Live Rig Options - keyb or computer-based???

As a piano player who joined a band recently, got some help on here a while back with keyboard amp selection - liking the traynor I picked up, so thanks! Right now, I'm using a keyboard that the guitar player has and am hoping to get something new (mainly because the kurzweil sp88 sounds pretty thin and wimpy after two overdriven guitar solos from the band's guitar players!)

I'm checking out the PC3x, RD700GX, S90es - typical choices in this range. But, I'm awfully tempted to buy a macbookpro for the same price and run logic live through my apogee duet. I could use, say, NIB4 or some other B3 emulator, get a fast external harddrive to run, say, ivory, etc., etc.. I could try Mainstage - or, any issues (?) with just having a Logic project setup with a different sound/configuration on each track, and then just select the track I want before performing each song?

I guess I see a lot of flexibility from the laptop option - a given keyboard might have strengths in certain sounds, and not in others, and I can mix sounds to my heart's context within Logic, distort/wah sounds to compete with guitar, etc.. I can use the sp88 as the controller just fine for now.

So, any thoughts on these options? Words of wisdom? Laptop live bad idea? Mainstage vs just Logic 8?

I've been using a combination of both, it's always been important to me to have a backup plan. I certainly am not ready to put all my faith into computers yet. I would recommend to at least have a rackmount synth to go with your midi/usb controller in the case of a crash/lockup/etc.

In my last band I was using an M-Audio 88es/Fantom XR combination.

My situation is probably different than yours, I do most the lead vocal and switch between guitar and keys so I want my rig to be rock solid because my bandwidth and tolerance for technical problems is low.

The rig I'm setting up now includes a MacBook Pro (I'll have two of them) running Digital Performer 5.13 which will send midi control messages to the lighting and all my stage and PA processors as well as some backing track data to my keyboards and rackmount synth. Meanwhile some of the backing tracks will be frozen tracks of SampleTank, Reason, DP's synths, and perhaps others along with bits of recorded guitar here and there.

So in the end I have what will be a well tested combination of hardware and software. My first backup plan will be MBP #2 but in the end there won't be any songs on my set list I can't do with just a guitar/keyboard and a mic.

Yeah, I guess worst case I could just use the Kurzweil's internal sounds if the computer side of things died live, but, of course, that wouldn't help if something went wrong midsong!

I guess my other hesitation is that I'd need to buy the laptop, etc., set up the rig and be $3000 into the process before I could definitively see whether it was stable, workable, etc.. I could do a test run with my desktop iMac and then hope that it would translate to a laptop, given comparable specs on the laptop. I'll be spending some time in Guitar Center again today on the keyboard options - invariably though I like some sounds on one, but not the other sounds, and it seems easier to cobble together the exact sounds I like in Logic via softsynths.

I do like/see the importance of a backup plan, though......I guess I'm looking for some more opinions on the laptop live option - as I don't want to blow my keyboard budget on a laptop only to find it doesn't work well enough! Need to find out the return policy on a macbook pro.....

There's little doubt that a MacBook Pro is the top of the heap for dependable live sessions, however, it's not fool proof.

The only combination of computer and software that I would put complete trust in would be a MBP running only Propellerhead Reason.

Just curious........what's making you lean towards the Macbook vs. the Muse Receptor?

I just started using my laptop (3-year old HP - nothing special) running Reason and B4II with my live setup. Happy to report I've had absolutely no issues!

I'm just about to embark down the laptop road, and am a bit concerned myself over the stability...it doesn't help that since I'm doing this for fun basically, and times are a bit tight, I'm doing everything as cheaply as possible So at least feel comforted that there's at least one person out there further out on that wing than you

Tons of info to sort through here, if folks are interested! Be curious to get other's impressions if they read through this stuff.

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=45

For me, getting a great piano sound is part of the battle, and streaming something like Ivory live.......would hope it works..

I may be the only one with this opinion but I would not go with a stage laptop.

First and foremost, I would select a serious mainstay keyboard and build around it even if you do go for a laptop rig eventually. Nothing like a solid reliable bread-n-butter keyboard to give you the foundation and respect you'll want to build your reputation on. A quality digital piano is your best freind.

I have several pianos and I recently added a Hammond XK3c as my second keyboard (I already have three synths to choose from for rompler/VA duties as required). The Hammond is THE organ currently and it sounds every bit as good as it looks. It holds it's own against Strats and Les Pauls as a legendary instrument. What's especially cool is that I get people who call and say "I need a Hammond player tonight". They don't say "I need someone with B4 and a laptop". BTW I own B4 and a laptop... cute for home use.

The total-package effect of having respectable keyboards on stage is still the best business card there is. I've seen guys perform with computer rigs - they looked awful on stage and didn't sound that good... yes I know they can be made to look and sound good but I have not seen anyone do it in my area. I also work on computers and they hiccup and burp every time some update comes along for the OS or the software or the controller, etc. That's far less of a problem with my keyboards.

It's your call but personally I love being known as a pianist, organist and synthesist... not as a nerd (even if I may B 1 !).

That's because everyone else in your area is using da Beat Kangz Beat Thang

I don't go to those places.

Actually I saw a guy playing with a band for a wedding reception - he had a table with a laptop, a CME controller, and gobs of wires everywhere... looked like someone threw up multi-grain spaghetti. Sounded thin and shrill. A good keyboard would've been better.

Thanks for the ideas - yeah, the Kurzweil SP88 isn't doing the trick for me as the "core" stage piano. The Yamaha S90ES was ok - its just a bit of a let down coming from soft synths to these live rig options soundwise........I just love being able to tweak, effect, mangle my go-to sounds using soft synths plus effects in Logic - to compete with the guitar players :-) .....

If I did get a live rig, it would probably boil down to one of the Yamaha S90ES, RolandRD700Gx, or the Kurzweil PC3x......... For my current uses, the piano sound really needn't be superlative - most of the songs aren't using solo piano. I mainly need to be able to tweak and load good organ leads, blend organs with distorted guitars, then effect further to taste. "Modifiable funk/jazz/rock leads with kahunas" that don't just sound like bloated 80s synth sounds

Of my big three, which fits my needs best?

Heck the XK3c looks pretty cool.....probably too "single-purpose" to be the first board, but man......there a hardware rack unit that will produce the same sounds right?

Hard to sort through.....

Probably the Kurz fits your needs best but it sure is pricey. I'm an old Kurz fan but I gave them up some years ago over boredom with the Kurz piano sound and concern over the company itself.

But I do think a quality digital piano should be your first priority and there's plenty to choose from.

There are organ modules but not like the XK3x... it actually has two preamp tubes and a really warm sound I haven't heard anywhere else. The Leslie effect is well thought out and also better. Plus the XK3c is a MIDI controller - I'm going to take it out on some gigs where I'll use my old trusty Kurzweil piano module with it. But I think the XK3c is an awesome second keyboard even if it's a one-trick piano. It makes a statement. You can always add a Motif-whatever module to it if you need other rompler sounds.

Yeah, I'm pretty intrigued with the XK3c and the Kurz.....need to find the Hammond to try it out. Buy that plus a decent module of some kind.....would have to see about playing piano on the XK3c action!

There's lots of doubt in my mind about that statement. MBPs run hot, and you can't turn off spedstepping without third party apps that make it run even hotter. Then, there's the fun broken compatibility issues with OSX/QT/Airport updates and all that stuff. Plus, they're fragile.

I use a rackmount PC- it's completely stable and can put up with the banging around that happens with loading and unloading. Plus, if anything goes wrong, I can fix it easily and cheaply.

I've been almost completely ITB for four years or so. I bring along a hardware guitar amp for layering with my amp modelers; besides that, all my synths, etc. are virtual. I've yet to have any issues. YMMV...

ew

I just got a Macbook Pro, on sale at Macmall. At the outset, we plan to use it for recording, running Ableton Live, and the StringPort suite for my electric cello. We have several hardware synths.

Check with me in a few months and I'll post an update on how things are going along.

Does anything like a "rackmount Mac" exist? I'm tied up with Logic right now.....

http://www.apple.com/xserve/

You did not state a budget but I doubt this thing will be in your price range.

I'm guessing you asked because you let the other guy scare you a bit. I've gigged with a laptop before - it's not a big deal if you use your common sense.

Always check this first before buying a Macbook anything:

http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/

Oooh...that looks pretty cool......Yeah, pushing the price range, although doesn't compare that badly against a Muse Receptor! Actually, a MBP is in the $2400-$2700 range new, also.....

I'm thinking that either a Kurz PC3x or Motif XS8 for many B & B sounds, along with a 61 non-weighted MIDI controller (both keyboards controlling a Muse Receptor 2 w/ Komplete) might be an awesome choice!

That way, you could have the more critical voices (pianos, B3, strings, horns, choirs, etc.) pre loaded into your 16 user slots on the Receptor. Your sliders on your 88 master could control instant split/ layers, etc., while your 61 note board & sliders could control the B4 organ. The Receptor will accept MIDI in as well as USB.

I got my MBP for about $1500. It was last year's model so my guess is MacMall was clearing them out. I did get AppleCare though, so if anybody spills beer on the MBP at a gig, I can have it serviced, after I kill the person who spilled the beer of course.

I'm thinking that either a Kurz PC3x or Motif XS8 for many B & B sounds, along with a 61 non-weighted MIDI controller (both keyboards controlling a Muse Receptor 2 w/ Komplete) might be an awesome choice! That way, you could have the more critical voices (pianos, B3, strings, horns, choirs, etc.) pre loaded into your 16 user slots on the Receptor. Your sliders on your 88 master could control instant split/ layers, etc., while your 61 note board & sliders could control the B4 organ. The Receptor will accept MIDI in as well as USB.

Yeah, something like that would be pretty darn nice. I'm new to keyboards (have mainly had a grand piano at home) - is this hard to configure/set-up?

I'm actually waiting for an appointment to be confirmed to have a hands-on demo of the Receptor. I'll gladly let you know what I find out.

Please do! Not sure if these are on your question list, but I'd be curious to hear how easy (or not) it is to map controls for B3 type stuff, whether vocals can run at the same time through the same unit running your keys, and how fast the patches can change (load times, etc.). I ought to get a demo myself somewhere........Have fun with it!

If you buy full blown Logic, it comes with Mainstage, which is designed for live use. You won't need B4II, because a part of Mainstage is the EVB3, which is phenominal and is the best software organ, and Leslie sim, IMHO, out there.

Rick