My first drum recording session with the new Pro Tools rig

I just recorded drums and bass with my new G5/Digi002/PT LE 7.4 rig that I've been assembling and pestering you guys with for the past month.

I was a bit clumsy trying to get around on the new system, but after a couple of hiccups, it went very smoothly. PT has moved a number of things around since PT 5.1, so sometimes I forget the new place that they've put some of the functions. And I still haven't really learned to use the Digi002 controller very much except for the super obvious things. Also, out of many years' habit, I kept reaching for the mouse instead!

I used four RealTraps Mini-Traps, two on either side of the drums, and then had packing blankets in front of the kit, a couch in back, and various other things to try and take out some of my very hideous sounding 11x17' living room. This worked like a charm this time. I used Auralex foam for "surrounding" the overhead (I went mono this time - sounded right for these songs). The drums sound very present and really solid and full...and they sound like they were recorded in a nice room.

One of the really cool things about this was the Heil mics. I used a Heil P30 dynamic for an overhead mic, another for the bass cabinet, and a Heil P40 for the kick drum. These mics sound really good on a kit, and the kick was instantly present, a really great, solid in-your-chest sort of sound that was easy to get. This will be my go-to kick mic now. Fantastic.

I used an AT4060 as a room mic, but this time, only about 4 feet in front of the kit, pointed away from the kit at a ninety degree angle. It was really close to the packing blankets. This sounded really good, and it added quite a lot to the sound. I had steered away from room mics in the past because my room sounded so bloody awful, and I was so happy to be able to use a room mic again because it's so much a part of the bloom, part of the sound.

The whole band was blown away by how good the kit sounded in what was ordinarily a crappy sounding room. You CAN make a crappy room sound good for drums. Whew. I've been dissatisfied with my drum sound in this room even though the clients have all been happy and the mixes have come out well. I kept thinking, "If only you knew how good I can make drums if I have a decent sounding room..."

I just feel relieved. I have tracked in much larger, better sounding rooms before, so it's nice to know that with some effort, I can still get a good, solid drum sound with lots of tone. And nice to know that I won't be pulling Drumagog out to fix anything this time. It's all there.

Very cool! Congrats, Ken!

Best,

Geoff

glad to hear it's all coming together for you Ken.

Thanks!

It's nice after all that assembling that the thing actually worked for a larger-scale recording. I've already done two mixes and a bass loop session, all of which were highly successful.

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Here's a fun example of the universe answering my call.

I've had trouble with Digi002 not following my external converter's clock. As someone here and on DUC pointed out, it seemed to be my external hardware reverb's S/PDIF connection. I had ordered a new cable for this a few days ago. And sure enough, my Digi002 was not following the clock again, this time skittering all over the place, skipping audio. Swell. I unplugged the S/PDIF cord, and the problem went away. I was literally just about to plug the hardware reverb in through the A/D converters instead when there was a knock on the door. Delivery. The new S/PDIF cables. They work great.

Also with the delivery...it's like Christmas a few weeks early...Primacoustic Recoil Stabilizers. Cool. I ripped open the packages and had the drummer help me put them under my monitors. We fired up the same mix that we had been listening to. Damn. We both looked at each other in amazement. The difference was not subtle. Tighter and deeper bass. Much tighter. Increased imaging. Instantly. It was like an instant monitor upgrade. These things might be expensive for pads, but they're cheaper than upgrading my monitors.

The only thing I sort of did "wrong" today is that I overcompressed the overheads too much for my tastes. They sound fine. But I don't like compressing overheads more than about 4dB or so, and this was closer to 6-8dB. But again, it really does sound fine. I just like to have more leeway. When they were rehearsing their parts and we were getting sounds, I set the compressor, and when they started playing harder, I didn't catch it in time for one of the songs, and this ended up being the best take. I guess I won't need to use a plug-in for that song's overheads!!

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Tomorrow, we are tracking three more songs. This should go well. The rhythm section will not have to play to loops this time. This made it slow going today for a while, although it came out really well. I'm going to have to learn how to use Elastic Time for one of the songs, but somehow apply it to only the first half. I'll figure that out later.

Tomorrow afternoon, my girlfriend comes back from visiting her family on the East Coast. She'll return to people pounding on drums in the living room!! Welcome back!!! Bang Bang!!!!!

Recording went very well on Sunday.

I had a clipboard underneath the snare. This worked really well, reflecting some of the snares back up.

The Heil mics sounded great. Good solid kick from the P40. The drummer thinks it's the best recorded sound he's ever gotten anywhere. I used a Heil P30 for the overhead, but switched it from the FMR RNLA to the RNC in Super Nice Mode.

We ran the bass through an amp and a SansAmp DI simultaneously, and it sounds really really warm and full. I used a Heil P30 for the amp and then ran it through an FMR RNLA.

Super nice, lots of detail on the drums overall. I am definitely going to try and use dynamics as overheads more in the future.

Trash your mac and get a PC! Down with the Pro Tools monopoly! Bill Gates is God!

Oh...hi, guys!

Go take yer meds!

They said the meds were part of the problem. Yes, "they" as in the proverbial "they". In the parlance of our times.

Do you have any milk?

I hope you're having better luck than I am trying to learn Digital Performer on my new MBP. I am making progress but it's super slow going!

It's going well, although not without its little setbacks and quirks.

I figured out Elastic Time...sort of. I had two takes of a song that were at different tempos, and I got them to go at the same tempo by using Elastic Time, which was rather simple. That was my first attempt at ET, too. What I still need to figure out is how to access the Warp Marker thingies so I can edit them. I didn't need to edit them, but I still need to figure that out because sooner or later, I will need to know how to do that!

Dynamics as overheads: So far, the Heil PR30 dynamic mic as the overhead is working out really well. Between that and the AT4060 tube cardioid LDC that I used just four feet in front of the kit but angled away at 90 degrees, I am getting a really awesome, meaty sound on the drums. And I got a little less of the (crappy sounding) living room, but still enough that the drums actually sound good. And the cymbals are not too bright this time, largely because of using a dynamic mic for an overhead and the AT4060, which is not a bright mic. So far, it seems a little easier to mix. And having a bunch of RealTraps MiniTraps and packing blankets really really helped a LOT. You just cannot say enough for trying to acoustically treat anything you record.

And it's also at this point that I have to say that things like Mellowmuse ATA (latency compensation plugin for Pro Tools) is really working like a charm - after I discovered one of its quirks (I think). It did something odd the last time I was working in Pro Tools where when I initially punched up the program, I got no sound. I checked all my connections, then realized that the tracks were firing, but not the Master Buss. I only had the ATA on the Master Buss, so I opened it and re-pinged. After that, I got sound. Strange. Anyway, besides this, the ATA has been working extremely well. No latency at all.

LOL well, you've just pretty much straight-up duplicated the way I record drums at my place! (mini traps around the kit, PR40 on kick, PR30 on OH, sometimes into RNC).

I do often close mic the other drums too, for halibut. Depending on the song, the close mics are sometimes handy to have. But the PR30 is such a solid OH, even in a crappy room, that close mics aren't so necessary.

Glad it's working out for ya!

LOL well, you've just pretty much straight-up duplicated the way I record drums at my place! (mini traps around the kit, PR40 on kick, PR30 on OH, sometimes into RNC).

I've taken a few cues from you, that's for sure. I am also using an LDC in figure-8 for the snare, another idea that I got from one of you. I was already micing the side of the snare (the shell) from about 4-6" out, so I just took the extra step and used an LDC instead of a 421. Nice.

I do often close mic the other drums too, for halibut. Depending on the song, the close mics are sometimes handy to have. But the PR30 is such a solid OH, even in a crappy room, that close mics aren't so necessary. Glad it's working out for ya!

Thanks! I'm sneaking in the close mics in the mix. Drummer likes it that way anyway. But I don't have to lean really heavily on them because the other mics already sound great.

Next time (I'm always restless and wanting to try new things) I may use the AT4051s that I used to use for overheads and try them on the toms. SDCs on the toms sometimes can get you a little more of the toms' tone and character, so I may give that a try next time. The downside is that I'll also pick up more cymbals, so I'll see whether it's a good trade-off or not.

I'm sold on those Heils, though. Those are great mics!!! Thanks again for the tips!!!

Yeah, that'd be me too. I'm way into a 414 in figure 8 on the snare. If you place it with the null sides pointing at the rack tom and hat, you get nice rejection while still picking up enough of the room to get the full character of the snare.

Glad to hear everything's going good for you Ken. Between you and Lee, and everyone else that's raving about them (I see John Paterno is on their website saying good things too) I'm going to have to check out those Heils - especially the PR-30 and PR-40.

They are really great mics. I used a PR30 on the bass cabinet for this and a previous recording session, and it sounded great. Granted, bass cabinets is one of those things where, for whatever reason, I easily get a good sound, so I don't usually find it challenging to do so. But nevertheless, the Heil came through.

Where it really impressed me was on the kick. The PR40 just ruuuules for kick.

Yeah, that'd be me too. I'm way into a 414 in figure 8 on the snare. If you place it with the null sides pointing at the rack tom and hat, you get nice rejection while still picking up enough of the room to get the full character of the snare.

Yes, that's exactly how I placed it - again, from one of your posts!!

I used a Lawson L251 because I don't own a 414. Worked very well, lots of detail, great balanced sound.

Indeed... my favorite kick mic is an RE20, but the Heil seems to sound reeeeeally similar for less $$. It's less bulky too, which is handy especially in live sound situations.

I don't actually own one right now either. But I can usually borrow one from a friend of our drummer's, who has a couple of older C414EB's.

One of these days I'll get one of my own!

I don't actually own one right now either. But I can usually borrow one from a friend of our drummer's, who has a couple of older C414EB's. One of these days I'll get one of my own!

'jeez, I'm really impressed at this plethora of recording info and 'compradre' back slapping of the 'Mutual Admiration Society of soon to be famous Studio Svengali(s)' ... can't wait to hear your names mentioned at the next Grammy/ or lesser Musical Awards programs. You go Boyz,!

...and women.

Note that one of us is a high priestess...

'jeez, I'm really impressed at this plethora of recording info and 'compradre' back slapping of the 'Mutual Admiration Society of soon to be famous Studio Svengali(s)' ... can't wait to hear your names mentioned at the next Grammy/ or lesser Musical Awards programs. You go Boyz,!

Well, apart from the fact that I'm a "Gurl" - did you have a point in there somewhere?

I thought that friends and fellow recording engineers liked to encourage each other, share tips, and help each other. Hence, this forum, for example. I also like to give thanks and acknowledgment to people that help me. Undoubtedly, LUkenskywalker, your post is not sarcastic at all, but a celebration of the camaraderie and helpfulness that exists here.

Right?

Then again, maybe not, given that you wrote this:

http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?p=31660809#post31660809

Ken, I've read about these drum tracks. Do I get to hear an example? I'd like to check em out.