I suck at all things lyrical. My cry for help.

[Frothy]

Since I've started writing songs about half a year ago, I've written 2.5 songs. I have plenty of ideas musically...I could make a million instrumentals, but that won't get me anywhere.

 

Song One: Wrote the whole song instrumentally and added meaningless, rhyming...bad lyrics later.

 

Song Two: Somehow I got inspiration and wrote six verses and a chorus about some girl. They are personal to me, which is a plus, but they still suck. I'm trying to make it better and fill the bridge in. I haven't gotten the inspiration back.

 

Song Three: I wrote about half a song's worth, seemingly about temporary emotions that had no purpose (hard to explain) and it basically has no meaning. I scrapped most of it, and of what I now have I don't know how to continue.

 

Song Four: A rewriting of song one about TV. I have about a verse that took me about an hour. I think they are actually decent, but again, little meaning and I don't know how to continue it.

 

I don't even know why I bothered to write that out except maybe to show how pathetic I am. Every once in a LONG while I'll think of something to write about. My biggest problem is thinking of what to write about that is personal to me, original, and interesting. If I do by some chance think of it, though, I never get it down before it fades. And then, the next week or so what I've written looks like crap anyway.

 

Is it just because my life is too good that I can't think of anything? Or maybe it's because I don't have enough life experience. I have a hard time believing either. Maybe I'm in denial.

 

I keep writing about how much I suck, but I don't even have much of a question. I just want some help. Here's a question. Can you help me?

[mcflytrap]

Don't worry about rhyming...it just makes your song sound forced. Start off writing how you feel....write poetry, forget rhymes. Then go back and move words around to try to form ideas and make the lyrics flow...at least this way you'll have a basis.

 

-fries-

[Baard]

So write about whats on your mind, dont worry if it

[Kingnome]

 

Originally posted by Frothy Is it just because my life is too good that I can't think of anything? Or maybe it's because I don't have enough life experience. I have a hard time believing either. Maybe I'm in denial.

 

 

HARD TIME BELIEVING by Frothy

 

Got nothin' to say, but I've thought about enough

Too young to say that I've had enough

 

Hard time believing

Hard time believing

I got a hard time believing.......

In me

 

You say denial like it's a bad thing

Got nothin' to say, but lots to sing

 

I got a hard time believing

Hard time believing

Hard time believing

In meeeeeee...

 

(wanking solo w/ trashy drums)

 

etc.

(It's a start...)

[cool_E]

 

Originally posted by Frothy Since I've started writing songs about half a year ago, I've written 2.5 songs. I have plenty of ideas musically...I could make a million instrumentals, but that won't get me anywhere. I keep writing about how much I suck, but I don't even have much of a question. I just want some help. Here's a question. Can you help me?

 

 

Read & analyze lyrics & poems you like.

 

Write! Write! Write! Force yourself to write.

 

Check out the "lessons" we're running. The book we're

drawing from is really targeted at giving you the tools

to find your own unique voice and to express yourself

well and in a way that other people can relate to.

[pigman]

I read the title of your thread: "I suck at all things lyrical. My cry for help." And I said: THAT'S A SONG! Write about what you know! Write about sucking at writing songs! Stranger things have happened....

 

I don't mean to sound too cynical,

But I suck at all things lyrical,

This may seem ironic to you,

But I bet you suck at something, too.

 

At least I'm up here tryin',

Instead of sittin' home and cryin',

I wrote this song to relieve the boredom,

Of the HC Songwriting Forum!

 

P.

[thelonius74]

Well, one thing that I would suggest is to get away from the mindset that your subject material of a song is even relevant.

 

Just because someone writes a song about social injustices and world hunger does not make it good. However a good songwriter can write about a toaster and make quite a cool song.

 

Nowhere Man by the Beatles was a song John Lennon wrote about himself because he couldn't think of any lyrical ideas. Couldn't write a song, so he wrote a song about not being able to write a song.

 

 

'Grandpa was a Carpenter' by John Prine. Just a song about his grandfather. Was it all true? Probably not...but brilliant. Everyone has a grandfather...he wrote a song about it

 

"grandpa was a carpenter,

he built houses stores and banks

chainsmoked camel cigarrettes

hammered nails and planks

he was level on the level

shaved even every door

and voted for Eisenhower

because Lincoln won the war"

[Frothy]

Thanks for the replies. I'll have to follow this advice. It's just that I want so bad to write something that:

 

A: Doesn't rhyme (I find rhyming actually makes it easier, but it seems so cheesy)

B: Is personal to me and has a deep meaning (quite a challenge because few personal subjects yeild good lyric ideas)

C: Can be interpreted universally (like people can bend it so that it has meaning to them too)

D: Has good lyrics (you know)

 

I'm having a hard time getting just two of these. Do you guys really think just forcing myself to write about stuff that doesn't mean anything and following exercises will help me get down three or four of these in the future? I guess it's probably better than sitting there with my guitar for a half hour and coming up with nothing.

 

Here's the plan, you will encourage me even though I have no chance of writing something that will make me happy. And again, thanks for the help thus far.

[Kingnome]

 

Originally posted by Frothy B: Is personal to me and has a deep meaning (quite a challenge because few personal subjects yeild good lyric ideas) C: Can be interpreted universally (like people can bend it so that it has meaning to them too)

 

 

I disagree. We're all human. Well, most of us. Personal subjects yeild the best lyrics. Don't think that you're the only one who's gone through a particular experience. Not only is that narrow-minded, it under-estimates your audience.

Write what is in your heart. Somebody once said that you can bet that somebody, somewhere is feeling exactly the way you feel at some point and will relate to the mood, idea, etc.

 

Keep trying !!

[Frothy]

 

Originally posted by Kingnome I disagree. We're all human. Well, most of us. Personal subjects yeild the best lyrics. Don't think that you're the only one who's gone through a particular experience. Not only is that narrow-minded, it under-estimates your audience. Write what is in your heart. Somebody once said that you can bet that somebody, somewhere is feeling exactly the way you feel at some point and will relate to the mood, idea, etc. Keep trying !!

 

 

I actually meant that personal subjects are hard for me to write about because I find it hard to get interesting lyrics out of them. I agree with you completely.

[Sonic Boy]

I really liked this girl a lot so I wrote this love song. I was obcessed with it, I had to finish the song, record it, mix it down and guive it to her.

It was the hardest thing to do, it's very hard to write about subjects that have something to do with your most intimate life. Love or intimate songs are not what I like to write.

You are exposing yourself and your state of mind. When you are in a diferent state of mind (a few days latter) you look at the lyrics and you hate them!

If you want to write lyrics in a regular basis, like for a bunch of songs, dont stick to personal subjects. Follow the good advises guiven here, like writing about ordinary things but in special context. Try to empty your mind and start out with a good line. Try to write it all at once and then maybe modify bits here and there for rithm purposes.

 

So when I wrote the song to this girl I tried to think positive and mix ordinary life things like driving around at night in my car, describing the city and how great it looks, all the time thinking of her. I can say after I record it I wouldnt change it a bit.

Here's just a bit of what came out of it....

 

 

These diamond city streets

where made to lead the way

to one million heart beats

just making it through the day

 

Love is just a silhouette

i smoked the days last cigarette

and dive into nights velvet hands

and I hope she understands

 

how she makes me feel alive

and drive into these streets at night

search in and searching out

every since I live in doubt.

 

 

Simple uh? Empty your mind, let your heart do the writing

[Kingnome]

 

Originally posted by Frothy I actually meant that personal subjects are hard for me to write about because I find it hard to get interesting lyrics out of them. I agree with you completely.

 

 

Oh,....ah........................nevermind.

 

 

 

I realize YOU have to like your lyrics, but I, myself don't try too hard to analyze whether or not my lyrics are interesting. I try to make the theme interesting, and I probably use mediocre lyrics.

[NervePoet]

Collect "power" words and phrases to use. They stand out in your songs. Notice in Sonic Boy's lyrics above (nice ones, Sonic!), he uses things like "diamond city streets", "silhouette", and "velvet hands". These types of things paint a picture in one's mind and invite the imagination.

[Frothy]

Power words....

 

What a great idea! Here's the plan. I'm going to save up these "power words", and then when on rare occasion I have something highly emotional to write about, I'll whip out some power words and write a song.

[Sonic Boy]

 

Originally posted by NervePoet Collect "power" words and phrases to use. They stand out in your songs. Notice in Sonic Boy's lyrics above (nice ones, Sonic!), he uses things like "diamond city streets", "silhouette", and "velvet hands". These types of things paint a picture in one's mind and invite the imagination.

 

 

you liked them? I recorded that part of the song with two voices, one sings the first line of a verse, then the otter hits the second line a bit before the first one ends, so the lyrics are thrown really fast like a flowing stream of words very energetic.

[Rocinante]

Originally posted by Sonic Boy you liked them? I recorded that part of the song with two voices, one sings the first line of a verse, then the otter hits the second line a bit before the first one ends, so the lyrics are thrown really fast like a flowing stream of words very energetic.

 

So that's how it's done! I gotta get me an otter to sing backing vocals - then I can play in the stream of words!

[Rocinante]

Frothy - How much reading do you do? I suggest picking up an interesting novel now and again - science fiction is good for stimulating creative thought. Also, go to the newsagent and buy a magazine or a newspaper you don't normally read, and pick out ideas from stories and articles. Get away from TV and the mundane and take yourself away to the country for a week or two. Do all of these and I guarantee you will soon discover something that you feel passionate enough to write about.

 

I also recommend visiting the link that appears in my signature below, for some thought-provoking discussion.

[Frothy]

Wow Rocinante, that message board is awesome. At first it looked like a bunch of save the rainforest crap, but there's a lot of really deep philisophical stuff. Very interesting. Thanks!

[Rocinante]

 

Originally posted by Frothy Wow Rocinante, that message board is awesome. At first it looked like a bunch of save the rainforest crap, but there's a lot of really deep philisophical stuff. Very interesting. Thanks!

 

Glad you took the time to read a few posts, and found it interesting. BTW, I hardly think campaigning to save the rainforest is 'crap'. You should start by reading Thom Hartmann's book 'The Last Hours Of Ancient Sunlight'. You won't look at society, history or religion the same way again. Peace.

[rickenvox]

just my opinion, but . . .

 

1) good lyrics need not come from "your" life experiences, lyrics are all about the sound and flow, what words you choose and the right number of syllables. Listen to Oasis, the subject matter is sophomoric at best, but the rhyming and flow are perfect for that musical genre. Just the right amount of rock and roll cliches also (cliches in a original context sell). Dear Prudence was written by Paul McCartney about his dog - it's the sound of the words that sells and convinces people the song's about something deeper.

 

2) 9 out of 10 times your girlfriend's name will have the wrong number of syllables or rhyming sound for your love song. Pick a name that works and risk getting in trouble with the girlfriend - the song is more important (if you're a songwriter), and she'll love you more if you ever find success. Otherwise, write the song first and then find a girlfriend with the same name as in your song - problem solved.

 

3) Lyrics are not poetry. Modern poetry doesn't rhyme for one thing and hasn't for more than a century or two. Lyrics are meant to support the song and rhyming works well for most lyrics, although it's not required. You might do things in lyrics that would seem trite in poetry - but with the music it works. Lyrics should be written with the exact rhythm of the melody in mind, and not reworked into a song structure where it doesn't fit (comedy songs often satirize amateur song verses where too many words are rushed in order to fit in a short time space).

 

4) Use nonsense words that fit, if you can't find anything else, and replace them later with words that actually make sense. Hey Jude is a great example where McCartney used "the movement you need is on your shoulder" as a nonsensical temporary place holder, but Lennon talked him into keeping it because it sounded great and possibly provoked more thought.

 

Cheers,

Kent

[Rocinante]

 

Originally posted by rickenvox Dear Prudence was written by Paul McCartney about his dog

 

I thought Lennon wrote it.

[BlueStrat]

In order to write good lyrics, you have to be well read. You have to put words and their usage into your memory bank to be withdrawn and used later. As was mentioned here before, it's not what you have to say as much as how you say it. Turning a phrase, so to speak. I read a lot of Tom Robbins, Kurt Vonnegut, and William Kotzwinkle as a kid, so I have that influence a bit.

 

I wrote a song about chicks that keep you hanging on until they find someone better, a cynical thing called "let's be friends", and it goes like this:

 

I got a beat up Ford and I'm headed south

A bitter taste still in my mouth

Still chokin' on those words you said

Like an open hand slap on the back of my head

You said the last thing I wanted to hear

Three little words that a man most fears

Let's be friends

She said let's be friends

 

I tried and tried just to make you mine

I sent you flowers and valentines

I quit my job and I moved away

So I could be with you every day

Thought things were going well

Until I fell into platonic hell

Let's be friends...

 

BRIDGE Now I been as patient as I know how to be

Why do you seem to want every man but me

I been around this block one time or two

Enough to know that "let's be friends" means we're through

 

It's a hopeless situation

Between loneliness and desperation

How can something that seems so right to me

Be so hard for you to see

You said the last thing I wanted to hear

Three little words that I most fear...

 

Let's be friends...

 

 

Put yourself or your subject in scenarios, and then paint word pictures about how you feel about it. People connect with songs they can emotionally identify with.

[rickenvox]

 

Originally posted by Rocinante I thought Lennon wrote it.

 

 

Oops! Martha My Dear was McCartney's dog.

 

Dear Prudence is just one of my favorites.

[jester69]

Well,

 

I am a beginning songwriter too, but a long time attempter of artistic expression...

 

I agree with the others that your original post is pretty much a song, the lyrics alone are half of what make the words a song, the other half is how their sung, i/e do you draw out this word, whisper that one, change pitch in the middle of that one etc.

 

Really, any lyrics can be interesting if sung right, so what i would posit is this:

 

I used to have a bad case of "isuckitis" no matter what I did, somehow I would look at it later & go man this stinks.

 

I used to paint paintings, every one of my paintings got great reviews from most who saw them, but when i'd finished one i had to hide it away because I hated it. I didnt think it stunk because it was neccecarily bad, but because I had done it & i didnt think i was a good painter.When people told me they liked it i though they were humoring me. even winning an award didnt change my opinion, I'm hard headed

 

Just look at it this way, there are no "good" songs or "bad" songs, just different songs that speak to different people. It is impossible to make a bad song, as taste is a grey area.

 

Rather than thinking you cant write songs, try thinking that the songs you write are just what you do and do the best at them without worrying how they are percieved.

 

If i were a teacher (which i'm not) i'd say make your first post to this thread into a song wether you like it or not, pour your effort into it with no concern as to whether the effort is worth it or not, just give it your best and be satisfied that is enough.

 

I/e when people ask me if i am a good guitarist or not, i used to say i suck, now i say i dunno, give me a guitar and i'll show you what i do, and I leave it to them to decide what they think. I have fun, thats what counts, I just make sure not to play to a captive audience so if i really do suck they wont hurt me

 

take care,

 

Steve

 

P.S. I just bought a book called Zen guitar that helped me over saying i sucked when in all probability i dont. Good rah rah stuff, no technique. The theories would probably work for any artistic endeavor.

[blindfolded]