Manual Flanger/phase degree

On some flangers/phaser processors there is a "Manual"

parameter/function to control the phase/time degree

How would this be done by using 2 or 3 tape decks with varispeed controls how would i get that "manual parameter/function" but using tape decks?

The Manual Parameter turns OFF the LFO circuit so there is

no sweeping but it gives a comb filter phase degree effect

how can i do this with tape decks and varispeeds?

Troll allert troll allert....

Earth to Walters ... your breaking up ...

I don't recall any phasers/flangers where the Manual parameter is an on/off switch. But if there was, it would simply turn off the LFO modulating the delay. In tape terms - stop fiddling with the vari-speed.

Usually the Manual setting is simply the time setting for the delay. The LFO modulates this delay, so short delays (Haas delays) are considered phasing, and the longer delays are considered flanging, and even more delay gets you chorusing.

It adjusts the Degrees of the Time delay , it just turns off the LFO sweeping up and down and can set it to a certain spot in the sweep

Manual setting is simply the time setting for the delay.

If i put my thumb on the reel to reel or using the varispeed

its Sweeping the Degrees

How do i get it to not sweep and to Stop at a Time degree?

this is my problem

Boss Flanger have a Manual parameter

Electro Harmonix electric Mistress

I very much doubt that ...

The EH Electric Mistriss doesn't have a manual parameter - it's a fixed delay.

The Boss 'Manual' parameter is the delay setting.

Let's imagine for one minute that you actually had tape machine, and you actually were flanging with your thumb ... if you want to stop the flangin, take your thumb off!

If you started off with two machines in sync, your thumb on the flange slowing down the second machine would have created a delay between the two. When you take your thumb off, that delay stays static.

Why don't you worry yourself about some gear you actually own?

How do i get a delay that stays static? with 2 tape machines?

With my Boss Flanger in the Manual mode i can adjust the

Time static Degrees

How is this possible with 2 tape machines?

If i take my thumb off the 2 tape machines would be in sync

and no time delay would happen

The Boss flanger in Manual mode gives like a Slap back EQ effect

resonance peaks

If you take your thumb off, both machines continue at the same speed and whatever delay you introduced by slowing it down remains 'static'. It's not a difficult concept to understand.

The tape deck that you slowed down isn't going to magically jump back into sync just because you take your thumb off. You would have to speed it up somehow to get it to catch up.

If you just want a delay that doesn't modulate, then don't get a flanger - get a delay.

a delay that doesn't modulate

Yes but with a Flanger in "manual Mode" you can get really really short Delay time even BEFORE slap back these is what im trying to say its BEFORE slap back

the Millisec to Nanosec timing of "before" slap back effect is with

the Manual parameter on a flanger or phaser united

How do i get a Slap back echo with 2 tape decks?

and to take it further how to i get "Before" slap back delay time?

These are just academic questions aren't they? With a simple tape delay, the smallest delay you can get is determined by the distance between the record and playback heads, and the speed of the tape. So it is true that in the early days, there were practical limits to how small this delay could be.

But if you copy your tape and run it on another machine, and line them up so they are perfectly in sync - you can have any delay time you want simply by slowing the second machine down. With your thumb if you want. With this method, you can even get the 'delay' to precede the dry track - negative delay. That's what 'through-zero flanging' is all about.

Thanks kiwi for the help

So What do you think the "manual parameter is doing then"

because when you move it it Manually sweeps up and down

the delay time, if you leave it , its static at a "degree of the cycle"

Its static at a Degree of the cycle in time and SUMMED together the dry and wet

but the Wet signal is not modulating its Static but static at a degree of the cycle of the waveform

If i just slow down the 2nd tape deck machine its not really static

stopping at a Degree of the cycle in Time

When you slow down the 2nd tape deck machine Yes its Static but the 1st tape decks FREQUENCY's are doing to SWEEP and cancel out

When you have the Boss Flanger in Manual Mode it doesn't SWEEP, it STOPS at a degree of the cycle and the freqneycs don't

sweep at all its a cancellation effect

Do you know what i mean by the difference?

If it's stopped sweeping, then it will just be a delay. Have you ever just spent time playing with an ordinary single delay? One that can increment in milliseconds - or even tenths of milliseconds - is good.

Very short delays sound like a comb filter. Up until about 30ms you won't hear it as a delay - that's called the Haas effect. Between around 50 to 100 ms is that slap back effect - but a flanger won't normally go that far. A Chorus might.

On the Boss Flanger I have the manual knob sweeps a resonant peak like you said earlier - I don't remember any slap back happening, the delays in those flangers are pretty short I think.

Kiwi - Yes that's it - combing. That's more the sound...

So what type of Combing Effect is the Manual parameter doing?

Its Wet with Dry but the Wet is Static so how do i get this type

of combing effect? with 2 tape decks?

Most Delay time based effects don't go Before 50ms to get in the

flanger and chorus Millisecond range

Life must be really hard for you Walters. How do you go about getting out of bed in the morning? Is it:

1 - putting the left foot down

2 - putting the right foot down

3 - putting both feet down

How do you make it go NOT SLEEPY? That's my problem?

The Manual parameter turns off the LFO sweeping and makes

the delay time Static and Stopped at a spot in the cycle

Using 2 tape decks how to i have it have a Static Delay time?

so its STopped at a frequency where its cancelled and summed

just like the "manual function"?

Yawn.

Kiwi can this Manual techique only been done electronically?

Or is there a way to do it with 2 tape decks?

What 2 tape decks do you have Walters?

I told you ages ago in this same thread exactly how to do that but you seem to be on something and didn't notice.

If you started off with two machines in sync, your thumb on the flange slowing down the second machine would have created a delay between the two. When you take your thumb off, that delay stays static.

Stays static for like a nanosecond and then catches back up to speed with tape deck#1

If i put my thumb off and on its going to modulation the speed and Sweep the frequency

The Manual parameter doesn't Sweep the Frequencys it Sets a

Degree point and STOPs at a frequency of the sweep

If 2 tape decks are running how do i STOP the 2nd tape deck at a frequency/degree/sweep point? i would have to turn off the 2nd tape deck machine and manually turn the tape flange?

Walters, Walters, Walters. What planet are you from? Did you study physics at school?

In your 2 tape machine situation - by placing your thumb on the flange you slow the machine down. So relative to the first machine, it is losing time. Call that 'degrees' if you will - it's all just a time relationship.

As soon as you take you thumb off, the tape speed returns to normal. But you haven't re-gained the lost time. Let's say you had slowed the first machine down to the point where it was 100ms behind the first - as soon as you take your thumb off, it remains 100ms behind. Calling Elvis ...

So if you want just a 20ms static flange sound - you would take your finger off when it had lost 20ms relative to the first.

Just get yourself a damn delay and play with it already. Using a freeware VST host and freeware VST plugins you could be experimenting with this yourself.

Right - that's why they call it manual - it only sweeps when you're twisting it - or manualing it as you might say...then it stays put with whatever comb you have set.

When i take my finger OFF it goes back to normal to Zero seconds

Manual Static Delay graph:1 to 10 milliseconds manual range

So the manual parameter ranges from 1 to 10ms

The Manual Parameter all the way to the LEFT is 1ms

Thats 1ms static Delay time

If i put the vari-speed (1ms) #2 tape deck behind the #1 tape deck so now there is a time relationship

Its going to SWEEP and not be Static because there is a Dry and wet(1ms) behind and the frequencys are going to Sweep up and down.

I put the Manual parameter in the middle its 5ms

thats 5ms static delay time

If i put the vari-speed (5ms) #2 tape deck behind the #1 tape

deck so now there is a (5ms) time relationship

What actual tape machines are you using? If you have slowed one down with your thumb, and then release your thumb, it will go back to normal speed. But the lost time relationship stays static - until you change it again. You would have to physically push the flange a little faster to catch up.

Varispeed causes sweeping because if one machine is running slower than the other, the delay is getting larger the longer they run. So you run through the whole range of phasing, flanging, chorusing and eventualy large delays.

To have a static delay between two tape decks, you don't use varispeed. Run them at the same speed, in sync, and then adjust the delay you want by slowing one down temporarily with your thumb.

Do they actually let you touch the tape machines at your work?

Post a clip so we can hear your cool creation - otherwise what good is it?