Members SweetAlien Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 Or because of the previous 4 ones being so deadly boring noone cares anymore about it? It should happen in a few weeks, I suppose (was lazy to check the dates), so, do you expect anything, or are you just like me - indifferent and apathetic? Do you expect for something new/cool? Or not any more? As for me, I'm a bit pessimistic here, I don't believe we'll see any new hardware VAs or really new romplers... It looks like hardware musical instruments industry is dying slowly but surely... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Synthoid Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 Well let's see, we have Winter NAMM, Summer NAMM, what could be next? Viet NAMM? Hardware will always be around--that's for sure, but we're not expecting anything eventful coming from this show. Be nice if it did... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Array Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 Maybe we can all start speculating about this again: http://www.access-music.de/products.php4?product=virusd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members the_resonator Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 to be honest with you, i could give a flying {censored}. 1. there always seems to be devices similar to other already available ones:i mean, look! it's an alesis micron! (no, it's not in answer to the microkorg! don't be silly!) 2. there are new plug-in's, always..a lot...they're like video games now and there are just too many to care all that much about them 3. sometimes stuff you preview there will never actually come to pass, so it's just speculation and as such not very interesting to me. or it will come out 10 years later and i won't care anymore 4. most of the stuff that will actually come out there i have already seen either online, in any of 20 magazines or in newsletters. 5. if we start talking about NAMM, say a month or so before, it will have only been a little while since we stopped talking about the last NAMM..therefore making it an ongoing annoyance rather than an occasional one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members The Pro Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 After this past Winter NAMM we heard a lot of comments like "the worst NAMM ever...". I don't think the music industry has recovered from the economic slump, and while the economic slump was in full-swing there was no money to put into R&D, so the result is a slump in new music technology. This seems especially true for hardware, but not for software and softsynths which seem to be outpacing hardware by leaps and bounds. So I expect more of the same - little new hardware and some new softsynths, plugins and the like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elsongs Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 Winter NAMM = more synths/technology/pro audio oriented Summer NAMM = more guitar-oriented Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Synthoid Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 So, Summer NAMM is for the "dime a dozen" guitar players? Yawn..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members swandiver Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 The fact that "software is outpacing hardware by leaps and bounds" (which statement I generally agree with) befuddles me. If all hardware does is essentially run software, then why can't Korg, Roland, Yamaha, Kurzweil, Alesis, Novation, etc. come up with a keyboard whose software has the processing capability of running 256 notes of polyphony, 32 simultaneous effects, 16 simultaneous arpeggiations, etc. etc. etc. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mintbeetle Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 planned obsolescence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sevensinner Posted June 22, 2004 Members Share Posted June 22, 2004 Originally posted by Mintbeetle planned obsolescence? One would think so, yet many choose to hang onto old equipment and use it daily.. People still using real analogs, DX7's, D-50's, and M1's all over the place... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mildbill Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 i don't really care about this one - i'm tapped out and still have stuff i'm learning.(unless something totally irresistable is shown). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members enb141 Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 Originally posted by swandiver The fact that "software is outpacing hardware by leaps and bounds" (which statement I generally agree with) befuddles me. If all hardware does is essentially run software, then why can't Korg, Roland, Yamaha, Kurzweil, Alesis, Novation, etc. come up with a keyboard whose software has the processing capability of running 256 notes of polyphony, 32 simultaneous effects, 16 simultaneous arpeggiations, etc. etc. etc. ? Because they made an investment in research so if they now drop their synths and build only plugins they will loose a lot of that, also there's a lot of people that still prefer a hardware synth than a soft synth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chick korea Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 Originally posted by The Pro After this past Winter NAMM we heard a lot of comments like "the worst NAMM ever...". agree . what happend??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Altered Flesh Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 Originally posted by swandiver The fact that "software is outpacing hardware by leaps and bounds" (which statement I generally agree with) befuddles me. If all hardware does is essentially run software, then why can't Korg, Roland, Yamaha, Kurzweil, Alesis, Novation, etc. come up with a keyboard whose software has the processing capability of running 256 notes of polyphony, 32 simultaneous effects, 16 simultaneous arpeggiations, etc. etc. etc. ? Software may be getting better everyday, and for alot of things replaced hardware quite nicely (FM7 for instance). However, I have yet to hear ONE analog emulation VST that sounds like the real thing. Maybe I have super human hearing, maybe the VA craze has distilled some peoples expectations, but my crappy Juno-2 still sounds better (ie, not digital...and it IS digital!) compared to most VST synths. Sure, its nice that Arturia is cranking out emulations at a fraction of the price...but it still doesn't sound like the real thing. It doesn't all sound bad (though most VST synths are horrible) and I quite like Reaktor and Modular, but I can still hear a massive differance when playing real analogs and using VST. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members roblogic Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 Originally posted by swandiver ...If all hardware does is essentially run software, then why can't Korg, Roland, Yamaha, Kurzweil, Alesis, Novation, etc. come up with a keyboard whose software has the processing capability of running 256 notes of polyphony, 32 simultaneous effects, 16 simultaneous arpeggiations, etc. etc. etc. ? It's not the power of the software that's keeping that from happening, it's the hardware. Right now, the cost of the CPUs, DSPs, and RAM required to support those kind of specs would put the price of such a unit much higher that what most people would consider reasonable (think Hartmann Neuron). Moore's Law applies to digital hardware synths though, so wait a few years and every keyboard that comes out will have specs like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GregCh Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 Originally posted by The Pro After this past Winter NAMM we heard a lot of comments like "the worst NAMM ever...". I disagree. I like what Korg and Roland did for workstations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Analog Kid Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 Originally posted by roblogic It's not the power of the software that's keeping that from happening, it's the hardware. Right now, the cost of the CPUs, DSPs, and RAM required to support those kind of specs would put the price of such a unit much higher that what most people would consider reasonable (think Hartmann Neuron). Moore's Law applies to digital hardware synths though, so wait a few years and every keyboard that comes out will have specs like that. well, the Hartmann is a $4k synth with all the cpu power of a PIII system.so, one could easily flip the blade of capitalism over and ask, "how long can these companies attempt to sell underpowered products for thousands of dollars?" wow, they're still working on 128 voices... something workstations hit ten years ago. Still giving us low powered fx sections, still giving us huge cases. Also, honestly i dont see how moores law has held up for the past year. Theres been growth, but it no longer seems expodential In any event, maybe there will something interesting... i'll always have an interest in crappy little Roland boxes that are the bomb, but its hard to keep them seperate from crappy Roland boxes that are just crappy.Workstations are just ridiculous to me, right now, as any usb controller with a laptop would leave them in the dust. LOL, maybe im just disapointed cause it seems like they've gone downhill since the EX-5. Maybe Roland will release the V-Marimba Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members roblogic Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 Originally posted by Analog Kid well, the Hartmann is a $4k synth with all the cpu power of a PIII system.so, one could easily flip the blade of capitalism over and ask, "how long can these companies attempt to sell underpowered products for thousands of dollars?" No argument here, manufacturers push prices to the limit of what the market will bear. They'll gouge us as long as we buy their products at those prices. That's business. wow, they're still working on 128 voices... something workstations hit ten years ago. Still giving us low powered fx sections, still giving us huge cases.Also, honestly i dont see how moores law has held up for the past year. Theres been growth, but it no longer seems expodential Intel says the law's holding up. Although, they kinda have to say that, whether it's really true or not. IMO, Moore's law is holding up, but we're not seeing the increase in horsepower in the synth world because synth R&D has slowed to a crawl due to the winter economic climate of the past few years. They're trying to squeeze as much profit as they can from aging tech and components. In any event, maybe there will something interesting... i'll always have an interest in crappy little Roland boxes that are the bomb, but its hard to keep them seperate from crappy Roland boxes that are just crappy.Workstations are just ridiculous to me, right now, as any usb controller with a laptop would leave them in the dust. LOL, maybe im just disapointed cause it seems like they've gone downhill since the EX-5.Maybe Roland will release the V-Marimba Seems like Roland's about due for a new VA workhorse. Yeah, yeah, they're probably going to ride the V-synth for a while longer before releasing another VA, but I'd still like to see like to see them come out with a follow-up to the JP-8000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TDman Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 None of the large manufacturers have released a truly inspiring product in years, they just keep repackaging old technology and expect us to buy it. Looks like we've finally had enough of the SOS. That + bad economy = slow business... Just my $.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Analog Kid Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 dude, i dont want to scare you, but im pretty sure the V-Synth is their follow up. I dont think they are working on any other algo's, they might be working more on V-card enviornments to place them in, however. But, i notice the VariOS-8 is basically the VA of the Vsynth. It really is a refinement on the JP. theres an HQ square and saw, and the synth paramaters are actually decent this time with such things as seperate envelopes for filter resonance, ect, ect. Its got about twice the programability of the JP, although its missing some of the JP's best {censored}. I cant imagine a whole dedicated VA not based on Rcore technologly, unless its some SH-32 sized unit or something to compete with microns and microkorgs.It would be nice to see a tabletop about the size of the SP-808 with Rcore tech and the V-interface. I cant stand the size of the MV-8000 and MC-909. I think thier efforts, at least i would hope, are going into making a couple new enviornments that will tip the market more towards Rcore. How about a grafting of V-drum technology and a TR-interface? that would work for me if you could choose VA emulation or COSM technology for realistic acoustic sounds. Then give us that good old TR, but with the new interfaces (computer for VariOS, Touchscreen, dfield for V-synth)another could be a SoundCanvas app that turns the units into a rompler. getting crazy, how bout Roland finally using the platform to develop FM, Additive and physical modelling like Yamaha's VL-1m (which, stupidly enough, Yamaha calls VA technology. course they havent pushed that nomenclature in the last ten years... but since they havent done anything with the technology they havent needed to) If Roland could do something like that for at least one card, and if they can finally finish the software for the VariOS-8 and 303, then they could seriously have a go at dominating the larger players in the market for "boutique" synthesis.For its part, i think Yamaha is happy to stop developing esoteric synthesis technologies, or even using what they've already developed. Korg too, i imagine doesnt care to look beyond perhaps one day migrating the Legacy algo's to thier hardware VA's, if the cost of hardware processing goes down and maintaing the MOSS technology for thier synthesizers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members roblogic Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 Originally posted by Analog Kid dude, i dont want to scare you, but im pretty sure the V-Synth is their follow up. Yeah, yeah, I'm sure you're right. Oh well. But, i notice the VariOS-8 is basically the VA of the Vsynth. It really is a refinement on the JP. theres an HQ square and saw, and the synth paramaters are actually decent this time with such things as seperate envelopes for filter resonance, ect, ect. Its got about twice the programability of the JP, although its missing some of the JP's best {censored}. The VariOS looks pretty cool, I'd like to see a KB version with some sort of tactile interface, although this is probably a pipe dream as well. ...How about a grafting of V-drum technology and a TR-interface? that would work for me if you could choose VA emulation or COSM technology for realistic acoustic sounds. Then give us that good old TR, but with the new interfaces (computer for VariOS, Touchscreen, dfield for V-synth)... Now yer talkin'! I'd be very interested in something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MuzikB Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 I think for the most part that a lot of people are finally content. You have to admit that the Namm show that debued the Neuron, V-Synth, and Ion was pretty impressive and will be a tough act to follow. Now that those products are out and about, I think there is an air of contentment until people become bored with these and want to move on to the next best thing. Given what I have I am now content. I am curious to see how Access intend to ante up with the Virus D but I won't buy it as I have yet to scatch the surface on the Virus C and I'm pretty satisfied with it. Despite all the tech within the V-Synth, I still much prefer my Nord Lead 2X (Crazy I know) and it is now my favorite. Loaded the Fantom X with Ultimate Keys, Supreme Dance, and Studio SRX cards. Good to go and getting back on the saddle. To clusterchord: I haven't forgot about you but I've had to put in some more 12 hour days at work. The KLC examples are still works in progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members roblogic Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 Originally posted by DodgingRain Isn't that the v-synth? It's a really powerful synth with an interface that makes it seem simpler than it really is. You tell me - I haven't touched either one. My impression was that the V-synth was more geared toward sample mangling and the Varios was more of an emulator of classic Roland synths. Am I missing out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Analog Kid Posted June 23, 2004 Members Share Posted June 23, 2004 the V-synth and VariOS are basically the same guts, but im sure the Vsynth has some additional subsystems too. The OS's are different except for the D-50 application. VariOS-8 is like a Vsynth with the oscillators stuck in VA mode, no multimode filter, a different fx setup, much more basic arp, fixed architechture... but still the same waves and envelopesVProducer is more like the variphrase of the VP-9000- a loop enviorment with synth type applicationsVariOS303 is simply a TB emu and has no relation to anything on the Vsynth. Presumably the next Vcard will work on both also, but i have no idea if they could port the more ambitious Vsynth OS to the VariOS. probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sinew1958 Posted June 24, 2004 Members Share Posted June 24, 2004 Originally posted by Analog Kid the V-synth and VariOS are basically the same guts, but im sure the Vsynth has some additional subsystems too. The OS's are different except for the D-50 application. VariOS-8 is like a Vsynth with the oscillators stuck in VA mode, no multimode filter, a different fx setup, much more basic arp, fixed architechture... but still the same waves and envelopes VProducer is more like the variphrase of the VP-9000- a loop enviorment with synth type applications VariOS303 is simply a TB emu and has no relation to anything on the Vsynth. Presumably the next Vcard will work on both also, but i have no idea if they could port the more ambitious Vsynth OS to the VariOS. probably. I LIKE TO SEE IS THE NEXT V-CARD OF THE VERSION OF JUPITER 8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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