Live shows need help with stage presence

Hey everyone … pretty new to the forum but had some questions … I’m in a Death metal band, play lead guitar, and we have done a few live shows, and a couple battle of the bands at one place that we have never won. We know one of the guys that runs this place, and his comment was that we are awesome musicians but the reason we lost is that we lack stage presence. After review of a tape I would agree. Here is my opinion on it … me, the rhythm guitar and the bass player could use some work getting more active on stage but it’s hard to move around on stage while playing some of these harder riffs. Any advice for this?.... Also the singer isn’t very versatile, meaning that his vocals never really change and in between songs, in a high soft voice, all he does is announce the next song and move on, no attitude, no interaction with the audience, nothing ( I think he gets stage fright ). To me that is the biggest issue. It feels to me that the singer should be most of the show. What advice would you give to me and us? How would you recommend bringing the issue up to the singer?

Thanks

Here are some ideas.

#1. Sacrifice a few riffs live. Personally, our band is having to do this. Yes, it's cool ear candy to pull of sweet riffs in your songs. But, which is more important to you and your band? Impressing the 10 musicians in the audience, or the 200 general listeners? Of course, what YOU want is most important, but it sounds as if you're interested in entertaining the masses to a degree. Also, you can find easier parts to jam out to.

#2. More often than not, your vocalist needs to be a focus. One of my fav bands, Finger 11, gets away with out that being the case. But, their 2 guitarists are sick crazy and keep the visual attention on them live. But your guy should work on becoming more of a "front man". Gig Gig Gig. Just get gigs under your belt. But, work on things every show. What conversation worked? What sounded forced? ect.

#3. Work on your SET. Think of your live set a an entire song in a way. Does it flow? How are your transitions?

I think the fact you have used film to look at your show is the right direction. Go out and watch other bands, too. See what you like about their set, and how could you encorporate that into your set.

Good luck to ya!

Showmanship is everything...you absolutely need to do more than just play. Enterainment is a multifaceted experience. It is the responsibility of the entire band to make the show more than just guys playing music on stage. I would rather see a mediocre band with style and presence than a technically great band just standing and playing.

If the singer lacks the personality to do more than announce songs (a pointless exercise, anyway), then someone else needs to step up to the plate and engage the crowd. Since you guys are into Death Metal, attitude is an extremely important part of your onstage image, and from what you describe, your singer lacks the ability to display the needed attitude.

I agree with everyone that posted, but.....I don't think you have to change your music. When you practice ......practice your show. Practice playing those crazy riffs while moving around a bit. Tape your practices. Practicing with the band isn't just playing the songs. Its about the whole picture.

Don't get me wrong have some room for improv, but don't think you can go and play some crazy 16th note riff and do a back flip if you have never done it before.

My two cents.

Hee are some things I learned, and I'm still working on:

1. With few exceptions, people want to like you when you start playing. My experience is that the audience is yours to lose.

2. Again, with few exceptions, there are no "bad audiences", as if they somehow got together outside the venue before the show and decided to hate you before you played. There are only bad performances.

3. people are just people, just like you or me, and want the same things you do: to have a good time and be entertained. In fact, most of them admire you from one degree to another, because you're doing something they can't or won't ever do. So don't be self-conscious or apologetic for being onstage.

4. Usually, when you think you're acting stupid on stage, it's the thing the general public is entertained by. Talk to each other on stage (in the mics), crack jokes about each other, ask the crowd "how many people here think our (drummer, bass player, guitar player) should ________?" (get naked, play something he knows, shoot cheerios out his nose, whatever). Get the audience involved with you personally, not just musically.

5. Keep in mind that in the grand scheme of things, we're all just tiny little hairs on the pimples of the ass of the music business. If you try and fail, no one is going to remember in a day or two or give it another thought. As musicians, we're just diversions from the lives of the people who come to see us. While we may regard what we do as really, really, really important, trust me, they don't. That thought alone ought to be enough to free you from the bondage of your own selves. Heck, you can pretend to be anyone you want while onstage. I sometimes pretend I'm a big time blues guy, and act like it.

All are great suggestions and I appreciate the replies. As of right now we are going to go record some songs in the studio may 6th and 7th, and after that we are going to try to start doing a lot of gigs. I don’t think I’m to worried about the complication of the riffs, ill just practice with my eyes closed or something to help … I worry more about the singers attitude between songs, he has none …. We did try a couple of times to have a mic with our bass player but it always ends up with our singer jumping right in and announcing the next song before the bass player can even get up to his mic!

Imagine this in a deep mono tone Mickey Mouse voice “this is one of our newer ones, this next song is called (insert title here)” and that is what we have for our sets pretty much between all the songs.

Lots of good suggestions.

Here's my humble one. You're a reflection of your music. Your skills, emotions, personality and nature are brought into the music. Try amplifying those qualities and projecting that to the audience.. that's the easiest, most comfortable way to me to enhance your stage presence. And you're being true to your selves and the music.

Example: Your singer sounds like a no non-sense, straightforward kind of person. So run with it, amplify it, have fun with it. Is he like a Mr. Spock kind of guy (analytical, logical)? A Joe Friday (just the facts), a sergeant type personality?

See where you could take it to the extreme and have fun with it?

Number One way......play more shows, get practise and experience. Also drink alittle more before shows. Our stage show got alot better when we loosened up before shows by throwing back a few.

Not sure if that's good advise but it sounds like it should be given its due...

It's cute when you're 20, but at 40 it's just pathetic.

I agree with DanteRTS, consider sacrificing some of your more complicated parts for more mobility. I can't count how many times I've seen national touring acts that do this. Over time as you get more comfortable, you'll find you can start bringing them back into your set.

I've actually experienced this first hand playing out. I used look like a statue up there. I mean, so bad that people where always commenting on it. As time went on, the band around me started getting crazy and the crowd reaction was amazing. I decided that I wasn't going to let my buddies have all the fun and started getting into it. We went from hearing "Yeah, you guys are pretty cool" to "You guys are awesome! Can I buy a t-shirt?". I make a few more mistakes now, but it's much more fun to play.

Hell, look at Kiss; not the most musically talented band, but they're following is huge because of the crazy stage show.

Use a wireless or a long enough cord to go into the crowd or on top of a speaker cab. Do the school of rock "rockstar god" stance.

Have your singer man your wah pedal during solos.

Walk out into the audience and jam for the ladies.

I play in a blues rock cover band.. We highly encourage nudity shots of jaeger with the band and hot chicks dancing on stage flashing us..

Our shows are a party within themselves...

Working a crowd is definately a trait you need to develope..

I try to play all of my guitar parts wit movable chord shapes and pentatonic soloing.. Its kinda hard to run around when your shredding some harmonic minor modal run that requires perfect technique and concentration...

At which point the bassist should say something like.."and you stayed up all night practicing that?" into his mic. Audiences love that stuff...we groan, but they dig it. Someone has to start making the interplay. One mic on stage means one voice all night...and that usually means as an audience member I'm usually gone before the 1st set is over, because unless the songs are just outstanding, or the singer is terrific, I'm going to grow tired of the monotony.

I know others have said this ad nauseum, but it is a SHOW...not a rehearsal. There is an audience that is paying you to entertain them. They could stay home and do something else, but there they are...appreciate their effort, and give them back more!

My usual advice:

Video tape one of your shows...and show it to the entire band. Point out what works, and what doesn't. Then show them footage of a famous band Live, and show them how to change what is not working.

I've been in bands where singers, or bassists, or whatever have been like a statue. You need to get them to open up.

One clever trick I've used and works, and works WELL if you have another player who's like minded, is do a little messing around in rehearsal. During some songs, we have certain bits where the guitar rock god thing of rocking back and forth with your guitar, all maiden-esq anthemic like, works well. Its makes our bassist laugh, sometimes to the point where we all {censored} up and have to stop. But that's OK you're getting him to open up more. Encourage the antics.

I remember seeing One Minute Silence a few years back. I don't like the music, but that bassist especially was a {censored}ing nut! They actually ran out of CDs to sell at that show, and the only shirt size left was like girly XL which nobody wants (little lesson there- no girl asks for a large shirt, they're always small or medium!)

Death metal is all about technical guitar riffs. Technical is good.

Go on YouTube, or any downloadable sites and look for videos by the following bands: Deicide and Morbid Angel. Yes, I know you know the music.

I've seen both bands about a bazillion times. Deicide rarely get the pit moving. They're too busy standing around and kinda "expecting" the crowd to automatically like them. They get the crowd moving on a few numbers like "Bastards of Christ" or "Sacrificial Suicide" but not much. At every M.A. show, I've never been ABLE to stand! In fact my girlfriend cracked BOTH ribs at one of their london gigs, the pit was that intense. Ignoring the musicianship, I think both Deicide and M.A. are quality bands, but M.A. have a lot more songs where it just grooves. Grooving riffs always come off better live, a trick I've used in my own band. You compare something like Where the Slime Live to Trick Or Betrayed, the M.A. song IMO wins hands down in terms of accessibility. One rule we have kinda run in Helgrind is that if our songs can be figured out easily, but still sound good, we're on a winner and its working beautifully. Not saying you can't have any tricky bits, just make sure you rehearse these parts til you're blue in the face and sick of them!

One song we got, we got a part where its ALL about timing. We spent ten minutes playing the exact same part over and over and over... the part was about 25 seconds long and we just did it, repeat it, repeat it, etc, til we could play with our eyes closed.

Another thing as well is to not look unfocussed. Find songs that follow on from each other well and just go into them straight off, maybe use a little guitar feedback to link them.

One of our first gigs with our new drummer way back in the day, there were people walking around intent on not liking us, they were even booing us before we got on stage. It was cuz of some local bull{censored} with another band who were in a sense jealous that we were doing well.

We {censored}ing slayed that night and the club owner was actually scared of club damage the pit was moving so good.

Get yourself wireless kits - PROPER wireless kits! I've been through the AKG bug, the Samson Airline kits, the Shure kits - all of them are bollocks - don't waste your time. The Sennheiser EW172 is the ONLY wireless kit to get - although senny have come out with the new version of that kit which is even better, so it is!

Get your arse out in the crowd, it makes a big difference! If you got a guy filming you, make the bastard work for his money! Tapes we've had done, there have been three cams there and they've ALWAYS had issues keeping up with where I am. Once, I actually left the stage for a run around, ended up outside the club, played out there to random people for about 2 mins, came back in and did some crowd {censored}. Crazy stuff - but the trick is you need to know your songs inside out for that. When I came back in, I hadn't missed a beat. It takes practise and practise. Record your rehearsals regularly, be critical and practise the parts that require the most concentration and especially any parts that you fudge up.

Its a winning combination.

We're just about to invest in a big back banner for our band. The idea is to set it up with a coupla striplights (which I got free - score!) and have the strobe going on it when the intro music plays. WE gotta shell out on the actual banner, find some way of making it ultra-portable, and shell out for a strobe. I have a laptop already that I'm thinking I can control this with, though needs more research. Stage candy is a great idea, but you need to ensure its portable, i.e. will fit in your car with your gear, can be set up fairly quickly and doesn't take a LOT of room, but still looks impressive all the same. Another band I was in got big blocks of foam from Stevenage market a few years back and we spent a weekend making gravestones and skulls out of em. They're great - don't break, look cool when they're painted and were nice and cheap!

Go forth and slay some mother{censored}ers, you!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jon Sick

If your singer is not entertaining take it to the millionth degree like Mushroomhead or Modern Rob Halford.

Have him look menacing or at the ground all the time. ZERO interaction. To the point of mystery. Maybe even have him wear sunglasses.

Your singer doesn't need to be the focal point. Let someone else be the spokesman. You probably are the best choice since you seem to know you need something.

Watch some players like KK and Glenn, or Zakk. these guys go crazy WHEN THEY CAN. They mostly use "the pose" during intrictae parts. Just standing together onstage makes a difference.

Try facing each other menacingly like KISS.

It is easy and fun after awhile.

Check out some KISS, RUSH, Priest, Maiden, Mushroomhead(for you youngsters), GWAR.

These bands can all play yet give a good show.

a good tip for being able to play your riffs and showing off stage presence, is to simply raise your strap a bit higher, so your arms and wrists aren't bent as severely to make the cool smoothe riffs. atleast that way, you wouldn't have to sacrifice your playing for your performance.

second, don't worry about being nervous. people are there to see you. and the second you strtmpressing them with your moves, the second they become putty in your hands. play with them, let them know you're havin fun.

I dunno if you guys are one of those "kill kill kill" metal bands, but if you're not, you might want to watch Adam D. from Killswitch Engage play on the Set this World Ablaze DVD. he does some pretty hilarious {censored}, and still manages to tear his guitar up. It's entertaining.

Synchronize stage moves with you and your band. People like seeing breaks where the whole band jumps up, and lands on a down note. that {censored} gets you pumped.

Also, when you see that people are digging you, encourage moshing. People want to mosh. When you command them, they eat that up too.

simple tricks, like throwing your guitar, punching your guitar, and the whole playing with your fingers over the fretboard thing.

All tricks, all fun. Just have fun man, i guess thats what it's all about.

MaTT-O

That's pretty funny, because I heard there's guys out there who pretend to be BlueStrat pretending to be a big-time blues guy!

...Well, that's what I heard!

Originally posted by Kingnome That's pretty funny, because I heard there's guys out there who pretend to be BlueStrat pretending to be a big-time blues guy! ...Well, that's what I heard!

How pretentious!

All good replies...

the only problem i see with raising the strap is that i am a large framed, 6 foot, 6 inch, tall man, who already looks goofy with a regular sized guitar, so ill lower it a little bit to make me hunch to get to it. but i know what you mean ... i do play better when raised.

One of the things that helped me the most about pulling of technique (the little I have) while running around was to alter my position while practicing.

If you sit down in proper guitar postition every time you practice and then expect to be able to jump around and keep the licks up you're in for a rude awakening.

When I'm practicing the songs I'll be playing live I try to change my posture / body positioning every few minutes so I don't get too comfortable.

Stand up, sit down, put your foot on something like you would with a wedge in front of you, bang your head (if applicable) , whatever odd position you may find yourself. Basically, simulate playing live while practicing.

I even went so far a few years ago of practicing scales and finger exercises on a treadmill.

Now that I have kids it's way easier, I'm so used to playing with all sorts of distractions that multitasking is now second nature!

yeah, another great thing to do is just loosen up at band practices... like if you're close with your band, just kinda goof off while playing, show off to them, but just have fun.

the more you're having fun at practice, and the more jokes you can make and get your friends and bandmates to loosen up, the more your bandmates are going to want to. that's just a fact. haha. they don't want you to be the only one having fun.

or, you'll be the only one with awesome presence, become the face of your band, and get all the chicks.

Sounds win/win to me.