Members GilmourD Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 Yeah, those are more recent models though (well after Leo). Up till the 80s they rocked 21 frets. Yeah, but it didn't change the pickup placement AT ALL whether a Fender has 21 or 22 frets. Either way, the pole pieces are centered where the 24th fret would be. THAT is why 24 fret necks require that the neck pickup move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GilmourD Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 You'll notice, though, that when Leo designed the Jaguar neck, and no longer was bound by backwards compatibility, he made a 22-fret 24" scale neck, no overhang. I think if he could go back and redo everything, he would have made all his necks 22-fret necks without overhang and made them sit deeper in the body. You mean like Leo did with MusicMan and G&L? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jkater Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 I reeeeeally don't want to know what Leo counted for #21. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members straycat113 Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 I can live without 24 but 22 is a must, it kills me that my 85 62 reissue Tele that I modded with Dimarzzio Fast tracks and medium Jumbo frets 20 years ago only has 21 frets. It was my main ax for 13 years before going to a Strat and then an EBMM EVH and Axis. Now whenever I feel like playing it and pull it out that one fret is a killer, as I have to compensate and bend a half step or a step and a half on so many songs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mrperson Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 Honestly I can live with 20 frets or even 19. I practice mainly on my acoustic which has not cutaway so a lot of my vocabulary is based around the 7th-10th fret area - this means I can go higher and go then go lower. In all fairness most musicians I play with tend to wince at the high notes past the 17th fret. Unless your playing some widdly stuff or you're playing a crazy improvisation I don't feel the need for any more than 21 frets - granted both my electrics I have now have 22 frets, I never use that fret though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cephus Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 My fingers are too big to squeeze in between those high frets anyway. My main guitar was a 22 fret kramer in the 80s and I liked how I could push the high D up to E. But, I like pushing the C# up to D more now. I absolutely have never wished for more frets for anything I was playing. I will say that I like the aesthetics of trush rod adjustment at the heel rather than the peghead end. The overhanging 22 fret makes that about impossible without taking the neck off. But, then again, I don't think I can reach it on my 21-fret 62 RI either. So, I guess we're back to tradition. I evidently like the quaintness of a neck that stops on a weird note like C#. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ugameus Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 Exactly. The only real difference the 22-fret overhang makes is in pickguard removal. Easy-peasy on 21-fret necks, distinctly more troublesome on 22-fret necks. This. I wish I didn't have overhang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angry Tele Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 I kind of wish Leo went with 19 frets on the Jaguar, its bad enough the scale is short but then add a fret? People will say "oh its not big deal" but it is to me. I played my Jag everyday for like 2 years and the minute I got my Tele I never played it again. Its not so much Jag neck was bad but Tele/Jazz is soooo much better. 25.5"/21 frets=perfection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 How would having fewer frets make a Jag better for you? Nobody's forcing you to play the high frets. And please stop making it sound like 24" is that short. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angry Tele Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 adding the fret just compounds the scale difference. Its already 1.5" shorter if you take a fret or 2 away you can spread out the difference so that it would be almost impercievable...but Of course then everyone(including me) would complain if it only had 19 frets. I dont mind Gibson 24.75 scale on Gibsons... On Fender 25.5 just feels right. I agree 24" isnt short but more that 25.5 is long. How would having fewer frets make a Jag better for you? Nobody's forcing you to play the high frets.And please stop making it sound like 24" is that short. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GilmourD Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 adding the fret just compounds the scale difference. Its already 1.5" shorter if you take a fret or 2 away you can spread out the difference so that it would be almost impercievable...but Of course then everyone(including me) would complain if it only had 19 frets.I dont mind Gibson 24.75 scale on Gibsons... On Fender 25.5 just feels right. I agree 24" isnt short but more that 25.5 is long. The number of frets doesn't change the scale. You could have 31 frets and still have it be a 25.5" scale. It's just going to affect pickup placement. If you removed frets and spread the frets out over the existing neck, you'd either be screwing up intonation horribly or you'd need to move the bridge further from the neck. Again, number of frets has nothing to do with scale length. Scale length determines the distance from the nut to the bridge saddles and the spacing of the frets. If you took the existing Jaguar and it only had 19 frets, you'd have some empty space at the end of the fretboard. OR, you could shorten the neck, but then you'd have to move the neck joint up OR move the bridge further towards the edge of the body. If you want a 24 inch scale, there will always be 12 inches from the nut to the 12th fret. If you want a 25.5" scale, there will always be 12.75 inches from the nut to the 12th fret. 19, 21, 22, 24, or 31 frets will not affect that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 adding the fret just compounds the scale difference. Its already 1.5" shorter if you take a fret or 2 away you can spread out the difference so that it would be almost impercievable...but Of course then everyone(including me) would complain if it only had 19 frets.I dont mind Gibson 24.75 scale on Gibsons... On Fender 25.5 just feels right. I agree 24" isnt short but more that 25.5 is long.That doesn't work like that. Each fret is at the same distance from the nut, no longer how many total frets you have. Try this calculator out some time: http://www.stewmac.com/fretcalc.php It will tell you exactly where each fret needs to be and the distance between frets. And once again, I always say this, but 24" means that compared to a 25.5", you always feel like you're playing one fret higher. It makes your 7th fret feel like the 6th fret on a Strat. It's really not that uncomfortable as you make it sound like, and it makes a lot of notes easier to play. Where it gets a little tough is that 22nd fret section, where you only get .400" between frets If you like playing high, recently I've been enjoying my 27" scale a lot because that gives you a 0.450" distance from 21st to 22nd fret, it makes me feel like I'm playing two frets lower, plus I have a neck through so there's no heel either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Furtive Posted April 29, 2011 Members Share Posted April 29, 2011 If you absolutely require the 22nd fret to play, you could stand a few more lessons. Don't argue with me, argue with Jimmy Bryant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angry Tele Posted April 30, 2011 Members Share Posted April 30, 2011 ok yeah I know or realize that scale length isnt related to neck length...But the bottom line for me is that I dont like 24". Its not that bad but I just prefer 25.5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted April 30, 2011 Members Share Posted April 30, 2011 25.5" is not a bad thing, it's good all around, but I think 27" is better for treble/high leads and 24 is better for strictly rhythm. I think 24.75" is good for all kinds of riffing as well. Having all four scales is nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lefchr Posted April 30, 2011 Members Share Posted April 30, 2011 I never feel like I am missing out playing my strat with 21 frets. Hell I rarely go above the 15th fret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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