Melody/Rhythm

[Fine_Young_Fool]

I have been trying to write some songs lately, and I am not happy with the lyrical results.

 

I find that all of my lines end up the same length, and that i cannot possibly think of a way to sing it. It seems I keep using the melodies of my favorite songs, and then cannot get it out of my head.

 

I also noticed that the best songs have unique catchy rhythms to the lyrics and instruments (Guitar) and I really cannot think of anything unique, and again, keep falling back on the other songs that I know.

 

So the point is...

 

HELP!!!

[Eclepto Funk]

i would try to force yourself to write songs which have line lengths different from your other songs... that will force you to change your rhythms

 

see what happens when you write songs with short lines ... maybe write a part of the song with short lines and one with long lines ... play around

 

also, come up with rhythms first, and then write lyrics to fit the rhythm

 

i think you'll find that line length is going to be key here

[Fine_Young_Fool]

The problem is, I am not a drummer, just a guitar player/singer, and I listen to music almost constantly, so it is very hard for me to get the rythms of other songs out of my head, and try and find my own.

 

And besides, how do you create a rythm?

[Floophead3]

Rhythm is composed of beats: the idea is that by stressing certain beats, a motion can be attained that sets up the groove for a song. There are 2 kinds of rhythms IMO: simple and syncopated. Simple rhythms follow a regular pattern of accents on beats. For example: 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & etc. or 1 & a 2 & a etc. Those rhythms are good driving rhythms and they usually have a large emphasis on beat 1. Syncopated rhythms follow a pattern off the beats, and are usually uneven intervals between notes. For example: 1 & a 2 & a 3 & etc. This is the same length as 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & (a 4/4 rhythm) but you end up with 3 accents, placed differently. This is a very common syncopated rhythm, but there are many many many more possibilities, especially if you further subdivide the beats into 16ths or even 32nds.

 

That being said, I haven't really told you how to make interesting rhythms yet. Also I haven't talked about how it relates to melodies. In my opinion, and some other more professional opinions I've heard from other musicians and teachers, the thing that makes for interesting rhythm is variance over a central idea. Keeping the stressed beats in mind and your general groove, create patterns that work within those grooves. For instance, assuming a rhythm of 1 & - & - & 4 & etc. (this is a syncopated rhythm; "-" represents a rest) you can have a melody go 1 (&) - & 3 & 4 - etc. The important thing is the melody properly follows the contour of the groove you have going. Obviously things can get infinitely more complex than this, but it's the best I can do at 3 AM

 

Now the big trick is varying rhythms, especially in melodies, to make them more interesting. Techniques I find useful for this are: Subdivide notes, Combine notes into longer notes, Change a simple rhythm to a syncopated rhythm, Use tuplets (triplets, septuplets, etc), Change the accents of the same melody. All these tricks are really useful for tweaking a melody around so even if you sing one pitch, it'll be interesting. Wait a minute, what kind of music uses 1 pitch and varying rhythm? ooh, perhaps RAP! Wait, nevermind, I did say what kind of music. But really, Rap is 50% rhythm. (ask me what the other 50% sometime for a good laugh! )

 

I hope that helps. I don't pretend to be the residing rhythm expert, but I hope I know enough to embark a little knowledge to those in need of it.

[eddieboston2]

One thing that I've found helps me a lot is to listen to different styles of music. Different from what you're used to. Even if you don't like the style or the particular songs, you can learn from them. Latin music, in particular, has some rhythms that you don't normally hear in American music. Jazz can also be useful, or even pop music in a foreign language. I posted a while back about some songs I've written with some Italian lyrics, and how I noticed the words lent themselves to slightly different rhythms. I've incorporated some of those rhythms into my English language songs, and that gives them a whole new life and differentiates them a bit, I think.

[samuraiBSD]

 

One thing that I've found helps me a lot is to listen to different styles of music. Different from what you're used to. Even if you don't like the style or the particular songs, you can learn from them. Latin music, in particular, has some rhythms that you don't normally hear in American music. Jazz can also be useful, or even pop music in a foreign language. I posted a while back about some songs I've written with some Italian lyrics, and how I noticed the words lent themselves to slightly different rhythms. I've incorporated some of those rhythms into my English language songs, and that gives them a whole new life and differentiates them a bit, I think.

 

 

problem with that is, he the OP may not want to play jazz or latin music, so if he uses those rhythms, it comes out sounding like those, which would be bad if that's not what he's going for.

 

To answer the question, you should just play around with completely random chords. If it's any consolation, I have the same problem as you do. I read an article once that said take an existing song, put new lyrics over it, then change the chord progression. I did that once and now it's all I'm able to do. My advice is: DON'T DO THAT!

[Kuhnfyoozed]

Listen to some big band jazz music, the phrasing and syncopation can teach you a lot. Especially listen to it if you don't normally, because the new exposure will prevent you from recreating one you've heard a million times before.

 

Edit: To the above poster, you don't have to sound like something just because you use some of the rhythms from it. If he doesn't want to sound like hes playing jazz, then he won't. If you don't listen to anything new, then you won't learn much more from the same old stuff. Listening to some funk or some jazz won't do any harm, theres just so much potential learnin' to be had.

[Fine_Young_Fool]

 

I read an article once that said take an existing song, put new lyrics over it, then change the chord progression. I did that once and now it's all I'm able to do. My advice is: DON'T DO THAT!

 

 

I think I read that same article, and I am glad you warned me before I actualy tried it! Thanx.

 

I am not so concerned about the overall beat for the song. What I mean, is guitar riffs are memorable for their phrasing and timing. Thas what makes songs catchy. I want to know how to do that.

[Eclepto Funk]

use the guitar as your voice

 

or rather, hum or sound out possible riffs with your mouth to see how they sound. when you find something you like, copy it with the guitar

 

anyway ... works for me up to a point, but my guitar playing ain't that great

[samuraiBSD]

 

use the guitar as your voice or rather, hum or sound out possible riffs with your mouth to see how they sound. when you find something you like, copy it with the guitar anyway ... works for me up to a point, but my guitar playing ain't that great

 

 

I think a lot of songwriters have that problem. I came up with something in my head today that may have in fact sounded stunning on a guitar, but I couldn't figure out for the life of me how to make the guitar do that sound, so the riff never left my head. Unfortunately, I've forgotten it now, but those things seem to be a dime a dozen...

[RadiationNation]

Yeah, I have that problem with a lot of the synth stuff I do. I have this {censored}ing amazing sound in my head, but when it comes time to program it I can't quite get it to sound the way I want it to. It probably has to do with the fact that there are so many choices--wave form, filter type/cutoff/resonance, amp envelope, overdrive, effects--it can all get very confusing. I supposed I just need to spend more time playing with my synth until it becomes second nature or something. I guess the same goes for any of the instruments I try to play.