Members stillakid Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 Well some of us who have real jobs:poke:http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/music/article3261591.ece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 What does this have to do with music publishers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members uzybear Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 WE win? are you sure you're in the right forum?> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Volitan Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 YES! STEALING MUSIC IS AWESOME!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dean Roddey Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 Thank you for allowing me not to be the curmudgeon in at least one thread :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Standard8 Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 "The service has been endorsed by the very same record companies - including EMI, Universal Music and Warner Music – that have chased file-sharers through the courts in a doomed attempt to prevent piracy. The gamble is that fans will put up with a limited amount of advertising around the Qtrax website’s jukebox in return for authorised use of almost every song available." Just like I said... PEPSI LOGOS et cetera. It's finally happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lee Flier Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 Did you actually read that article? The big record companies are the ones who will make money off you using this service. I don't think that reasonable people who've been critical of record labels want to see them just stop making money. In fact, as far as some of us are concerned, their downfall has been that they didn't get onboard with downloading when it started. They could've come up with legal models that worked, and still made money, but instead they've tried to cling to a model that won't work anymore and use draconian measures against fans to enforce it. Now they are finally offering a legal model by which they and the artists can still make money and track downloads, and the fans get to search for songs and download the ones they like, as they have become used to. So yes, in that sense, "we win." Too bad the labels are probably 10 years too late in getting on the bandwagon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thedolaon Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 IMO! I dont think we (the collective people) have won yet. The day we "win" is when radio is dead and any artist can play on the radio regardless if you're already famous or a myspace 'superstar' (haha, that thread). The labels and record companies are still getting that cut and not all of it is going to artist. So yea...i'll buy DIRECTLY from an artist at their shows until this happens. Which this means that seeing a band/artist live is going to be even more profitable!!!! Expect to see people on the road! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lee Flier Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 The labels and record companies are still getting that cut and not all of it is going to artist. Are you in favor of musicians making a living from their music? If so, then I have news for you: SOMEBODY is always going to be taking a sizable cut of an artist's work. Whether that person or company is a record label, a promoter, publicist, manager, producer, or whoever. Almost nobody "makes it" without help, and the help needs to be paid. Granted, we've been paying the help way too much, and their tastes are questionable. But if you think radio would be better off if "anybody could get on" - it wouldn't. It'd be no better than MySpace in terms of the chances of any given artist being heard enough to make a living. I'm not talking "superstar" status, just enough to make a comfortable middle class living touring and making records. That doesn't "just happen" without some good old-fashioned promotional muscle behind it, and those people are going to get a cut. They don't have to be bad people, and it doesn't have to be an excessive cut. But artists don't succeed in getting out of the basement without some business help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members leftystratman Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 The day we "win" is when radio is dead and any artist can play on the radio regardless if you're already famous or a myspace 'superstar' (haha, that thread). I think radio IS dead now, no one chooses to listen to the radio these days, at least not the people I know. this means less money to be made through music, but so what? everyone gets a fair shot at success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Poker99 Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 It won't work DRM is crap. People won't want to listen to ads, they want it free without ads. Its OVER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sabriel9v Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 Are you in favor of musicians making a living from their music? If so, then I have news for you: SOMEBODY is always going to be taking a sizable cut of an artist's work. Whether that person or company is a record label, a promoter, publicist, manager, producer, or whoever. Almost nobody "makes it" without help, and the help needs to be paid. Granted, we've been paying the help way too much, and their tastes are questionable. But if you think radio would be better off if "anybody could get on" - it wouldn't. It'd be no better than MySpace in terms of the chances of any given artist being heard enough to make a living. I'm not talking "superstar" status, just enough to make a comfortable middle class living touring and making records. That doesn't "just happen" without some good old-fashioned promotional muscle behind it, and those people are going to get a cut. They don't have to be bad people, and it doesn't have to be an excessive cut. But artists don't succeed in getting out of the basement without some business help. I agree with you. I feel artists will always need external help in the form of business minded and oriented individuals in order to take things to the next level. However, I'm at the point now where I don't know if I care about the downloading or file-sharing...of anybody's music. Whether they're huge superstars or smaller level indie DIY pions. And this is going to sound even more pessimistic, nobody gives a damn until you're famous or on the verge of breaking into fame. I've become an advocate of the t-shirt release party and not the cd release party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members HCarlH Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 Socialism has won! It's nice to share! Now, I want FREE food and a FREE house on Newport Beach paid for by Dubya and his fat cat friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thedolaon Posted January 28, 2008 Members Share Posted January 28, 2008 I guess my statement was only a half of what i wanted to say. sorry lol. Musicians will always need help, but i was kinda talking about what Croakus was saying about being taken advantage of and I just like the fact of giving a band/artist my money directly (hoping it does go to band needs lol) so they get where they need to go. And i just thought of something, unless the band wants to do EVERYTHING. Booking, promotion (which could be hard), management, they can do it. Now if it gets to the point of overwelming(sp)...give the job to a friend or something. Keeps cost down (just an ex) Yea. No one listens to the radio anyway, but i meant All of what i said as a way of saying that it's now fair game. Basically, that was my point. sorry if i was misunderstood. However, I'm at the point now where I don't know if I care about the downloading or file-sharing...of anybody's music. Whether they're huge superstars or smaller level indie DIY pions. And this is going to sound even more pessimistic, nobody gives a damn until you're famous or on the verge of breaking into fame. No f'n kidding. And this scares me too. lol. and I really like music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Standard8 Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 If I'm on CNN or FOX .com or espn, and I see a story I'm interested in, and I click on the video, and I see a Nike commercial pop up, I close the window. I suspect people will do the same thing with music. Sometimes, if I'm really really interested, I'll sit through the commercial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sabriel9v Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 I guess my statement was only a half of what i wanted to say. sorry lol.Musicians will always need help, but i was kinda talking about what Croakus was saying about being taken advantage of and I just like the fact of giving a band/artist my money directly (hoping it does go to band needs lol) so they get where they need to go.And i just thought of something, unless the band wants to do EVERYTHING. Booking, promotion (which could be hard), management, they can do it. Now if it gets to the point of overwelming(sp)...give the job to a friend or something. Keeps cost down (just an ex)Yea. No one listens to the radio anyway, but i meant All of what i said as a way of saying that it's now fair game. Basically, that was my point. sorry if i was misunderstood.No f'n kidding. And this scares me too. lol. and I really like music. All pessimism aside, I suppose what I was trying to say is that if you're not in it for the love, it will show, especially now. Honestly, when I'm planning on booking regional and national tours, I dont want to do it all myself. That's a lot of hard work and you're not guaranteed that all the pieces will be in the right place...or even close to the right place. I have no qualms with giving some of my money to a booking agent or a manager who can push my material to bigger power figures. Sometimes you need both of those components just to live comfortably and pay bills as a musician. But when it comes to downloading and file-sharing, it seems as if people have very little incentive to pay for any of your material unless there is a strong buzz surrounding you. You don't necessarily have to be Mr. Huge Rock Star, but having a name for yourself locally or regionally helps. Otherwise, hardly anybody is going to value your art. So condemning downloading as a sin can ultimately hurt you if you don't embrace it in small quantities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members metalmonkey Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 its a step forward at least, in the end it was always going to happen that record companies were to allow people to have free musici suspected advertising would have something to do with the way they were going to get money from it there'll be more developments to come in the next X amount of years and hopefully a compromise will be met but doesn't this make the music industry more or less a 'charity' industry, where all the funds are coming from other businesses in other industries giving them money to live off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twohands Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 All of this as an artist is something we knew was coming. There will however be people who will still buy an album. So we have to make them really good. The one thing I'm absolutely positive about, is that people will always want to see live music. There is something special about it and shows, at least for the near future will be valued. Touring and merch is where a lot of the money is right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dean Roddey Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 Will some band finally take the final step and never release any of their music at all and only play live and carefully prevent any recording of their live performances? I still think we ought to start a grass roots movement to have a music moratorium some time later this year, where all musicians actively speak out against the theft of their product and don't release any new music for a few months, to get people to understand that their rationalization that it's just stealing from big mega-corps is a convenient lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sabriel9v Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 Will some band finally take the final step and never release any of their music at all and only play live and carefully prevent any recording of their live performances? I still think we ought to start a grass roots movement to have a music moratorium some time later this year, where all musicians actively speak out against the theft of their product and don't release any new music for a few months, to get people to understand that their rationalization that it's just stealing from big mega-corps is a convenient lie. I would advocate such a moratorium after I've decided to place the wool over my own eyes...or better yet a thick plastic bag over my head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dean Roddey Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 Why shouldn't the people who are being stolen from make it clear to the people who are stealing (many of whom justify it as being nothing more than stealing from fat cat corporate people) that the theft is hurting the people who make the music? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twohands Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 Why shouldn't the people who are being stolen from make it clear to the people who are stealing (many of whom justify it as being nothing more than stealing from fat cat corporate people) that the theft is hurting the people who make the music? Because the 13-16 year olds really don't care. Remember Metallica and Lars getting involved in the napster case? Who turned out to look like the greedy villain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dean Roddey Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 There is such a thing as standing up for your rights, even if it costs you in the short term. If all musicians did it, it would be harder to ignore and act like they were all greedy villains. And even if it only got the real attention of the 17 and up crowd, that would be something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jlantsberger Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 but doesn't this make the music industry more or less a 'charity' industry, where all the funds are coming from other businesses in other industries giving them money to live off? No different than televsion, at least before TV DVDs started to hit. It's possibly to make a living off of advertising revenues, though I doubt whether this service will actually work if they manage to get the labels to back them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sabriel9v Posted January 29, 2008 Members Share Posted January 29, 2008 Why shouldn't the people who are being stolen from make it clear to the people who are stealing (many of whom justify it as being nothing more than stealing from fat cat corporate people) that the theft is hurting the people who make the music? You can't blame technology for your problems. You just have to embrace it. If you want to pick a beef with somebody, stand outside of Apple's business offices and picket them. Otherwise, hardly anyone else is going to take notice. You have to get out there and make a name for yourself. Brand yourself and give your product intrinsic value. If you don't, you really can't expect anyone to go out there and buy your album without second thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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