Members jhall Posted March 20, 2010 Members Share Posted March 20, 2010 I also have zero problem with Bugera-Behringer. The way I see it, the {censored} git way out of hand expensive. This is a bit of blow back on the part of the Musical Instrument industry. Things are resetting. Also there's only so much jiggering you can do with a tube amp circut, These new V-series amps are really unique. They have an obvious cosmetic resembelence to Matchless though. Most amps to me look suprizingly like black face fenders or Peavey 5150s on the low cost market. Most of them also sound like ass compared to the V-Series amps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jhall Posted March 20, 2010 Members Share Posted March 20, 2010 OOPS, you are looking at this one. Cool amp. Ignore my earlier post. I think that early Bugeras had some problems. That sher's purty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members steve_man Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 I've been playing for 20+ years and have gone through quite a few tube amps including palominos. I've played through quite a few more. The bugera is a great sounding amp no matter how long you've been playing. As for the palomino comment....just...lol. The palominos are great amps and are widely recognized as being such. I have two, a head and a combo and have no intention of getting rid of them. I like my palominos (and my bugera) better than a lot of much more expensive amps like mesas and marshalls. After 20+ years I'd say that my ear is pretty well developed and I like the palomino and bugera's tones more than a lot of expensive amps...so to the OP I'd say take opinions for what they are...opinions. lol all you want. My palomino sounded great to my ears when I bought it, but the longer I had it, the less I liked it. And yes, mine was a US made model with a celestion. The truth was, it just was not made very well. The tubes rattled something awful, and after all the attempted fixes...coupled with the enormous amounts of heat it put out, I just had enough. That, coupled with the fact that I bought a Hot Rod Deluxe...which had WORLDS better tone...I sold the Palomino. Looked nice, but just did not measure up both in tone and build quality (compenents, etc.) to my Fender...so it was sold off. I compared the V22 to other amps from several brands, including Fender, Marshall, and Vox. IN MY OPINION...that is all, just my opinion...all three of the others blew it away in tone, user-friendliness, component quality, speakers, etc. Yes, the others cost more, but I wouldn't put a Haze, AC15, and a Superchamp XD anywhere near the "expensive" category.We are clearly gonna disagree on the Bugera stuff...I obviously do not care for it...you obviously love it. That's fine. I posted my opinion, you post yours...let the OP make the decision... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ashasha Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 I've got no problems with Behringer stuff; I own a few things they make and am pretty happy with it. But I have heard an awful lot of problems about the Bugeras failing within a few months. That to me says that it's a design or manufacturing issue and I'd probably wait a while to see if they got them straightened out for sure. I know that stuff breaks and wears out and all kinds of stuff, but what's the point in saving $300 when it breaks, it's out of warranty and now you have to replace it or pay to have it repaired. Like I said, nothing against Behringer or other 'less costly alternatives', but I'd really consider this purchase long and hard....and perhaps buy an extended warranty or try to get them to throw it in for free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Orange Jackson Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 Only thing I have heard bad on the V22 is the 'out of the blue channel switching,' and that was due to the footswitch, I think/iirc. Fix with different foot switch. 2xingpete had some crap tubes as well, but that is an easy fix. I don't really have a dog in the fight, I can say that the Stock Bugera V5 kicks all types of ass and they are basically giving the thing away for free. I've used and abused it everyday for the last month with no issues, ..so far, ..touch wood. Is that smoke I smell?1?! Just kidding. If I needed a bigger amp, I would be all over the V22. @guitarman3001I played the V5 today with a 1x12 cab (Celestion GT-1275) and had good results, it pushed the 75 watt Celesion well actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Special J Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 I don't care how well made an amp is, if it doesn't sound good to me it's worthless. I'd rather pay 300 bucks for an amp that's built just ok but sounds great and is very versatile than pay 1200 bucks for an amp that's built like a tank but sounds like ass. Then again, that's just me...... Yeah, see, I'm one of those weirdos that expects his electronics to work past the warranty period, and have his hard earned money ($300 or $1200) go towards something of lasting value. Toasters, computers, refrigerators, TV's, whatever. I like amps that both sound great and are reliable and well built with quality components. I'd rather spend a little extra or buy used and get something that will last me forever, maybe even get passed down through the family, or even get sold for a reasonable resale value, not something that's going to take up landfill space after a year of playing it. Perhaps our young OP has not yet bought into rampant consumerism of cheap disposable goods, and will do some real research on the products available to him. That's all I was suggesting, or hoping. Then, if he finds Bugera is the best option, then more power to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members trashedlostfdup Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 I think that early Bugeras had some problems. true, but the Vox AC amps arent exactly the most reliable platform from what i have heard/read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jhall Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 Yeah, see, I'm one of those weirdos that expects his electronics to work past the warranty period, and have his hard earned money ($300 or $1200) go towards something of lasting value. Toasters, computers, refrigerators, TV's, whatever. I like amps that both sound great and are reliable and well built with quality components. I'd rather spend a little extra or buy used and get something that will last me forever, maybe even get passed down through the family, or even get sold for a reasonable resale value, not something that's going to take up landfill space after a year of playing it. Perhaps our young OP has not yet bought into rampant consumerism of cheap disposable goods, and will do some real research on the products available to him. That's all I was suggesting, or hoping. Then, if he finds Bugera is the best option, then more power to him. Point taken. And it is a valid one.As for my comment about gladly buying a new one every year: That was meant more as a compliment to the sound of the amp. I'd hope the thing lasts a good long time. I do have two Yamaha G-100 212-IIs that I've had since 1983 that for 15 or so years I used a {censored} ton. They've got PCBs (and probably not as modern as the newer ones) and they never broke. I will freely admit that my 1960s era Bassmans and my 1972 Twin reverb have been bullet proof all these years. But when you account for inflation that Twin would cost $4,500.00 in todays dollars so that's getting beyond Soldano money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members photon9 Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 I will freely admit that my 1960s era Bassmans and my 1972 Twin reverb have been bullet proof all these years. But when you account for inflation that Twin would cost $4,500.00 in todays dollars so that's getting beyond Soldano money. Tangent alert!My '72 SFTR is definitely my favorite amp! I feel really fortunate to have it especially at the price I picked it up for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Special J Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 Yeah, and I didn't mean to imply that price is always an indicator of reliability. Expensive stuff fails miserably sometimes as well. My best friend had a JCM900 that spent more of it's life in the shop than it did getting played. On the other side of the spectrum, I've had some cheap Peaveys and Fenders that had no reason to still be alive after the abuse I put them through. They just kept on going like the energizer bunny, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members photon9 Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 Yeah, and I didn't mean to imply that price is always an indicator of reliability. Expensive stuff fails miserably sometimes as well. My best friend had a JCM900 that spent more of it's life in the shop than it did getting played. On the other side of the spectrum, I've had some cheap Peaveys and Fenders that had no reason to still be alive after the abuse I put them through. They just kept on going like the energizer bunny, though. Peavey = most underrated guitar/amp company ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mistersully Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 Yeah, I mean for a first tube amp it probably wouldn't be too bad. I think it's probably kinda like a Crate Palomino...tones are pretty good...until you really experience a better amp, and/or your ear develops a bit and you begin to really know what type of sound you want out of an amp. this from a guy who was singing the praises of marshall mgs not long ago you'll sell your ac15 within 6 months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PlectrumPete Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 Get a Laney! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jhall Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 Get a Laney! Had an AOR Pro Tube Lead 50 for a few years. Good amp. Wasn't without it's minor problems but was deffinately a great sounding amp both clean crunch and JCM800 on steroids to boot. Took well to good rack equipment and stomps too. V very under the radar amp that can usually still be had for short dime. I'd still take the V-22 over it for the sound I'm going for though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jhall Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 Also If I were a touring guitarist I'd see if my Bugeras could be "bullet proofed". This is common practice with most amps that will need to withstand the rigors of the road. Most hired guns that are fortunate to make decent money have their techs do whatever's needed to limit the occurance of failure. With the V-22 or 55 for that matter, I could see drilling a couple vent holes into the top of the cab and sticking a couple of those round louvered soffit vents in there to allow some heat to dissapate through the top. Honestly the tube grommets seem to be quite tough and secure as is. I'd also silicone down any suspect caps and rattely loosies that I could spot. And perhaps just make a pretty shiney red oak cabinet for it and not chance having the MDF one fall apart on me. To me the amp sounds good enough to be worth the effort. In fact I could see a market for this service if these amps cach on well and prove to be otherwise reliable. Bugera could even consider making an "artisan series" that for a few hundred more could be built this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members unworthy Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 Behringer earned their reputation in the Live Sound and Recording arenas. The general consensus has always been that their gear works great...as long as it works. It seemed that there were lots of failures in the 30-90 day window; too late to return to the seller and good luck to you actually getting warranty service. I have a Behringer Digital EQ that works great and has never been a problem, but I would hesitate to put my faith in something so mission-critical as a guitar amp. D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 lol all you want. My palomino sounded great to my ears when I bought it, but the longer I had it, the less I liked it. And yes, mine was a US made model with a celestion. The truth was, it just was not made very well. The tubes rattled something awful, and after all the attempted fixes...coupled with the enormous amounts of heat it put out, I just had enough. That, coupled with the fact that I bought a Hot Rod Deluxe...which had WORLDS better tone...I sold the Palomino. Looked nice, but just did not measure up both in tone and build quality (compenents, etc.) to my Fender...so it was sold off. I compared the V22 to other amps from several brands, including Fender, Marshall, and Vox. IN MY OPINION...that is all, just my opinion...all three of the others blew it away in tone, user-friendliness, component quality, speakers, etc. Yes, the others cost more, but I wouldn't put a Haze, AC15, and a Superchamp XD anywhere near the "expensive" category. We are clearly gonna disagree on the Bugera stuff...I obviously do not care for it...you obviously love it. That's fine. I posted my opinion, you post yours...let the OP make the decision... you are definitely in the minority with your opinions about the palomino. They are highly regarded as being great amps even by the corksniffer crowd. The problems you mentioned like heat and tube rattle are very common among pretty much every tube combo. When you put an amp filled with tubes and other components in the same cabinet as a speaker that's causing all kinds of vibrations, you're bound to get something rattling in there. And yeah, they run hot...so what? It's a tube amp. That's what they do. I had more problems with my peavey classic 30 which is regarded as a rock solid amp than I ever have with my palominos. As for the bugeras, the only negative opinions people seem to have of them is because of the undeserved bias some people have (you included, as you admitted on another thread) against all things behringer. They're worried about the reliability and long term durability of them. If you don't like the tone that's one thing but to write them off as pieces of crap is an undeserved criticism, at least at this point in time. If in a couple of years they all start falling apart and catching fire and breaking down, then I'll be the first one to grab my pitchfork and start trashing them for being crap but right now, they haven't been around long enough to say one way or another. But even the corksniffer crowd seems to agree that the bugera V22 at least has great tone. They may be a bit put off by the inexpensive price or by their inherent bias against behringer but the number of people who don't like its tone is definitely the minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members buddhapaugh Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 I own both a Palomino---USA Made combo---and have just picked up a Bugera V55HD.... have owned Laneys, still own a Marshall and Mesa Boogie amp.... have also played and owned numerous Peavey tube amps.... Traynors and Carvins and while playing the V55HD at rehearsal our friend who has hung out and watched us play for nearly 5 years said it was the "best sounding amp" he has heard me play on. He doesn't know one amp from another in terms of manufacturer or quality or price. He just has ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members buddhapaugh Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 For the record---my V55HD has the random reverb-switching problem..... reverb will randomly go off and on when the amp gets hot and warmed up. It sounds so good though I don't want to send it back. Do I just replace the footswitch or is it an internal-switching issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stewiesguitar Posted March 21, 2010 Author Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 well are there any other suggestions that i should check out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stewiesguitar Posted March 21, 2010 Author Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 im just wondering, can you hook up the V22 to a cab? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jhall Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 im just wondering, can you hook up the V22 to a cab? I hooked up my V-22 to my 1970s Marshall 4x12 and ran the amp at 16 ohms. It was at that point that I plugged in my Tele and realised I was playing through possibly the best amp I ever had. I wailed on that ting for 2 hours straight with all volumes at 7 and gain where ever I wanted based on crunch. That amp just sang and moaned and cried and screamed. I was just marveling at the clean channel and was overwhelmed by how the gain side worked with that Tele ( an MIM with the stock bridge pu and a vintage noisless neck). Just the sound to die for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 im just wondering, can you hook up the V22 to a cab? yep. It hast two speaker out jacks. One is used by the internal speaker and you have one left over. I've been using mine with a mesa 1x12 cab. I've also used it with a marshall 4x10. You can also unplug the internal speaker and use that jack for another cab. So, if you wanted to you could actually bypass the V22's speaker and use the amp as a head to power two separate cabs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stewiesguitar Posted March 21, 2010 Author Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 im wondering now, if a 4x12 cab has speaker that run at 4ohms, would you set it up at 4 ohms or 16 ohms? im pretty new at this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted March 21, 2010 Members Share Posted March 21, 2010 For the record---my V55HD has the random reverb-switching problem..... reverb will randomly go off and on when the amp gets hot and warmed up.It sounds so good though I don't want to send it back. Do I just replace the footswitch or is it an internal-switching issue? from what I've read, they've narrowed the problem down to a small voltage regulator that's out of spec and switches off before it reaches the temperature it's supposed to be rated at. http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showpost.php?p=7861028&postcount=243 http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showpost.php?p=7949034&postcount=337 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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