 2 way speaker. 0, 0

 

 

OK - I must have misread your original post.

 

I also noticed you're looking for a microphone not prone to feedback and thinking a condenser. Generally speaking, condensers are actually more prone to feedback. Doing the one man (no sound guy) thing, I'd shy away as they just aren't as forgiving. If you're doing the "put your speakers slightly behind you thing to avoid using a monitor", don't even think about a condenser. Honestly, your 835 is A-OK. If you really need feedback rejection look at something like an Audix OM5. You have to eat the mic, but it's not going to feedback on you.