Songwriting FORM

[Sjonesmusic]

Intro > Verse > Verse > Chorus > Verse > Chorus > Leads > Chorus > Outro

 

This is the basic tried and true method of many 'classics' that we know and love today. So when we compose songs, should we:

 

A) Follow that basic structure?

B) Find other alternatives?

 

That

[SomeGuyNamedRob]

 

Originally posted by Sjonesmusic Intro > Verse > Verse > Chorus > Verse > Chorus > Leads > Chorus > Outro   This is the basic tried and true method of many 'classics' that we know and love today. So when we compose songs, should we:   A) Follow that basic structure? B) Find other alternatives?   That

[Rick Ratiug]

It is about telling your tale or getting your message acrossed. In doing that hopefully you can tap into how someone else might feel. In most cases a "non musician" cannot articulate those feelings. That is the connection that we as song writers look for, isn't it?

Is the format as important or more important than the tale?

[NervePoet]

I haven't used that formula since the early 70's. To me, music has to sound spontaneous. I rarely even enjoy listening to music that is formulaic. Sometimes someone gets so creative within those boundaries that I find it enjoyable, but like I said, rarely.

 

I like to experiment a lot, and I like to hear other people experiment. Something that has intrigued me before is working in "vignettes", where I have short ideas that I like a lot, but would be ruined if I threw them into a formula and turned them into a whole song. Sort of the concept that most Saturday Night Live skits that make a good skit don't necessarily make a good movie.

 

I try and link the vignettes together with others and create musical pieces. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, but that's the nature of experimentation. I've also done some very simple things that are only separated by brief bridges rather than choruses.

[BLACKWINGEDBEING]

I like what Nerve said!

I always go for the "feel" when I'm writing a tune. Most of the guitarist

I've worked with always leave a song too tight for experimenting.

Sometimes I'm left with no room to move within the song. A little

give and take is all I ask but seldom recieve. I'm not faulting the

"guitar player" at all. I need a good one to make me sound better

thru his techinal abilities. I just wish more people were open to

music being a feeling instead of a structured movement.

Did that make sense?

[boogie]

I think structure is very important. All my songs have a structure. Just not always the same, and only seldom the structure mentioned by Scott. Finding an interesting structure is challenging... but to me, the structure is the difference between a song and a jam.

 

Listen to Bach for amazingly structured music that is at the same time fresh and often surprising.

 

Tammo

[ageofzeppelin]

I've always been more partial to intro-verse-chorus-verse-chorus-bridge/leads-chorus for straight forward type rock songs.

I rarely write that way, but I certainly have used this form more than v-v-c-v-c-b/s-c. I've only done that once, and incidentally, the song is my current favorite of my tunes.

[SomeGuyNamedRob]

Originally posted by daddysguitar Darn! I clicked here thinking that Scott Jones had designed a form that you fill out and you have a new song!

 

No, that would be this :

 

http://www.brunching.com/toys/toy-alanislyrics.html

[dminus0]

 

Originally posted by Sjonesmusic Intro > Verse > Verse > Chorus > Verse > Chorus > Leads > Chorus > Outro   This is the basic tried and true method of many 'classics' that we know and love today. So when we compose songs, should we:   A) Follow that basic structure? B) Find other alternatives?   That

[auditorium]

i've been working very hard on non-linear or lateral songwriting...it's really, really hard. many of my lyric'd pieces are intro-verse verse chorus verse chorus something? chorus.

 

one or two deviate from that norm, like one which is a poem repeated three times which i like a lot, but non-linear song writing is difficult. i think writing lyrics as poetry and making them independant of the music is a good way to keep it interesting...look at maynard james keenan...he sings for one of the greatest non-linear modern bands (TOOL, for the uninitiated) and more than holds his lyrical grounds against their brilliant musicianship...what i'm saying is that i want to be as sexy as maynard. failing that, i'd love to break the mould of excessivly linear songwriting.

[thelonius74]

One thing to keep in mind is that I grew up listening to a lot of songs with that form so naturally that's what comes out. Not always though. I don't want a different form to sound forced.

 

However, the beautiful thing about forms is you can be creative or if you want you can be a thief. It's not like ripping lyrics or music. You can look at the form of any jazz standard or just about anything, that you think is very interesting and use it as a backdrop for one of your own songs. Or take it and modify it from there.

 

Regarding forms though my world was shook upside down the first time I heard The Beatles' Abbey Road.

 

That was experimentation in form if I've ever heard it. They would come up with a verse and chorus that was so brilliant it gave you chills...and then play it once, make it a 30 second piece and then just move on.