Members Marko Posted February 1, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 1, 2012 I believe that when an amp is mic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Special J Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 I can totally see why you do it, and at least you're doing right by using quality equipment. I see so many bands fail the first time out trying in-ear monitors with ill-fitting buds, cheap wireless, not enough mixes, etc. I know playing in a more controlled environment often allows you to hear yourself and your bandmates better and can really tighten things up. But as a listener and mixer, I much prefer the organic and dynamic sound of a band that can mix themselves onstage. As a player, I like the feel of pushing and pulling tones out of a nice tube amp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Grant Harding Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 I just don't get the reluctance. People are hung up on the "low stage volume" comment, when what it actually means is that everyone can hear each other in a nice balanced way. It also means that the singers don't have to to scream to hear themselves over the guitar amps and the drummer. If you're a rock band and like to feel the music you can crank the monitors to get that. There's no down side when done right, but it takes practice. A good amp simulator like an Axe-FX (or an iso cab for your tube amps) is the way to go and it's awesome to hear your guitar as part of the mix that the crowd hears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members onelife Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 I have a roomful of amps in the basement (literally). I love them. I also have a Yamaha DG1000, a PromixO1 and powered Renkus-Heinz speakers. I also love them. I'm good to go either way. It would work for me. I use a Yamaha DG80 and run the speaker emulated DI into the PA and back through the monitors. The DG80 has separate volume controls for the line out and for the speaker out so, sometimes I will just use the DI and it sounds fine. For the gig mentioned in the OP the Yamaha DG1000 would be perfect for me because it would be way easier than carrying the DG80 (55 lbs) around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 I just don't get the reluctance. People are hung up on the "low stage volume" comment, when what it actually means is that everyone can hear each other in a nice balanced way. It also means that the singers don't have to to scream to hear themselves over the guitar amps and the drummer. If you're a rock band and like to feel the music you can crank the monitors to get that. There's no down side when done right, but it takes practice. A good amp simulator like an Axe-FX (or an iso cab for your tube amps) is the way to go and it's awesome to hear your guitar as part of the mix that the crowd hears. There's a certain interaction between guitar, amp, and player that you just don't get with a modeler through a monitor. Maybe it's psychological, maybe it isn't, but even if it's psychological, it adds to the playing experience and inspires me to play better. Simple as that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members =JL= Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 There's a certain interaction between guitar, amp, and player that you just don't get with a modeler through a monitor. Maybe it's psychological, maybe it isn't, but even if it's psychological, it adds to the playing experience and inspires me to play better. Simple as that. The question isn't about modelling. If you use an analogue EQ or cab simulator it can sound fantastic, with normal guitar/speaker interaction, and none of the unnatural and unpleasant artifacts which are still present even in the best digital modelers at stage volume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 The question isn't about modelling. If you use an analogue EQ or cab simulator it can sound fantastic, with normal guitar/speaker interaction, and none of the unnatural and unpleasant artifacts which are still present even in the best digital modelers at stage volume. It's not about the sound or the artifacts. I'll be the first to admit that as a listener I have a hard time telling the difference between an amp and a modeler or a cab sim or whatever, but as a player, when I'm actually playing, there's a certain interaction between the guitar, the amp, and myself, that I just don't feel without an amp. Like I said, this could just be psychological but psychological or not, if it makes me more comfortable playing, it will reflect in my playing and the crowd will get a better show because of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cephus Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 If a guy can Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Guitzilla Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 The band that I'm starting now is going to do quieter shows in smaller venues with the drummer using an electronic kit and me using an iso cab. We are going to use acoustic drums and normal cabs for bigger shows. I'm all for it. I use a big amp normally, but I'm not cranking it. I use preamp gain and like my power section to be fairly clean. so my volume isn't unmanagable anyway. My amp is always pointing in from the side of the stage and raised to about stomach height . I've never understood having something blowing at your knees from behind. That means it is pointed at the people's heads that are sitting on the other side of the dance flooor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Marko Posted February 2, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 Seems like there are those who are happy, or at least willing to compromise a little (and I insist that it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Marko Posted February 2, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 ... My amp is always pointing in from the side of the stage and raised to about stomach height . I've never understood having something blowing at your knees from behind. That means it is pointed at the people's heads that are sitting on the other side of the dance flooor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cheezit66 Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 Provided the sound person is able to get good mix together this way, I'm still not sure I'd want to see a live band that sounded like a home stereo system. Lotta folks have noted that the mix makes or breaks the live gig, loud amps or not. So treat the sound guy like a king. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cephus Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 Seems like there are those who are happy, or at least willing to compromise a little (and I insist that it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sammyreynolds01 Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 Your moronic generalization of modelers is laughable. Seems like to me you have neither taken the time trying and use them effectively or you're simply an old geezer that yells at kids to get of your porch. Seems like you have played some {censored} modelers (old Line 6 stuff or Johnson amps) and generalizing that they are all {censored}. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 Seems like there are those who are happy, or at least willing to compromise a little (and I insist that it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 I am with OP in a lot of ways. When you play a gig, you can go in thinking I am ze artiste, poo poo the audience, or you can go in thinking, I'm gonna put on a good show for the audience. It's one thing if you're a band with highly original and interesting material but if it's a cover gig and you're trying to get paid, get over yourself, you're not ze artiste zat anybody gives two {censored}s about. Just put on a good show, give the kids a good time, collect the check, and go home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members LesPaulFetish Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 I'd be more than happy with an Axe-FX and some good monitors. Sooo {censored}ing happy. I find most metal bands, especially with multiple guitarists tend to sound bad cause there's so much {censored} going on. And loud. Very loud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 I'd be more than happy with an Axe-FX and some good monitors. Sooo {censored}ing happy. I find most metal bands, especially with multiple guitarists tend to sound bad cause there's so much {censored} going on. And loud. Very loud. Again, folks, low wattage amps solve all of those problem. And believe it or not, sometimes it IS about being ze artiste. There are a gazillon bands out there playing mustang sally. If you want repeat gigs, you better find a way to be a little creative and give them something different than what other bands do. I may be nothing more than a bar band hack, but I do take pride in my playing and I do want the crowd to enjoy what I do. If I have a rig that works with me rather than something I have to settle for and just make the requisite noises through, that will reflect in my playing and in my attitude on stage. Like I said, I don't need a wall of stacks. As a matter of fact, out of all of the amps in my current gig rotation, the highest output ones I have are a whopping 30 watts. And I rarely use that one because even I realize that for some venues it's just too loud, which is why I stick with the 13 and 15 watters. On the other hand, I realize perfectly that there are others who are just as happy playing a modeler directly through the board. Nothing at all wrong with that. But if that's the requirement for the band, I think you're eliminating a big part of the talent pool that might be perfectly happy playing through 5 watt amps at stage level and running a line or mic to the board and using that for the FOH mix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 I think if you have a low watt amp w/ a closed cab but point it toward the stage and away from the audience, it pretty much accomplishes the same things, but even a 12 watt amp cranked is enough to make the guitar drown out other sounds in the front. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 I think if you have a low watt amp w/ a closed cab but point it toward the stage and away from the audience, it pretty much accomplishes the same things, but even a 12 watt amp cranked is enough to make the guitar drown out other sounds in the front. 5 watt amp FTW! Take your pic of probably close to a dozen or more amps that are either 5 watt or have a built in power scaler and can be set at 5 watts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Marko Posted February 2, 2012 Author Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 To be clear, it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman3001 Posted February 2, 2012 Members Share Posted February 2, 2012 To be clear, it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cephus Posted February 3, 2012 Members Share Posted February 3, 2012 Your moronic generalization of modelers is laughable. I agree. What is a good one? I have no idea what kind i used because they belonged to other guys and I just wasnt able to dial up a good sound. Just said "get rid of all that fuzz and reverb and we'll start from there". I did ask. What kind of music do you play that you can use one? What is your tone like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sammyreynolds01 Posted February 3, 2012 Members Share Posted February 3, 2012 I play classic rock, country and metal. The Axe-FX is a great and the Eleven is a good one. When it comes to modelers you get what you pay for. If it's cheap then it will sound cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cephus Posted February 3, 2012 Members Share Posted February 3, 2012 I play classic rock, country and metal. The Axe-FX is a great and the Eleven is a good one. When it comes to modelers you get what you pay for. If it's cheap then it will sound cheap. I kinda figured that was where you were coming from. I have never met any working musician who would throw down that kind of money on one. I'll just be honest. I had heard someone play a rote version of some zeppelin guitar solo through one of those and it was spot on. The capacity would be hugely wasted on me. BTW, how is that $150 G-DEC working out for you that you got for Christmas? Anyone else have good results with less expensive units? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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