Jump to content

possopo

Members
  • Posts

    70
  • Joined

  • Last visited

possopo's Achievements

Newbie

Newbie (1/14)

2

Reputation

  1. I'm not trying to analyze the song for the sake of analyzing the song (or getting a headache). the idea is to learn certain patterns that I would eventually memorize and recognize when I hear them. and the idea behind this idea is to improve my compositional skills. so far so good, it seems to work. and thanks for the help, it's extremely valuable !
  2. can I say the song modulates back and forth between A and Am (or C) and Bb is a common modulation in Cm from the key of C (something very often used by the Beatles) ?
  3. hi everyone, I'm not sure I'm in the right section here (tell me if you think the Lesson Loft is a better place) but I'm desperately trying to analyze Black Hole Sun (and it's even harder when I'm trying to play it on my instrument as the song is slightly detuned on record) : verse : A / C / G / F#m / F / E / A / G / Bb chorus : F / E / A / G / Bb / F / E / Bb / E here is what I think (it's really muddled due to the fact that I have no idea what the key is) : the song starts in A which I see as a borrowed chord from A major in a song that starts in A dorian (or Em). the next three chords fit A dorian well. the voice leading from F#m to E is quite obvious but this Major chords / major chords / minor chord with bass going down a half step each time confuses me. E seems to be the dominant of A. the G was already there but does it go ? no idea. as for the Bb, hmm... bII ? if someone could help me clear this up, I would be very thankful sidenote : I first posted this in the songwriting worshop because 1001gear told me it was a better a place to find answers but as someone there told me the opposite, I'm back here. I used to post here a few years ago with extremely elaborate answers by JonR but he seems not be reading this forum anymore.
  4. hi everyone, I'm not sure I'm in the right section here (tell me if you think the Lesson Loft is a better place) but I'm desperately trying to analyze Black Hole Sun (and it's even harder when I'm trying to play it on my instrument as the song is slightly detuned on record) : verse : A / C / G / F#m / F / E / A / G / Bb chorus : F / E / A / G / Bb / F / E / Bb / E here is what I think (it's really muddled due to the fact that I have no idea what the key is) : the song starts in A which I see as a borrowed chord from A major in a song that starts in A dorian (or Em). the next three chords fit A dorian well. the voice leading from F#m to E is quite obvious but this Major chords / major chords / minor chord with bass going down a half step each time confuses me. E seems to be the dominant of A. the G was already there but does it go ? no idea. as for the Bb, hmm... bII ? if someone could help me clear this up, I would be very thankful
  5. very nice, thanks a lot ! just a thought, understanding bits of harmony makes me listen to songs in a different way and in this case, when I think of F#dim as a passing chord between D and E (D#dim) with the odd B7 to lure the listener for one second, the listening is different from when I think of it as a ii V I. I didn't think of this I vi ii V split in half. very interesting again !
  6. I'm trying to find a good book that studies harmony in a historical context. do you know any and do you know which section I should post my question in ? a book that answers why we finally decided to use 3rd and not only 5ths (and 4ths), how we came about with scales, the invention of the harmonic minor and then the melodic minor scale, first steps in dissonance, alterations. something that goes all the way to the Middle Ages (or why not ancient greek music) to atonality and serialism. if the book talks about rhythms, instruments, not only art music but also folk (and then blues and rock...) and the relationship between these genres and art music..., microtonality, non-western music, that would be a plus. basically, I'm trying to find a book similar to Alex Ross' The Rest Is Noise but which focus is everything, not only XXth century art music. and maybe something that also goes a little deeper in harmony theory than Alex Ross (who barely scratches the surface of it).
  7. I know little about harmony but I'm not sure I'm missing vital concepts and info. if I do, please tell me, that would be so helpful. I know what a key is, I know quite a few methods to modulate (modal interchange, circle of fourths and fifths...), I know some chord substitutions, I know other tricks (wrong word, yes) such as the andalusian cadence, the neopolitan sixth... I know the use of degrees (sub-dominant, dominant, tonic...), I know relative minors and majors, I understand the basics of alteration, I know secondary dominants... I started playing the guitar a long time ago and my main focus were riffs as I was mostly into Metal. so it took me a while before I got interested in chords and even longer before I started to learn even the most basic parts of harmony. I guess one of my problems is I'm not thinking enough in terms of voice leadings and that's probably because I keep thinking chords all the time, not voices (although in some songs, voice leadings are extremely obvious). I love Jazz but only started trying to understand how Jazz works a very short while ago (and there's a lot to learn) and my background in Classical is very limited and I can't read music. I'm currently working on my ears a lot (intervals, scales, chords...) because I'd like to be able to transcribe songs and my tools for that would be both my ears and some theoretical knowledge. then I'd like to be able write songs and play on instruments something I have in my head (that is still pretty challenging, not the melody but the chords again). so I read about basic harmony and started to transcribe. I get stuck, I find the chords on the Internet and form there, I'm trying to analyse the song harmonically. I also need to know what scale to play on each chord (mode, arpeggio...). and when I'm stuck on harmony, I google around and when I find nothing -or when I can't connect what I found with the specific song I'm working on), I ask (and my first questions on this forum were extremely basic).
  8. last time I asked for harmonic analysis here, Jon R and a few others definitely helped me by giving me super useful answers. what I'm doing is read about harmony, (bits everywhere on the Internet, not a book), then try to analyse songs. when I'm stuck and I can't find answers on the Internet, I'm looking for help. in this case, I tried to google how to use diminished chords in a Rock context, it helps a bit but not enough and I'm still stuck. my mistake was to mix keys and scales. I guess I'm still thinking in terms of scales too much as my first idea is to play solos on songs but it's clearer in my mind than what you think but no, I can't find the link between the D, the F#dim and the B7. I tried a few substitutions but no, it's still blurry. and then, I'd have to find what scale(s) to use over these chords. less difficult but still a little tricky for me. what I don't really get is why the gist of your message is just "you're bad, learn more". that's pointless.
  9. [this is a repost from the theory sub-forum but the guitar sub-forum seems to be getting much much more attention] hi everyone, I'm trying to understand how My Sweet Lord works and these diminished chords jurt my brain. here is the all sequence (but one tone lower than the original for the ease of transcriptions -I'm a guitarist) : Em / A / Em / A D / Bm / D / Bm D / F#dim / B7 Em / A / Em / A D / D7 / B7 / E / G#dim / C#7 / F#m / B and then goes back to the beginning with one tone higher Em, A, D, Bm seem to be in the key of D then F#dim has a C in it. does D major goes to mixolydian ? then B7 has yet another new note, D#... not easy but B7 goes to Em and that makes sense (sub-dominant) but why this choice of a D# that clashed with the former key of D ? D to D7 makes us go from D major to Dmixolydian again... B7 has this odd D# again but is a good sub-dominant and goes to E and then we have G#dim / C#7 / F#m / B which is the same sequence as D / F#dim / B7 / Em / A my main question is : where are these diminished chords coming from and why are they followed by these dom7th ? what is the theory behind that ? it looks a little like a weird ii-V-I but I may be totally wrong. thanks a lot for your help
  10. hi everyone, I'm trying to understand how My Sweet Lord works and these diminished chords jurt my brain. here is the all sequence (but one tone lower than the original for the ease of transcriptions -I'm a guitarist) : Em / A / Em / A D / Bm / D / Bm D / F#dim / B7 Em / A / Em / A D / D7 / B7 / E / G#dim / C#7 / F#m / B and then goes back to the beginning with one tone higher Em, A, D, Bm seem to be in the key of D then F#dim has a C in it. does D major goes to mixolydian ? then B7 has yet another new note, D#... not easy but B7 goes to Em and that makes sense (secondary dominant) but why this choice of a D# that clashed with the former key of D ? D to D7 makes us go from D major to Dmixolydian again... B7 has this odd D# again but is a good secondary dominant and goes to E and then we have G#dim / C#7 / F#m / B which is the same sequence as D / F#dim / B7 / Em / A my main question is : where are these diminished chords coming from and why are they followed by these dom7th ? what is the theory behind that ? it looks a little like a weird ii-V-I but I may be totally wrong. thanks a lot for your help
×
×
  • Create New...