Is the D-50 worth it?

I was thinking of getting a Varios and I found someone who is selling the VC-1 card (or D-50 emulation synth) with it. Roland claims the VC-1 isn't just a replication, it is a D-50. So, I wanted to hear what you guys think about the D-50. I know it used to be popular and people like Enya used it all the time. But I'm not really interested in stuff like that. What can the D-50 do? What kind of music does it work well in?

The D-50 is my favorite synthesizer (and Analog Kid will agree ) - it has a special sonic character that I have not found in other machines.

The sound: well, "out of the box" is probably best used for New Age, Ambient, and standard Rock/Pop, but if you get into programming it (admittingly difficult, even with the programmer) you can use it for any style of music.

I have many audio examples of the D-50 and the four original Roland cards at my site

I'd suggest you take a look at what Sealed has written about LA synthesis as well as this article about the D-50.

It's still a good pad machine.

I assume that when Roland says the VC-1 is a D-50 it's in the same sense as the Yamaha PLG cards where the DX card really is the full DX7 circuit reduced to a tiny circuit board leaving the host synth to provide power and all the audio and control interfacing.

To this day, nothing sounds like a D-50. It has a spatial quality that is still unique even today, and in stereo it seems to come from everywhere. It has to be heard to be appreciated. It will definitely get your imagination going.

My experience with the VC-1 has been that the D-50's sound is pretty dated and you're going to need to do a fair bit of programming to get sounds that wont make your music sound like it's from the early 90's.

Paolo, the sound 'Intruder FX' is quite cool Most of the samples are nice and some of them might be tailorable to fit into my music. It does have a nice quality to it. I'll probably give it a try in the Varios.

Well, the interfacing won't be hindered by a host synth because the Varios, although it uses it's own hardware outputs which are of high quality, uses a software program to access all the parameters, so I suspect it's going to be much better than what Yamaha have been doing with their cards.

Here a pic of the screen I'm talking about HERE and Rolands D-50 claim is found on their website which states "PC Card turns the V-Synth/VariOS into a complete and accurate reconstruction of Roland's groundbreaking D-50 L/A Synthesizer". Plus it has 28 new waveforms.

I think it will be worth it to pay a little more to get this card, so I think I'm going to do it.

I thought I remember Don making a detuned saw sound ala JP8000, but he did it with his D-550 rack module. Would love to hear that again, it sounded pretty dang close to the JP.

Yeah, Umbra I was thinking that also, but it may work with some layering from other synths to add space and depth to other sounds.

The VC-1 card is a great compliment to the V-Synth and VariOS. It provides nice piano modes not found with the native V-Synth.

I'm hoping Roland released a new VC-3 and a V-Synth 2. Just give the V-Synth more sample memory and multi-sample capability. Maybe a Fantom XV with an USB2.0 host.

I've got a Fantom X8, two V-Synths, a VC-1 and a VC-2. (and another dozen classics analogs)

Mark

Listen to me. Do not ever, EVER use that sound for any reason. Ever. Same goes for Fantasia and Digital Native Dance.

You have been warned.

My brother had one of the first D-50s back in '86 or '87. I remember hearing those sounds at the store and thinking how cool. Then we got the David Lee Roth Skyscraper album and one of the songs started with one of those sounds. We looked at each other and said, "Guess we can't use that sound anymore." Once we started hearing those sounds being shoehorned into records for no reason, it instantly cheesified that synth for me. I could never figure out how to program it. I always felt alienated and disconnected from the D-50. I didn't get off on keyboards 'til I bought a used Pro-One and Rhodes in about 1990 for $145 and $160 repectively. Then I got the bug. My brother, who is a bass player, was totally obsessed with the D-50. I thought it sound cold and new-agey. I remember that the sound I used on it most was the Jupiter Strings.

Stiky, the amount of sound D-50 is capable to create, is beyond belief. It can produce unique sound that no other synthesizer can replicate or emulate. It is not outdated and it will never be. Listen to this:

http://www.synthmania.com/Cards,%20Exp.%20Boards/Roland/PN-D50-series/PN-D50-04/Audio/78%20STAR-TREK%20Voices.mp3

That is typical D-50.

Interested in custom programming? Here is what it can do:

http://www.rolandsynthesis.com/tmp/demos/D-50demo1.mp3

(a collection of sounds i recently programmed)

P.S. I actually don't have a D-550, but D-50 + PG1000. I heard of D-50 in '94, but could not afford it. Bought it in 2002, sold it after a year (i needed cash), and then this year, a friend was selling his mint (first owner!) D-50 with PG for dirt cheap. An offer i could not refuse. Here it is:

Off topic:

Actually to set the record straight, the Yamaha cards all come with software editors. Like the Varios without a computer you can't do full editing but the host synth does allows some edits.

This editor is for the AN card:

More off-topic: Even better for the AN plugins is the AN1x editor, which will now also work with the AN boards. You don't have to install a retarded sequencer application to use it, either.

Originally posted by Paolo Di Nicolantonio The D-50 is my favorite synthesizer (and Analog Kid will agree ) - it has a special sonic character that I have not found in other machines......

+1

I have two D-550s. I always play with out with one of 'em. Killer pad machine.

Those sounds are cool Don. It really shows what can be done with it? Didn't you post a JP8K detuned saw sound a while back that was comparable to the JP's supersaw? Yeah, I'm sure this would be cool to have around. Seems like it must be programmed to not sound outdated. I think it might work better if layered with itself or with other synths, I could see it getting use there. I'm not big on digital synths, except for the FS1R and Fizmo, but this thing should be able to be programmed to not sound dated. I'm going to give it a go. Heck it's free when you buy a Varios for $400 new. Can't beat that.

Also, what kind of spacey pianos can it do? I heard this piano sound that seemed to have a lot of reverb and slight delay to it, when I heard I thought D-50, because it sounded 'Icey cold', but it was super cool. It had a mysterious or enchanting sound to it, but 'Icey' is the best description I can think of. The sound I'm think ing of is played on the piano on the higher keys. The sound I'm thinking of might just be a piano put through some reverb and slight delay, but for some reason that sound reminds me of the D-50 (even when I've never played one).

Thanks for referring to my site, Meatball Fulton. I'm planning a D-550 page in the future.

Great as always, Don! And it's really incredible you created these wide range of sounds with D-50!!

VC-1 Rocks. Period. Get it!

The sound today known as "supersaw" originates from D-50. It was widely used by italian producers in early 90's (look for some Capella tracks, Gianfranco Bortolotti, Walter Cremonini production, etc). Most of this music never entered US, so many people are not aware of importance D-50 had in European production. In US at that time D-50 was already considered as "outdated" (everyone was M1-ing).

Difference is that JP80x0 supersaw uses 7 saw waves, while D-50 uses 4 saw waves. However, each individual saw wave on D-50 can have its width modulated (PWM!). Try to figure out what sounds thicker.

The VC1 as I understand contains the same code as the original D50, but of course its running on new hardware (so DAC differences). I assume basically they mead the same code synth egine, adapted to various and with some kind of optional similation of the old DAC. Certainly is has the same limitation in midi as the original, and other biots of it show no sign whatsoever of having been modernised. As an overal synth - the VC1 maybe more capable than the D50 - more waveforms to choose from etc from what I have heard, but I havnt bothered to confirm this - not sure if I could even remember what the hell the original had anyway now - was so long ago.

Is it worth it? Depends what you after - Because so much of the engine was a complete hack compared to most later digital synths that tried to model thing more properly - it certainly has a unique character that to my mind seems to sit nicely between the analog world and the full digital worlf od FM synthesis, and of course can make noises that nothing else can completely replicate.

Uses for me - generally tinkly bits and digital body in pads, digital vox type noises etc - all great for layering into rich pads. I tend to sample it alot then switch back to V-Synth and load the samples into that. I must admit to be getting quite tempted to get a varios box just to make that workflow alot easier.

Edit - worth mentioning - DO get yourself a nice fx processor combo to go with it for adding delays and reverbs particualrly. That can make a hell of a difference - even a D-Two+M-One combo with aa compressor can really bring it alive - I typically run mine through eitehr a fireworx or a d-two+m-onexl+triple-c combo - I just like delay+reverb+squash chain for ambient type stuff.

O

Ah..... you have not had to install yamaha's retarded editor to use the AN plug-in editor for years.

And yes, that sequencer really was retarded!

That's what I ended up doing. People seem to have trouble giving away the varios right now so the prices are really low especially second hand. Plus you get the jupiter and 303 emulators (v-synth can do that stuff anyway) and the crappy producer software. I use my varios as a card player, hardware based soft synth, and as an extra set of midi IOs.

I mean with the VC-1 is really is a no-brainer to get (VC-2 is the real gem of the two) but just be aware of what you're getting, basically an old synth that is so-so by today's standards and is more interesting from an historical standpoint than anything else unless you have a lot of time invested in a D-50 and want to carry forward your patches, knowledge, etc.

The D-50 is a classic synth and definitely "worth it", in my humble opinion. I had one for years along with the PG1000 programmer/slider box - later had a D-550. I did a lot of editing on it and really loved the sounds I was getting. The music I've used it on mostly was ambient electronic or new age-type sounds. The D-50 came out as Roland's competition for the massively-popular Yamaha DX-7 and Korg M-1, and it certainly held it's own and made it's mark. So expect to hear sounds that are characteristic of that period (although not limited to it). It's a very warm-sounding digital synth.

I don't mean to nitpick but the M1 came after the D-50. The M1 "improved" on the D-50's concept of S + S (sample + synthesis), and had better (multi)samples, but its filter lacked resonance, so there are many types of sounds on the D-50 that the M1 cannot do. Likewise, there are many types of M1 sounds that the D-50 cannot imitate.

So, the M1 came out as competition for the massively popular D-50, and not viceversa.

The DX7 is a different beast altogether, it doesn't contain PCM samples.

I do agree that those three are the 3 digital synthesizers of the '80s.

It's also totally the intro from Eric Johnson's Ah Via Musicom album.... was that a preset /split?

A classic hippy sound machine.

I just purchased Walter Beckers (Steely Dan) Roland D-550 for just over 200.00. I didnt realize these could be had for so inexpensive.

What are the best sites to download patches ie sys-ex or whatever for the D-550 and D-50?

The VC-1 (card or within XT) is more than a replication. You can boot it up in the original format with the shortcomings that made the D50 so characteristic. Or you can boot up in the cleaner format which is not that much different. However, there are tons of banks of D50/550 sounds out there, and the really nice thing about the VC-1 card or XT version is that you have room for 6 preset banks the first 5 of which duplicate the original 5 cards; plus there are 8 internal (user banks) that you can overwrite with your own patches.

The classic sounds are there (e.g. Fantasia, Native Dance etc.) but you can download or develop your own super classic analogue sounds with this (Sven's or Erix banks are awesome). Just do a google search for D50 sounds and you'll be sure to get some handy links.

When I first acquired my XT, I loaded my material in via USB. You also have the ability to store on pcm card. It didn't take me long before I was crafting my own patches. The only bummer I have to complain about is that you cannot run the VC-1 at the same time as the V-Synth or VC-2 (Vocal Designer). Other than that, if you have a V-Synth, grab that card now before it's too late - or get an XT. The VC-2 voice processor is incredible too.

Cheers,

Eric