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iGirl

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  1. I'm hoping someone here might know of a reliable way to estimate the value of a vintage instrument - a 1918 Holton Bass Saxophone

     

    It's my husband's, but he hasn't played it since 1999 and bought it decades ago. It plays very well and nothing is broken.

     

    Photos are here - http://photography.karenengel.com/p739852777

     

    I'll look around for some more active saxophone forums, but thought I would try here on HC as I already have an account.

     

    Thanks!


  2. Generalmusic RP-X Piano Module. 80 note polyphony' date=' physically modeled Steinway and Fazioli grand pianos, plus really good Rhodes and Wurlitzer EP's and Clavinet. Several other sounds for layering as well. Hard to find but hard to beat. BTW, I have one I'm not using.[/quote']

     

    Thanks - GEM did go under completely, but was bought up and is now supposedly coming back with reissued products and possibly new ones. Maybe/likely they will put those pianos in a box with a full compliment of other sounds at an attractive price point! Worth looking at in the long run, unless a great deal can be had on the old module.

     

    Still - all that sound design (like others) was done 25+ years ago. I have to think there have been major improvements - like multiple layers of velocity switching and every single note sampled - now that memory isn't so much of a concern... I'm sure that's the case in Virtual Instruments - but unsure who is doing it in hardware boxes.


  3. Hi all - I'm looking for what is considered the "best" hardware* piano sound out there currently in a used module format - (but won't break the bank!)

    If it's a part of, or expansion product to add to a module with many other sounds - that MUCH better.

     

    Here's a starting list with rough estimates of street prices -

    I've not heard anything live in person except the Kurzweil sounds (which may be pretty dated)

     

    Kurzweil Micopiano - $150 and under

    Kurzweil PC2R - $400

     

    Roland SRX-02 Concert Piano expansion board - $150ish

     

    Yamaha Motif ES - $400

    Yamaha PLG150-AP - Acoustic piano expansion board - $250

    • Adds 64 notes of polyphony to the host system dedicated just to these new piano sounds... that's a big bonus!

    Other ideas - or votes for the best one for recording?

     

    *yes, "virtual" pianos may add options, but let's keep this to hardware only for now....

     


  4. I went to try the NP11 today at Best Buy but all they had were sealed boxes. One has to actually buy it in order to try it out I guess. I suppose I could always unbox it in the parking lot, try it and return it on the spot if needed. lol It's $10 more than everywhere else (online) plus $10 more in tax, but maybe worth it to be able to try before you buy?

     

    I saw the video where they highlight the feature that is most important - it has actual red felt. :facepalm:


  5. The K2000S I thought I was going to get fell out so I'm still looking. Probably have to wait until reality sinks in after the holidays and bills arrive - then more will come back on the market. lol

     

    How about the Roland D5? It's seriously retro but then maybe the keyboard is not so springy.

     

    The Yamaha NP11 is still interesting, but I've read some conflicting comments and not sure about the action on it. I do NOT want a piano action. A good soft/light FAST SYNTH action is what I hope to find - one you can do a glissando on and not make your fingers bleed (M-Audio/RadioShack toy keyboards). It's just really hard being in the middle of nowhere USA and not having tried any new keyboards since the 1990s. (EDIT- may be able to go see a NP11 at of all places Best Buy!)

     

    Also ran across a Line 6 KB37 that looks interesting, but 37 keys? :-/


  6. I was looking at these as they are DIRT CHEAP - $5. But read some bits about latency in some user reviews. :-/
    http://www.amazon.com/Cable-Converter-Music-Keyboard-Window/dp/B0017H4EBG

    I only want to use it for one keyboard in OSX Lion with a K2000 or similar.

    The next level up from these jumps to $40+ - so I'm just wondering if the basic cheap generic model will be just fine - or go for the "brand names" instead?

    (I already have a Firewire audio interface, but no MIDI on that one.)


  7. I still see K2000's pretty regularly on Craigslist for around $250-$300. K2500's and K2600's have become a bit rarer, though...

     

    That would be great - to find one. Sadly though - I moved from CA to WV back in March! Guess I just need to be a lot more patient and keep and eye out on CL. I know how fragile the K2000 can be if not packed/shipped exactly right... so while eBay might be an option - it's not the first choice. Chances of getting mine back from my son are zero. LOL He took it with him to Berklee and now is back in CA. It's fully loaded too. Sampling, memory HDD and both sound blocks.

     

    I'm also open to something much simpler however....as long as the action itself is playable. One can always add a K200R/K2500R later.

     

    Thanks!


  8. OK first of all synths jump from 49 keys to 61 keys for the most part. Second for something 61 keys you will need to up your price for new. Third and what I think you are asking? Yes you can find more used synths for $300US+. For you desk that could lessen you choices. Do you have a computer?

     

    Thanks much - yea sorry I mistyped 63 - meant to say 49 wasn't cutting it - 61 was what I would like to find... used. I realize the NEW low end 61s are all going to likely be the same junk as M-Audio unless I'm mistaken.

     

    It doesn't have to be exactly "desktop" but yes, I mentioned USB-MIDI, and the primary use is going to be as a DAW controller... some stand alone function again, is great - but if I have to give all that up to get playability, then so be it!

     

    Another thing really funky about the M-Audio 49i internal piano sound - the higher up one played (notes) the quieter it got. The low end notes were loud OTOH. The sound itself was just OK - about what one would expect on the cheap.


  9. I'm a retired pro, but put all that away years ago - I've owned played and performed with almost all of the classic synths as well as piano, Clavinet, Fender Rhodes, Hammond etc. along the way.

     

    The last synth I had I gave to my sons. K2000 and tons of rack stuff. I liked the K2000's Fatar action. 10+ years later I'm looking to add a desktop keyboard to do some composition. It's not serious so I don't want to spend a ton of money.

     

    I actually bought (online) a M-Audio Keystudio 49i with internal piano sound., USB MIDI, and a USB Audio I/O. It seemed to be a clever thing to do, but the action is horrific. Super cheap plastic, with very high tension springs on it. It's going back.

    I also decided I was running out of keys at 49 - so 63 is probably the way to go.

     

    Now I'm starting to think that under $300 all I'm going to get new, is junk like the M-Audio thing. So now I'm looking at used as well. K2000s were plentiful and cheap some time back, but now they've vanished or I would just buy another one. I still have not seen as powerful of a synth engine to best it.

     

    Any other ideas for playability on the cheap? Something that has a really decent pro action (not necessarily weighted). Internal sounds or controller features are not priority, but only a bonus, as is USB-MIDI....but a MIDI out is pretty important. I just can't handle the Radio Shack/M-Audio keyboards though. What are they selling to these kids???? lol

     

    Thanks in advance for ideas!


  10. UPDATE - it's now fully running great in excellent condition.

     

    The hard question still remains - what's it worth? I want to sell it but don't want to get ripped off - or overcharge someone either. All I ask is a FAIR market price for both sides of the deal. Again, MIDI, Patch 96, 4 Voice - mostly studio use only - never moved without a case so it's in excellent condition.


  11. It's a mature technology and it's a whole lot less expensive than dedicated hardware.


    Today's version of your dream machine is probably the Muse...

     

    I'm sensing that the death of the hardware sampler has happened over the last 10+ years - not totally, but certainly mostly. I saw the Muse, but, yes, the price is crazy - so based on the help and direction from here, for us, the plan is probably to look at a combo of hardware (Maschine/MPC type boxes) and laptop. (Or a "vintage" sampler module that's really cheap might be worth a look as well, but not "up to date" - nothing wrong with being a little retro however!).

     

    Thanks again everyone, almost :facepalm: all helpful constructive responses!


  12. I'm not surprised the the drummers sent you over here. You are truly insulting to them as a group of human beings. You have also made clear that your son is a pretty dim bulb in your eyes. Life must be difficult for him.


    Oh...sorry. I forgot. Your son is the dim witted drummer. But maybe you should think that through again, as well.


    Steve

     

    Nice. So looking for a roadworthy hardware sample player somehow insults all drummers? Maybe my son is learning disabled? But I don't call him names regardless.


  13. Don't be intimidated by computers. Hey, look at me ! I'm a drummer and I use computers !


    Dan

     

    Thanks Dan, Craig and Philter. It's not intimidation - as I said earlier - they are actually easier - but maybe less road worthy. No doubt however, even a lowly $200 PC has way more processing power than any dedicated hardware box.

     

    As a side note - what about saving presets and doing programs changes from a pedal into (keymapping) software in live performance? Surely something does that, but it's not a software feature I ever saw in the 80s-90s.

     

    The Maschine and MPC 500 both also look quite interesting and - you're right - fun!

     

    Thanks.


  14. Sure, but today a "sample player" doesn't have to be a dedicated hardware box. To most people today (particularly the newcomers who don't know that they're playing samples), the term "virtual instrument" is more familiar.

     

    Thanks, but I was hoping for a small hardware box specifically. Setting up a computer for a drum set is possibly easier to work, but not so able to take a beating or go on the road.

     

    The good news is that the hardware and samples are cheaper than they used to be.

     

    I've kind of seen that.

    For a drummer it would be great to make it simple to instantly trigger WAV files direct from a HDD playback box. So it could be anything traditional like TR909 sounds, a full latin kit, or Simmons, or custom recorded(sampled) sounds like Keith Moon, John Bonham, your dog barking. LOL

    Ya - I just described a sampler. ha ha

     

    I'd go right out and get him a K2000R/K2500R but the learning curve is high - I loved it - many rocket scientists did too. ROFL

     

    The bad news is that it's not just a simple box into which you plug a MIDI cable on one end and an amplifier on the other. There are a number of stand-alone sample player applications, but most people use VST (the most common protocol, developed by Steinberg) plug-ins to a digital audio workstation (DAW) program. You probably would call it a "sequencer" and some still do.

     

    I owned (sequencer) Performer, Version 1.0 ha ha - made it all the way with them to DP5 (DAW).

     

    Roland and Alesis (and probably others) make electronic drum sets that have a hardware box with built-in samples that sound mighty good. No computer required.

     

    But you have to buy their kit and can't do anything custom - then it's just a fancy drum machine....maybe with more/better presets. In this case - he's to add electronics on an acoustic set via the KAT head, that's all. OK, I think I'm getting the picture. Thanks again!


  15. Hi guys, apologies for a cross post, but I was redirected to this forum from the Drums area as it's more directed towards technology.

    I've avoided the keyboard player's area deliberately as this query is aimed towards LOW tech - if that's possible.

     

    Having worked in tech and management for major keyboard/sampler/synth and pro audio/MI manufacturers myself for many years (waves to old friends here) - I know most of what is possible - but I'm looking for info on new, lower cost, easier to use developments in hardware sample playback units for beginnners... (again...low tech).

     

    ************************

    I recently gave my 17 year old son a DK10 (I had saved in storage for him) and am hoping to get him into something that will allow loading of samples to a hardware player and assigning them to different note numbers to be able to use with the KAT.

     

    I retired from the music business over 10 years ago and am expert level in electronics/MIDI, but not in touch with what's out there today. In the old days - if you wanted to play samples with a hardware box - you had to have a sampler - period. Is that still the case?

     

    I guess what I'm thinking there *should* be by now, is a simple box one can load WAV or similar into via USB, and individually assign them to trigger on 0-127, in assignable banks of 128 at a time. 128x1 MIDI channel - or 128x16 MIDI channels to get fancier. Of course velocity sensitivity/curves, effects, and velocity switching would be even cooler, but then we're getting deeper into sampler territory.

     

    I could just get him a drum machine - but that's so cookie cutter and closed ended. He barely was able to get the MIDI and audio connections straight. LOL But he's young and will learn.

     

    Thoughts?


  16. I recently gave my 17 year old son a DK10 (I had saved in storage for him) and am hoping to get him into something that will allow loading of samples to a hardware player and assigning them to different note numbers to be able to use with the KAT.

     

    I retired from the music business over 10 years ago and am expert level in electronics/MIDI, but not in touch with what's out there today. In the old days - if you wanted to play samples with a hardware box - you had to have a sampler - period. Is that still the case?

     

    I guess what I'm thinking there *should* be by now, is a simple box one can load WAV or similar into, and individually assign them to trigger on 0-127, in assignable banks of 128 at a time. 128x1 MIDI channel - or 128x16 MIDI channels to get fancier. Of course velocity sensitivity/curves, effects, and velocity switching would be even cooler, but then we're getting deeper into sampler territory.

     

    I could just get him a drum machine - but that's so cookie cutter and closed ended. He barely was able to get the MIDI and audio connections straight. LOL But he's young and will learn.

     

    Thoughts?


  17. You come across as the type of person that has a whirlwind going off inside their head whenever they start to think deeply..



    To you, in your personal opinion perhaps - but why start personal attacks now? :cop: Shall I say how you come across then? Nah.

    The suggestion wasn't whether the source material was MP3 or not.



    Yes it was - quite exactly that - AFTER I clearly stated the source was ANALOG, in my 2nd post. You said this in your 2nd post and cannot backpedal now. Check the thread.
    Only an extremely unqualified person would believe a master would be recorded as an MP3 or CD - AND simultaneously think that those mediums represent an analog source…

    I was 'desperately' trying to ask you what you meant by 'Audio Masters' in a physical sense. I think that's perfectly clear to everyone but you.



    Honestly, I resisted answering something that would be completely obvious to everyone else, but would completely escape someone who thought an MP3 or CD was analog, and used for masters. Analog IN is Analog IN - NOTHING ELSE MATTERS!

    I've just re-read your first post and there is
    NO
    mention of analogue at all. Just Audio Masters (with a thread heading naming them as Stereo Masters).



    Absolutely true - and clarified immediately in my second post, after only your simple one line response/question. Clarified and obvious - to everyone but you.

    It's in your head that either an Audio Master or a Stereo Master has to be on an old bit of magnetic reel to reel tape. This was not originally the case with recordings and isn't generally the case these days.



    It's in reality too - at least for those who haven't been living under a rock. Since it was clearly established the masters were in analog format and the goal was to make them digital - all of "these days" formats would be eliminated as they are all already digital. I'm the one who mentioned "original' formats like cylinders and Gramophones, though most people who recorded in those analog formats would be dead today. Geeee, that only leaves the single most widely used format in the 20th century. Only someone who thinks an MP3 is an analog master recording format wouldn't know this.

    Analogue Source Input
    appears as an oxymoron to me. An analogue source, or simply a source doesn't actually have a use as an input, more likely an output as it's a 'Source'.



    Since we're continuing on this path, it was technically missing a hyphen or slash between Source/Input - or maybe a typo. This would be glaringly obvious to everyone, except you. Also, the only reason "Input" was even stated was as to not further confuse the already deeply confused.

    Also your comment on 2" tapes being analogue not digital can be confusing as magnetic tape can hold digital information meaning that a magnetic tape based machine that records and reads digital information is usually referred to as a digital storage medium or digital recorder.



    Only confusing in the sense that (DASH etc.) reel to reel digital multi-track tape machines were not often easily found in 2", but far more common other size tape widths. Make no mistake however - digital reel to reel tape machines are/were something entirely different that analog/magnetic reel to reel. The clarification of "magnetic" was only to keep any discussion of reel to reel tape within the realm of analog, and not give opportunity for introducing off topic comments and confusion. At least for most.

    No point in continuing this. If a moderator is looking in, I think it would be reasonable to delete this thread as it has no merit.

    Cheers!


  18. Ok, that was fun - but enough goofing around. I'll sincerely apologize and likewise also forgive the patronizing comments. :)

    Sources are reel to reel analog tape masters of varying sizes 1/4" to 1" -

    I think the obsession with the trees (input source) has occluded the forest (output/goals) in this thread, and it got way out of hand. Vastly different nomenclature added to this. The bits about the Lucid and Apogee boxes are very good information however. I'm still unconvinced about DP being right for doing a simple stereo recording however - at least from the perspective of easily accessing the DP formatted files ever again at some point in the future, if needed. Yes, now - export them to AIFF (whatever, and be done). No, future - try opening an OS9 DP3 file from a SCSI drive using a new Intel OSX 10.6xx Mac. OK, yes, Moore's Law in affect.

    I do have to wonder how one analog source input would make any difference from another however? Let's say these were cylinder recordings. Gramophone records. What if it were 2" tapes? (Magnetic, not digital) All still analog. Trees or forest? Maybe this should only be rhetorical and go unanswered as to not go there again.

    Also, adding to the whole misunderstanding on terminology - I do hope you can understand my absolute frustration with suggestions of MP3s (or even CDs) being somehow, analog, and seriously used for master recordings? :eek: What was I to think of that? :facepalm: What would you think? :confused: Forgive and forget it. Thanks!


  19. A stereo master is usually from a stereo mixdown or more commonly from the mastering house and NOT something that only DJ's or Techno Dudes (whatever that is
    :confused:
    ) do.



    This is getting comical. I didn't say DJ/Techno guys do stereo masters! LOL

    Now, however we're starting to understand what a master is - with the dictionary link to look it up.

    I DID say DJ/Techno guys do MIXDOWNS. Do look THAT one up in the dictionary. Two things come up - 1. Techno (etc.) and 2. The act of mixing multiple tracks down to a final product.

    If one uses 2 as a definition - it's about like calling an auto assembly line - a car. The act of doing something is not the final product....the act is only the process. One might consider this splitting hairs - but when the language also gives other definitions to that term - and there seems no apparent knowledge of what an analog audio stereo master actually is - it's pointless to go any further in a one way dialog.

    You have these stereo masters of yours but haven't mentioned what they are.
    That's all I want
    .



    HA! Only HERE!
    "Format - AS STATED - Analog! CDs are not analog."
    "Audio - as in not digitally formatted = from an analog source"


    Your trying to tell me what a Stereo Master means but you HAVE to actually describe what they actually are at the moment, What are they? Vinyl records? Analogue tape masters what????? ADAT Tapes, DVD Audio. Could be absolutely anything



    Also mentioned before was MP3.
    Of the 5 now mentioned - how many are analog?
    Do we even know what analog is? Assuming yes - deduce from that, which analog medium would have been used sometime within the lifetime of someone still alive, and you'll have the answer. :thu:

    NONE of this matters though, unless one doesn't even know what analog is. The source is irrelevant. Already HAVE analog IN and Firewire OUT on the 828.

    DP does NOT mixdown to a proprietary format. It will save a session in a proprietary format but it can mix down to the normal AIFF or WAVE files which are a standard format.



    There we go with that "mixdown" term again - but forget that -
    I already KNOW this - one only had to read the original post!

    "DP5 is way overkill and saves in outdated proprietary formats etc. - yes you can export but the whole thing is a PITA and I'm not even sure if old software like that will run in Snow. "

    Lets make it reeeeeaaaaaaally simple -
    Stereo Analog IN
    Record in 24/96 Digital
    Digital OUT - for archive/playback files AIFF etc.

    FWIW, I've owned Performer ever since version 1. I've worked on the tech and marketing sides for several high end recording products manufacturers and premium synthesiser manufacturer. My masters need archiving for my publishing company, as I have titles and placements in film etc.


  20. what?
    :idk:
    you can feed most anything into a mac/pc with the correct interface/plug..what?



    I'm not talking about junk interfaces like Behringer, Alesis, Tascam etc. Or the junk software that goes with them.

    Besides I already mentioned OWNING a MOTU 828 Firewire! With the right software that will see it properly, it's quite good.


  21. Your confusing me..
    :wave:
    You mean stereo mix downs? The 'end product stereo mixdowns'?

    What format are these 'Stereo Masters' in? Are they on an old tape, CD..?!?

    I think i'm confused with your terminology...
    :confused:
    Mp3 files?!?
    :p



    A "mixdown" is something a DJ or techno guy does. So NO.

    See - 5b - http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/master

    Format - AS STATED - Analog! CDs are not analog.

    What's an MP3 file? That term confuses me... LOLOL JK - Masters is a term used by audio pros - I can't think of any other way to say it. Maybe it's different in the UK, but I worked for 30 years in the business and never heard them called anything else.

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