Fender prosonic vs. Fender pro tube pro reverb vs. fender supersonic

[buddastrat]

I owned a prosonic. One of the earlier ones. I hated it. It was fuzzy, compressed gain. I don't like that, but some guys do. Remember this is all subjective. It's a total opposite of the SS. The SS is meatier, and more vintage sounding. To me, with my fingers the SS is way more Eric Johnson sounding. That clean distortion where you hear no fuzz, only a clear note like a violin.

Play real fast pentatonic quintuplets and they respond quick and like little bullets shooting out of the speaker on the SS. On the prosonic it's more sluggish and the immediacy is not there. But if you f@#$ up those runs it will sound pretty bad on the SS. Some guys like more sag and compression though which is prosonic. So again it's preference. But the SS is much more EJ.

Gary Hoey used a prosonic for awhile. Listen to him, and that's what a prosonic can sound like. I prefer the SS as I can mold it to what I like.

[potaetoes]

Originally posted by macmax Yes but in a band situation or a recording enviroment the Prosonic is just plain great.

don't get me wrong, remember i'm the guy who told you how awesome prosonics are, and i still think that. it's still my favorite high-gain and dirty cleans ever.

there are just things the prosonic can't do, like the effects loop... not only is it not usable with most gear, but it isn't switchable. the SS would bury a prosonic in the mix, because it has so much more mid presence instead of the prosonic's naturally scooped voicing.

prosonics really lack clean headroom, so if you want a clean sound especially for strummed chords, it's really hard to get one from the prosonic at volumes loud enough for drums. recording it's not an issue, but jamming and playing unmic'd, it starts to show some weaknesses.

balancing tones between the channels is also VERY difficult with the prosonic. even with a bright cap on the clean channel and some caps clipped from the gain channel, the gain channel is always brighter and thinner than the cleans when you switch back and forth. there's no solution to this, and even bruce zinky agrees it's a big issue with the amp. his velvet series amps were kind of his way of making a prosonic without flaws - you should check those out, they're smokin' little amps.

anyway, they're both good amps, they're just different. i like both, i'm going to use both, and i thin the prosonic is impossible to beat, but you can't judge one by the other, or obviously one seems inferior. judged on their own merits they both pull their own weight in different ways.

[Deuterium]

Originally posted by macmax Because the Prosonic sounds better, it is not a hard on Deuterium, the problem with the Prosonic is that many paople try it for a few secs withoput completely understanding how to tweak it and they refuse to really go deep into it! The controls are dual pots doing two things at the same time. You can even have the master at 10 and if the treble and bass ...etc are in 0 you will have no sound. You can have a great sound with the treble close to 2-bass very low and mids very low, it all depens on how you set the master. You can also have close to normal tweaking with it, it is really a complex amp. The dual cascading can get you from hendrix to E Johnson. Stings Dominic Miller used to play one and got great sounds out of it. As i said, many people put it down till they hear someone tearing things apart with it, then they don't believe it!

 

 

Macmax:

 

I never said the Prosonic wasn't a good amp. I am sure it is, in fact, I bet it is a great amp (never played one)...all I was implying is that the Fender forum has a definite slant towards all things "vintage", IMHO. The "Supersonic" is seen as the direct descendant and successor to the Prosonic, and that has incited some, well, "interesting" reviews (always in comparison to the Prosonic). Yes, the Supersonic has also gotten excellent reviews on the Fender site, as well.

[Deuterium]

Originally posted by potaetoes don't get me wrong, remember i'm the guy who told you how awesome prosonics are, and i still think that. it's still my favorite high-gain and dirty cleans ever. there are just things the prosonic can't do, like the effects loop... not only is it not usable with most gear, but it isn't switchable. the SS would bury a prosonic in the mix, because it has so much more mid presence instead of the prosonic's naturally scooped voicing. prosonics really lack clean headroom, so if you want a clean sound especially for strummed chords, it's really hard to get one from the prosonic at volumes loud enough for drums. recording it's not an issue, but jamming and playing unmic'd, it starts to show some weaknesses. balancing tones between the channels is also VERY difficult with the prosonic. even with a bright cap on the clean channel and some caps clipped from the gain channel, the gain channel is always brighter and thinner than the cleans when you switch back and forth. there's no solution to this, and even bruce zinky agrees it's a big issue with the amp. his velvet series amps were kind of his way of making a prosonic without flaws - you should check those out, they're smokin' little amps. anyway, they're both good amps, they're just different. i like both, i'm going to use both, and i thin the prosonic is impossible to beat, but you can't judge one by the other, or obviously one seems inferior. judged on their own merits they both pull their own weight in different ways.

Potaetoes...excellent comments.

I can't speak for the Prosonic, as I admit I've never played one (heck, never even seen one). However, I can speak for the Supersonic...as I own one. I fell in love with the Supersonic exactly for the reason you mentioned, it's excellent mid-range.

I play mostly lead (neo-classical / shred) style, so I've never liked the "scooped" sound...even for blues soloing. If anything, I have always tended to boost my mids. The Supersonic has such a sweet, warm, articulate and clear mid-range that accentuates lead/solo guitar playing. It also makes it very unforgiving for sloppy playing, which may turn some people off.

[SeeMoore]

I had a prosonic, it was ok, I didn't care for the taper of the pots, too much volume too quickly, much like the "Hot Rod" series of amps that use linear pots instead of audio taper pots. And I read that a OT switch-out would get rid of that top end fizz, I think it was from a Zinky web site or something.

I'm gone tell ya what, you get yourself a DRRI and a great OD stompbox and you'll have have the sound you're lookin' for, GREAT cleans and depending on the stomper, whatever dirt sound ya like.

[whoop]

Originally posted by macmax to tell you the truth the F-100 wich is the one i tried has a blackface tone thaht a blackface amp could envy!

 

 

there isn't a mesa on this planet that a blackface amp will envy, nor will there ever be. i've played the f100 and it's a mediocre amp

[woodsmandan]

Originally posted by potaetoes don't get me wrong, remember i'm the guy who told you how awesome prosonics are, and i still think that. it's still my favorite high-gain and dirty cleans ever. there are just things the prosonic can't do, like the effects loop... not only is it not usable with most gear, but it isn't switchable. the SS would bury a prosonic in the mix, because it has so much more mid presence instead of the prosonic's naturally scooped voicing. prosonics really lack clean headroom, so if you want a clean sound especially for strummed chords, it's really hard to get one from the prosonic at volumes loud enough for drums. recording it's not an issue, but jamming and playing unmic'd, it starts to show some weaknesses. balancing tones between the channels is also VERY difficult with the prosonic. even with a bright cap on the clean channel and some caps clipped from the gain channel, the gain channel is always brighter and thinner than the cleans when you switch back and forth. there's no solution to this, and even bruce zinky agrees it's a big issue with the amp. his velvet series amps were kind of his way of making a prosonic without flaws - you should check those out, they're smokin' little amps. anyway, they're both good amps, they're just different. i like both, i'm going to use both, and i thin the prosonic is impossible to beat, but you can't judge one by the other, or obviously one seems inferior. judged on their own merits they both pull their own weight in different ways.

Thanks, this is really helpfull. As I am looking for a "do everything" amp, the SS still seems the smart choice. I'll try to go give one a spin this week-end if I can...

And thanks everyone for the replies, the comments and the debates...I find this kind of dicussion 100 times more helpful than just reading reviews, as the debate evolves with different people's experiences and tastes!!!

[woodsmandan]

Originally posted by SeeMoore I'm gone tell ya what, you get yourself a DRRI and a great OD stompbox and you'll have have the sound you're lookin' for, GREAT cleans and depending on the stomper, whatever dirt sound ya like.

 

 

Well, truth be told, that was my first amp of choice...would be excellent for the most part...but 2 things put me back:

 

- Lack of headroom and overall volume in a band situation (22 watts in a 2 guitars/loud drummer band?);

 

- Ability to do metal (even with pedals...)

 

Do you think it can handle that?

[potaetoes]

Originally posted by macmax That is true, but for them the Prosonic is a 2037 digital modeling amp!, hehheheh:D I will give a try at another SS in another store, the one i tried couldn't be working properly , i have heard many saying it is good an di heard Potatoes, which has had some of the same amps i had, so if he says it is good, maybe the one i tried wasn't ,as i said, working properly

 

 

try the "percussion" setting, except with both gains all the way up, and you'll hear a little bit of prosonic heritage in there. but, you'll hear how much more mid emphasis there is in the SS. those same settings on a prosonic would be complete bassy mush.

 

another difference is, the prosonic doesn't like super hot pickups because it has so much gain. the supersonic actually responds pretty well to hot humbuckers without fizzing out.

 

it's not an amp everyone will love (neither is the prosonic), but it's definitely got some great tones in it.

[potaetoes]

i just saw the original poster mention wanting to play metal... and all i can say is none of these amps are the right choice for that.

[woodsmandan]

Originally posted by potaetoes i just saw the original poster mention wanting to play metal... and all i can say is none of these amps are the right choice for that.

As a well deserved explanation, I'll quote myself, from earlier in this thread:

Ok...all this got me pretty much set on the Supersonic...

Except for one detail: it has been said that it lacked bass in the burn channel, and that it is not well suited for heavey rythm chuga chuga stuff.

Well, i'm not a really big fan of chuga chuga stuff, but it is part of what I play in one of my bands ( hard rock/heavey metal cover band...some old stuff, some new stuff).

I need a do it all amp. I do not want to buy an amp exlusively on chuga chuga power, as it represents maybe 15% of what I play. But I do need a little of that in the mix.

For the lion's share of my playing, the SS seems to be the perfect amp....heck, a RI Bassman would be fine for 75% of my guitar playing.

So, what's the lowdown on the SS ability to bring me on my seldom metal excursions???

[SeeMoore]

Originally posted by woodsmandan Well, truth be told, that was my first amp of choice...would be excellent for the most part...but 2 things put me back: - Lack of headroom and overall volume in a band situation (22 watts in a 2 guitars/loud drummer band?); - Ability to do metal (even with pedals...) Do you think it can handle that?

 

 

Metal, I don't know about, there's no MID control so ya may be limited on tryin' to get a scooped sound goin'.

 

The amps you had listed would be a coin toss as to whether they could handle metal or not.

 

The Prosonic may get you there, but the Supersonic sounds like it may be closer to what you want.

 

One more thing to consider, if you do get a Prosonic, there will be no warranty, however the Supersonic will give ya 5 years.

[potaetoes]

Originally posted by macmax If you want a "do everything amp"do yourself a favor and try the MArk Iv first

it's also a "tweak everything" amp. i just traded mine away.

[potaetoes]

Originally posted by woodsmandan As a well deserved explanation, I'll quote myself, from earlier in this thread: Ok...all this got me pretty much set on the Supersonic... Except for one detail: it has been said that it lacked bass in the burn channel, and that it is not well suited for heavey rythm chuga chuga stuff. Well, i'm not a really big fan of chuga chuga stuff, but it is part of what I play in one of my bands ( hard rock/heavey metal cover band...some old stuff, some new stuff). I need a do it all amp. I do not want to buy an amp exlusively on chuga chuga power, as it represents maybe 15% of what I play. But I do need a little of that in the mix. For the lion's share of my playing, the SS seems to be the perfect amp....heck, a RI Bassman would be fine for 75% of my guitar playing. So, what's the lowdown on the SS ability to bring me on my seldom metal excursions???

 

 

i think it's perfectly capable of stuff like alice in chains, etc., and perhaps with an EQ pedal in the loop (which is footswitchable, so it's definitely a viable option) it could go heavier than that. i can't really give an opinion on how it might be for modern metal (drop tuned technical muted whatever stuff) because i just don't play that.

[Jack Straw]

Originally posted by SeeMoore I had a prosonic, it was ok, I didn't care for the taper of the pots, too much volume too quickly, much like the "Hot Rod" series of amps that use linear pots instead of audio taper pots. And I read that a OT switch-out would get rid of that top end fizz, I think it was from a Zinky web site or something. I'm gone tell ya what, you get yourself a DRRI and a great OD stompbox and you'll have have the sound you're lookin' for, GREAT cleans and depending on the stomper, whatever dirt sound ya like.

What's a great od for the Deluxe that has a harmonic singing tone? I'm not trying to hijack the thread, I have a Deluxe and I'm gassin for the Supersonic!

[Deuterium]

Originally posted by Jack Straw What's a great od for the Deluxe that has a harmonic singing tone? I'm not trying to hijack the thread, I have a Deluxe and I'm gassin for the Supersonic!

Diditech Bad Monkey
DOD YJM 308


Both are inexpensive OD pedals that, IMHO, have fantastic, transparent drive which kicks serious ass on the frontend of a quality tube amp. They work great with the Bassman channel on my Supersonic

[SeeMoore]

Originally posted by Jack Straw What's a great od for the Deluxe that has a harmonic singing tone? I'm not trying to hijack the thread, I have a Deluxe and I'm gassin for the Supersonic!

 

 

The best one I've heard so far is a VS Route66, it sounded amazing with an original 65 Deluxe.

 

I'm using a Seymour Duncan Twin Tube with mine and it gets some great low volume just breaking up sounds and the lead sounds are rich and full also, plenty of sustain and articulation.

 

I'll be trying some different boxes with it soon, TS9, 808, Boss OD-20 (for the fun of it).

 

A friend of mine is bringing me an old Boss Turbo Overdrive that I'll be trying also, I had one of those years ago and it sounded great with an old Fender Princeton I had, hope I get the same results from the new set-up.

 

P.S. The only negative I've found with the SD Twin Tube is you HAVE to use the wal-wart.

[Jack Straw]

Originally posted by SeeMoore The best one I've heard so far is a VS Route66, it sounded amazing with an original 65 Deluxe. I'm using a Seymour Duncan Twin Tube with mine and it gets some great low volume just breaking up sounds and the lead sounds are rich and full also, plenty of sustain and articulation. I'll be trying some different boxes with it soon, TS9, 808, Boss OD-20 (for the fun of it). A friend of mine is bringing me an old Boss Turbo Overdrive that I'll be trying also, I had one of those years ago and it sounded great with an old Fender Princeton I had, hope I get the same results from the new set-up. P.S. The only negative I've found with the SD Twin Tube is you HAVE to use the wal-wart.

Sounds good SeeMoore, I played a gig where the opening band's gutarist had a reissue Twin and thst red Jeckyl and Hyde od and I was in the dressing room and came out to hear what kind of rig this glorious singing tone was coming from, sounded amazing.

[Jack Straw]

Originally posted by Deuterium Diditech Bad Monkey DOD YJM 308 Both are inexpensive OD pedals that, IMHO, have fantastic, transparent drive which kicks serious ass on the frontend of a quality tube amp. They work great with the Bassman channel on my Supersonic

Thanks man, are those pedals more for pushing an amp that is already breaking up? By the way, you're giving me major gas for the Supersonic by the way you describe the gain channel. I play in a proggy jam band that does a lot of melodic shred, sweep picking and alternate picked lines, A don't need a "Metal" sound, just a juicy harmonically rich sound that is articulate enough to track well. Nice and thick on the high register stuff. A good clean for jazz or funk too. Does that sound like the Supersonic will fit criteria? I hate plinky gain tones on the high strings. Thanks!

[Guest Anonymous]

Originally posted by woodsmandan I did a bit of research, and those are 3 finalists... I'm looking for a do it all combo, fender clean to high gain...50-60 watts is enough.... Pros: Prosonic: Dual cascading gain, overall great reviews everywhere Pro reverb: 1/4 power switch, 50 watts is enough Supersonic: Like the prosonic but with separate EQ for each channel Cons: Prosonic: Hard to find, shared EQ Pro reverb: No dual cascading gain Supersonic : Well, not all reviews are great... So, what do you guys think ? Anything else I should consider ?... My ideal amp would be a mix of the 3 above : Dual cascading gain (prosonic), 1/4 power switch (pro reverb) and separate EQ (supersonic) Thanks

 

 

 

How does the Fender Tonemaster Head stack up to these models?

[Deuterium]

Originally posted by Jack Straw Thanks man, are those pedals more for pushing an amp that is already breaking up? By the way, you're giving me major gas for the Supersonic by the way you describe the gain channel. I play in a proggy jam band that does a lot of melodic shred, sweep picking and alternate picked lines, A don't need a "Metal" sound, just a juicy harmonically rich sound that is articulate enough to track well. Nice and thick on the high register stuff. A good clean for jazz or funk too. Does that sound like the Supersonic will fit criteria? I hate plinky gain tones on the high strings. Thanks!

Yes, the OD pedals are for pushin' and amp that is already breaking up, or on the verge of breaking up. However, it still works well with the Supersonic's full on Burn channel, by giving you a Lead boost. In truth, you don't necessarily need a pedal in front of the Supersonic's Burn channel, as this channel has all the gain you would need...but I am so used to the sound/tone of the OD pedal with my amps, I just leave it on. I do the same with my other, high gain amps.

And yes, I think you would LOVE the Supersonic for your style of music...especially because your lead playing will cut right thru the mix. It has a classic, 80's type of mid-range, harmonically rich (and articulate) gain tone that is just perfect for solo/lead guitar playing style. Plus, the Bassman channel KILLS for sweet blues tone as well as cleaner rhythm passages. :thu:

[buddastrat]

Nice description of it bud.

[buddastrat]

Btw, in case anyone didn't know it, there are some clips on the Fender site. They sound good to me (except for the high gain one). BUT.....

BUT, this amp sounds way better in person. I think they could've gotten a better player to showcase that amp, because that person played pretty weak. I mean c'mon it's Fender. They coulda' even had Yngwie or Beck do clips. That'd sell a ton more of them. Where's their damn marketing people?!

[potaetoes]

Originally posted by buddastrat Btw, in case anyone didn't know it, there are some clips on the Fender site. They sound good to me (except for the high gain one). BUT..... BUT, this amp sounds way better in person. I think they could've gotten a better player to showcase that amp, because that person played pretty weak. I mean c'mon it's Fender. They coulda' even had Yngwie or Beck do clips. That'd sell a ton more of them. Where's their damn marketing people?!

 

 

that high gain setting they have on their site, which i agree sounds like total ass in the clip, actually sounds really good if you do one thing different: crank gain 2 up near full. that's pretty much where i have my burn channel set right now, and i am liking it quite a bit. set the way they show, it sounds pretty bad. small changes can make a big difference on these.